• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

Gorgeous-Kévin Nkoudou

indianspur said:
And he has already been pictured with Wanyama in the gym

But not featured in any games afaik
Click to expand...

Could see Hugo, Toby, Dier, Eriksen, Lamela, Kane getting very little preseason time. Known quanitities, will play the vast majority of games, no need for early start.
 
camspur said:
They may be predictable but an algorithm still can't say who does or doesn't perform in training on any given day and it would require massive reprogramming every time.

Lamela last season was not the Lamela of the season before did the algorithm predict that?
Click to expand...

It probably predicted that he had the potential to come good, yes.
 
Raziel said:
Could see Hugo, Toby, Dier, Eriksen, Lamela, Kane getting very little preseason time. Known quanitities, will play the vast majority of games, no need for early start.
Click to expand...
Eriksen maybe a known quantity but he hasn't played football since May and Poch would surely want him match sharp for the opening day.
 
indianspur said:
Eriksen maybe a known quantity but he hasn't played football since May and Poch would surely want him match sharp for the opening day.
Click to expand...

Possibly, but more likely fringe player will get the vast majority of preseason.

Remember you want players to peak later in season, while match fit sounds good, for core players, I'm sure Poch will be good with fit, knowing roles and fully rested more than anything else.
 
Gutter Boy said:
I think Lamela, Eriksen and Son are our guaranteed WFs, with either this guy or Njie going to be the 4th. I think Chadli and probably Pritchard are finding their next clubs at the moment.
Click to expand...

If Eriksen does not sign a new contract there will be nothing guaranteed, Levy will expect him to sign or may well be sold. He has just 2 years left on his contract, the same for Lamela.
 
Not sure about the thinking behind this one if it means N'jie is off. Seems like similar players, only N'jie has a season here under his belt and must've settled somewhat. We'll see though, maybe he's the next Payet. :p
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
I'd love to see the stats of that if you can find your post, because I am pretty confident that for every successful "big" transfer, I would be able to find a very unsuccessful "big" transfer. Same can be said for any transfer. Re your point on spending big being more of a guarantor of success I just think is wrong. It's effective scouting that will be the difference and getting a player to fit your system, not the price you pay that will be the biggest determinant of whether a player will be successful. There is no causal link between performance and the amount paid on transfer. A huge transfer fee could have just as much of a negative impact on the player.

Also, let's just for a minute assume that there is that causal link. Having a 1 in 3 chance of failing on a big transfer is just something we cannot afford. If "big" is £30m+ signings, then I don't think that we are able to afford to write off £30m for every 3 players we buy. It would be madness.

As for the player Georges, I have no idea as to what type of player he is. However, I have faith that Poch and his team know what they are doing. That is based on the transfers that they have made already. I also have faith in that when they choose to let a player go, it is for good reason. So if they have decided that Clinton is not good enough, then I trust their judgement. Perhaps Clinton is just not settling in and so we are prepared to let him go, despite the player that he could be. It does seem worrying that the write up mentions a poor first touch, but I think there needs to be a bit more context. Our team is quite technical, and at times players like Clinton and Chadli have shown poor first touches themselves. I guess what I am saying here is that I am not going to let one write up of a player by some faceless person on the internet outweigh my faith in Poch and his scouting team.
Click to expand...

IIRC (it was, as I said, a while ago), I basically looked over a list of the most expensive transfers in football and calculated whether or not that player turned out to be a success. This one, iirc - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_association_football_transfers

From a brief examination, most of the players on that list were individual successes for their clubs - the few failures like Benteke and Veron were the ones I factored into the '1 in 3' assertion, and I had to mark a lot of players that I was ambivalent about or didn't know enough of as 'failures' to even reach that figure. Still, I figured that made an *extremely* unscientific examination a bit more rigorous. :p

There's no doubt that a good scouting process aids in finding the right players, but it's harder to quantify - an objectively 'good' scouting system is hard to accurately describe, and varies with the times. Hence, the assertion, which is based on a bit of common sense, really - if a rich or successful team likes a player enough to get him into that list of most expensive players of all time, there's a good chance that a) he has qualities similar to those of the rich/successful club's already existing, talented players, and b) that the club's commensurately expensive and no doubt well-supplied scouting network will have marked him as one worth paying for.

As for us being able to afford big signings, we probably could, we just choose not to. In an environment where Crystal Palace can afford to offer 30 million pounds for Christian Benteke, Spurs not being able to afford a similar commitment is something hard to believe. We want to spend the TV money on the stadium, and we want to keep the balance sheets looking good - while my populist 'the owners aren't spending anything but the fans' own money' views still stand, there's nothing innately wrong with prioritising those things over spending in the market. But we are doing that, no doubt about it.

And as for N'Koudou, like I said, it's just a confusing signing given that N'Jie had an extremely similar profile when he was signed last year, and I thought the new mantra was to give signings like him time instead of shipping them off. Plus, if we did consider him worth replacing, it is a bit strange that we go for someone exactly like him, with a similar profile and from the same league for much the same price - creates the question of whether we want to upgrade on him or if we just want another N'Jie-type player around for a while.

Either way, the transfer is just something to be confused by, as far as I'm concerned. If it had been in a problem position, then it would have been a concern - but we're stacked in attacking midfield, and trading N'Jie for N'Koudou, or adding N'Koudou to the side as a whole, isn't overly disruptive or distracting from key areas. That's a luxury we now have thanks to the primary areas of concern being addressed by Wanyama and (after a frustrating delay ;) ) Janssen.
 
I refuse to accept this move as even close to substantial till a 50 page dossier by Gutter Boy awaits us. Till then even official confirmation won't fool me.
 
My mate who lives in France says this guy is like sterling. Doesn't actually rate either. Had 3 good months for his club. He is similar to njie
 
DubaiSpur said:
IIRC (it was, as I said, a while ago), I basically looked over a list of the most expensive transfers in football and calculated whether or not that player turned out to be a success. This one, iirc - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_association_football_transfers

From a brief examination, most of the players on that list were individual successes for their clubs - the few failures like Benteke and Veron were the ones I factored into the '1 in 3' assertion, and I had to mark a lot of players that I was ambivalent about or didn't know enough of as 'failures' to even reach that figure. Still, I figured that made an *extremely* unscientific examination a bit more rigorous. :p

There's no doubt that a good scouting process aids in finding the right players, but it's harder to quantify - an objectively 'good' scouting system is hard to accurately describe, and varies with the times. Hence, the assertion, which is based on a bit of common sense, really - if a rich or successful team likes a player enough to get him into that list of most expensive players of all time, there's a good chance that a) he has qualities similar to those of the rich/successful club's already existing, talented players, and b) that the club's commensurately expensive and no doubt well-supplied scouting network will have marked him as one worth paying for.

As for us being able to afford big signings, we probably could, we just choose not to. In an environment where Crystal Palace can afford to offer 30 million pounds for Christian Benteke, Spurs not being able to afford a similar commitment is something hard to believe. We want to spend the TV money on the stadium, and we want to keep the balance sheets looking good - while my populist 'the owners aren't spending anything but the fans' own money' views still stand, there's nothing innately wrong with prioritising those things over spending in the market. But we are doing that, no doubt about it.

And as for N'Koudou, like I said, it's just a confusing signing given that N'Jie had an extremely similar profile when he was signed last year, and I thought the new mantra was to give signings like him time instead of shipping them off. Plus, if we did consider him worth replacing, it is a bit strange that we go for someone exactly like him, with a similar profile and from the same league for much the same price - creates the question of whether we want to upgrade on him or if we just want another N'Jie-type player around for a while.

Either way, the transfer is just something to be confused by, as far as I'm concerned. If it had been in a problem position, then it would have been a concern - but we're stacked in attacking midfield, and trading N'Jie for N'Koudou, or adding N'Koudou to the side as a whole, isn't overly disruptive or distracting from key areas. That's a luxury we now have thanks to the primary areas of concern being addressed by Wanyama and (after a frustrating delay ;) ) Janssen.
Click to expand...

There's so much I disagree with that I don't know where to start!!

There are more than a few failures on that list and I guess one question to ask is if you expect more from a player if they cost more. If you do, and you still regard that only a few of those signings are "failures" then I guess we are going to have to agree to disagree. If you don't, then I think you should. Defining success is quite difficult. Is Sterling a qualified success at Emirates Marketing Project, when you compare him to some other players who have cost less yet and have delivered more. Same for De Bruyne. At what point do you measure this success over? So take a Martial for example. What are the expectations versus say a Jermain Defoe?

Then on the affordability point, look at the list you have just linked to and see how many comparable clubs there are to us in the buying column. Liverpool is the closest and even then they have a far greater turnover to us and also wage bill. When you look at Liverpool's purchases (Benteke and Mane), I think we can safely say that one of those is a "failure" but could turn it around and the other I think was widely recognised on here as being overpriced. Hardly an indicator of success. 50% failure rate

Take Monaco and the players they have gone for are Falcao and Rodriguez, only one of whom can be deemed a success. 50% failure rate

Emirates Marketing Project - De Bruyne, Sterling, Tevez, Aguero, Robinho. - Is that 2 failures, 1 undecided and 2 successes? Is Tevez deemed a success (I have in my estimation) bearing in mind his antics and the fact they were desperate to offload him? 40% failure rate

Man United - Di Maria, Martial, Ferdinand, Mata, Veron - Is that 2 fallures, 2 undecided and 1 success? Martial 11 goals in 31 appearances. Mata 10 or so goals a season. Failure rate stays the same regardless i.e. 40%.

What is apparent is that the Real Madrid's, Barcelona's and PSG's of this world skew your results and actually you get no more than a 50% success rate. Hardly endorsing of a high risk strategy.

I think given the number of players we are looking to buy, the fact that we have been planning to build a stadium for the best part of 10 years, have built a training ground for not an inconsiderable sum of money

As for Crystal Palace being able to afford the big signings, I think you have to wait before they make one before really commenting. We did after all place a bid for Aguero! Even if they do, is it worth shifting our transfer strategy to making one of these a season and a couple of other cheaper?

Going back to topic, the more I think about this transfer, the more sense it makes. We're adding depth and it is a relatively inexpensive punt. If our management team are prepared to make that and utilise their budget in that way, then it works for me.
 
Georgey was the 30th best player in Europe last season according to UEFA
 
Personally I think Poch is addressing needs

What did we need last season -> backup for Kane, backup for Dier = done
What did we lack as option -> width/pace/something different on bench = GKN?

In today's market, 11M is the new 5M punt, the tv revenue means we can probably hold on to N'Jie, Son, Mason & GKN for a season to truly figure out which one is long term material.

If N'Jie leaves this window, then its obvious Poch has made a call based on what he has/hasn't seen in training and/or player is unsettled in country.
 
Daisuk said:
Not sure about the thinking behind this one if it means N'jie is off. Seems like similar players, only N'jie has a season here under his belt and must've settled somewhat. We'll see though, maybe he's the next Payet. :p
Click to expand...

I don't have too many concerns because this signing is being done in July - this means we are not pushed for time and there must have been extensive meetings in which it was clearly agreed this type of player is needed.

Remember njie was done towards the end of the window when we were starting to realise berahino probably wouldn't happen.

Always thought there might have been a sense of panick buying with njie whereas the timing of this potential signing I find reassuring.
 
AjaxDeSuperYids said:
I don't have too many concerns because this signing is being done in July - this means we are not pushed for time and there must have been extensive meetings in which it was clearly agreed this type of player is needed.

Remember njie was done towards the end of the window when we were starting to realise berahino probably wouldn't happen.

Always thought there might have been a sense of panick buying with njie whereas the timing of this potential signing I find reassuring.
Click to expand...

I'm sure N'Jie joined just after the sart of the season and before our second game vs Stoke; I don't think it was a panic buy at all and if anything Lyon's Director was dragging things out a bit.
I think both can be classed in the same bracket in terms of the sense of whether they are 'panic buys'. To me, neither are/were
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back