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Coronavirus

ricky2tricky4city said:
It probably doesn't take many delays along the ch.ain of track and trace (test, contact list, phone calls, contacts tested, results) to render the system far to retrospective to be of any use.

Plus how many on here have downloaded the NHS app? If you haven't (I'm not judging you) then simply, you've really forfeited your right to moan about it.
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I downloaded it and moaned about it

I know there are those that moaned about the delay till the cows came home and then decided they would not download it, go figure that one out
 
SpurMeUp said:
Normal government service - people recognised a need to act swiftly around a month ago. Government did nothing dithered. On here we were talking about how each day counts when infection growth is exponential. Now we’ll have a worse lockdown. Boris seriously screwing the economy.

They can’t even deliver a press conference on time.

Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
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Any decent government would delay to weigh up the collateral damage of lockdowns ours delayed and caused more damage to all avenues of consideration.
 
ricky2tricky4city said:
It probably doesn't take many delays along the ch.ain of track and trace (test, contact list, phone calls, contacts tested, results) to render the system far to retrospective to be of any use.
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That's a good point.

In countries where it seems to have "worked", mostly China, East Asia etc. the whole thing is automated (and also a legal requirement to take part in). If your app detects you've been near a positive case then it turns on GPS tracking to check you stay home.

Pretty extreme, but less loopholes. Not sure we can really do that here though.
 
elyid said:
Yeah while it's optional it would never work.

People say we should copy Taiwans track-and-trace, but pretty sure their's is a legal requirement that everyone must sign up and you get an instant fine if your phone leaves your house when you are meant to quarantine.

Big difference.
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Not strictly track and trace but a work contact was telling me about his son who lives in Taiwan. He had been out of the country, had to quarantine upon return, and the police turned up every day (and could do so more than once) to check that he was at home. If he wasn't, there was a significant fine (can't recall how much, but certainly more than a couple of hundred quid). That level of checking just wouldn't be possible over here, we wouldn't have the resources to dedicate to it.
 
Glenda's Legs said:
That level of checking just wouldn't be possible over here, we wouldn't have the resources to dedicate to it.
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That's impressive though really, just looked and they have a pop. of 23 million.

In the long run it's good we have more freedoms. However, in countries like Taiwan, China, Singapore etc. people don't dare question the police (as the consequence can be very severe) which does help in enforcing stuff like this.
 
elyid said:
That's a good point

In countries where it seems to have "worked", mostly China, East Asia etc. the whole thing is automated (and also a legal requirement to take part in). If your app detects you've been near a positive case then it turns on GPS tracking to check you stay home.

Pretty extreme, but less loopholes. Not sure we can really do that here though.
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It seems to have worked in countries where they embraced lockdown earlier right?

Germany were meant to have had a good one but it has not worked there as it was meant to keep them out of lockdown. I am judging them based on their own expectations BTW
 
elyid said:
That's a good point.

In countries where it seems to have "worked", mostly China, East Asia etc. the whole thing is automated (and also a legal requirement to take part in). If your app detects you've been near a positive case then it turns on GPS tracking to check you stay home.

Pretty extreme, but less loopholes. Not sure we can really do that here though.
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And it wouldn't surprise me that it takes that level of implementation to make it work.
 
Glenda's Legs said:
Not strictly track and trace but a work contact was telling me about his son who lives in Taiwan. He had been out of the country, had to quarantine upon return, and the police turned up every day (and could do so more than once) to check that he was at home. If he wasn't, there was a significant fine (can't recall how much, but certainly more than a couple of hundred quid). That level of checking just wouldn't be possible over here, we wouldn't have the resources to dedicate to it.
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This lot are going to be two and a half hours late for a press conference they called. Tells everything anyone needs to know about their ability to organise.
 
Glenda's Legs said:
Not strictly track and trace but a work contact was telling me about his son who lives in Taiwan. He had been out of the country, had to quarantine upon return, and the police turned up every day (and could do so more than once) to check that he was at home. If he wasn't, there was a significant fine (can't recall how much, but certainly more than a couple of hundred quid). That level of checking just wouldn't be possible over here, we wouldn't have the resources to dedicate to it.
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With the month lockdown imminent, some of the experts are saying we need to get an effective track and trace system sorted in that 4 week window.

It just won't happen, that's not defeatist, it's realism. Regardless of the government s ability (lack of) to get the right people involved, you need a lot of momentum from the public, and that just won't happen.

I suppose it's much like football managers, some you'll run thru walls for, some you just think they're a bit of a d.ick.
 
If you look back to the last nationwide lockdown in March, April and May, it did bring the death rate right down and it brought hospital admissions down. That was the main purpose of it, particularly to secure the NHS.

People will argue that it succeeded in those aims, but there was a lot of work cancelled by the NHS. A lot of people had illnesses and conditions which weren't treated, they missed operations and procedures.

The aim right now is to suppress the virus - to bring it down to levels where the test and trace system can work a lot better.

At the moment, it's struggling with keeping up with the case numbers and the rate at which they're growing.

The idea is to bring it down and then see if test and trace can do more after November, when the hope is that lockdown can be eased.

Until a vaccine comes along - and there have been mixed messages on that, but it seems clear no one in authority wants us to expect it before the early months of next year - the virus will always be here
 
markysimmo said:
If you look back to the last nationwide lockdown in March, April and May, it did bring the death rate right down and it bought hospital admissions down. That was the main purpose of it, particularly to secure the NHS.

People will argue that it succeeded in those aims, but there was a lot of work cancelled by the NHS. A lot of people had illnesses and conditions which weren't treated, they missed operations and procedures.

The aim right now is to suppress the virus - to bring it down to levels where the test and trace system can work a lot better.

At the moment, it's struggling with keeping up with the case numbers and the rate at which they're growing.

The idea is to bring it down and then see if test and trace can do more after November, when the hope is that lockdown can be eased.

Until a vaccine comes along - and there have been mixed messages on that, but it seems clear no one in authority wants us to expect it before the early months of next year - the virus will always be here
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Where'd you copy this from?
 
scaramanga said:
Criticises government for releasing unclear information.

Criticises government for taking time to get a press conference they've been forced into correct.

If it smells like political partisanship and looks like political partisanship......
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Not sure how anyone can defend the government's handling of this situation? These delays reek of continued incompetence.
 
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nayenezgani said:
Not sure how anyone can defend the government's handling of this situation? These delays reek or continued incompetence.
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I'm not.

As I pointed out earlier in the thread, I'll remain restrained in my criticism as the only alternative for govt in this country have publicly stated they'd have fudged things up far worse.
 
markysimmo said:
If you look back to the last nationwide lockdown in March, April and May, it did bring the death rate right down and it bought hospital admissions down. That was the main purpose of it, particularly to secure the NHS.

People will argue that it succeeded in those aims, but there was a lot of work cancelled by the NHS. A lot of people had illnesses and conditions which weren't treated, they missed operations and procedures.

The aim right now is to suppress the virus - to bring it down to levels where the test and trace system can work a lot better.

At the moment, it's struggling with keeping up with the case numbers and the rate at which they're growing.

The idea is to bring it down and then see if test and trace can do more after November, when the hope is that lockdown can be eased.

Until a vaccine comes along - and there have been mixed messages on that, but it seems clear no one in authority wants us to expect it before the early months of next year - the virus will always be here
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The problem is like I said before and got ridiculed for we are all in on Coronavirus like its black on the roulette table but regardless of the intentions of lockdown other illness is not being treated, the NHS was freed up to deal with Covid. The stats on the 18 week waiting list which was at 200k in Jan is now at 2.5m, the backlog on screening for other illness is list longer than the cast of Zulu and that is before you get to any financial implications. I am happy to back a lockdown but not if we continue to act like its the only crisis on the table.
 
scaramanga said:
Criticises government for releasing unclear information.

Criticises government for taking time to get a press conference they've been forced into correct.

If it smells like political partisanship and looks like political partisanship......
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hopefully they have used the delay to sack all of sage.

the leaks are clearly from them.
 
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