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Tim Sherwood…gone \o/
- Thread starter Gutter Boy
- Start date
Rossi22
Pedro Mendes
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
It's not one game though is it? It's 20 and it's being compared to the 20 games played by all of the other PL sides in the same time period.
It's not one game though is it? It's 20 and it's being compared to the 20 games played by all of the other PL sides in the same time period.
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
using the same 20 game period last season and again for the season prior would have meant we'd have been looking at AVB and Redknapp as Champions elect and mid table also rans respectively - rarely do these small sample sizes give a true reflection of the greater picture.
especially for a new guy coming in mid way through a season as you can point to many factors which see an initial upturn in results. in Sherwoods case it was a releasing of the shackles of the previous manager and re introducing a marginalized striker who had a point to prove etc you'd be very naive to base any serious thought on such circumstances without taking such things in to account.
using the same 20 game period last season and again for the season prior would have meant we'd have been looking at AVB and Redknapp as Champions elect and mid table also rans respectively - rarely do these small sample sizes give a true reflection of the greater picture.
especially for a new guy coming in mid way through a season as you can point to many factors which see an initial upturn in results. in Sherwoods case it was a releasing of the shackles of the previous manager and re introducing a marginalized striker who had a point to prove etc you'd be very naive to base any serious thought on such circumstances without taking such things in to account.
Armchair Expert
Vedran Corluka
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Quite. Sherwood is also operating with a different squad of players, with a different wages budget, in a different era to say, Gerry Francis or George Graham.
The amount of variables is just too immense to give these stats even an ounce of credibility.
Would Sherwood have the best % of all Tottenham managers in the universe ever if he was managing the likes of Ruel Fox, Gary Doherty and Stuart Nethercott? I think not. Comparisons to last seasons results are also meaningless: the premier league has changed, players have moved clubs and it consists of different teams.
The stats that are relevant to any Tim Sherwood argument, are progressive, cumulative stats compiled throughout his own reign at Spurs; and these will only serve to illuminate trends of his tenureship. Even then they don't account for days like yesterday, where one of the most inept managerial performances you are likely to see hampered our efforts.
Hence, I base (and always will) my opinion on what I see on the pitch. Otherwise, based on a sample of yesterday's game like Scara says - all we have to do is cross from the right, get Rose in the box, and we'll have the deadliest left back to ever have played the game. Every time Ade crosses to Rose when he is isolated with his marker we score. If we can do that 4 or 5 times every game we'll win the league.
We should base our whole attacking philosophy around Ade cross to Rose.
Quite. Sherwood is also operating with a different squad of players, with a different wages budget, in a different era to say, Gerry Francis or George Graham.
The amount of variables is just too immense to give these stats even an ounce of credibility.
Would Sherwood have the best % of all Tottenham managers in the universe ever if he was managing the likes of Ruel Fox, Gary Doherty and Stuart Nethercott? I think not. Comparisons to last seasons results are also meaningless: the premier league has changed, players have moved clubs and it consists of different teams.
The stats that are relevant to any Tim Sherwood argument, are progressive, cumulative stats compiled throughout his own reign at Spurs; and these will only serve to illuminate trends of his tenureship. Even then they don't account for days like yesterday, where one of the most inept managerial performances you are likely to see hampered our efforts.
Hence, I base (and always will) my opinion on what I see on the pitch. Otherwise, based on a sample of yesterday's game like Scara says - all we have to do is cross from the right, get Rose in the box, and we'll have the deadliest left back to ever have played the game. Every time Ade crosses to Rose when he is isolated with his marker we score. If we can do that 4 or 5 times every game we'll win the league.
We should base our whole attacking philosophy around Ade cross to Rose.
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Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Well arguably Tim having come in half way through a season hasn't had settled team just as avb didn't this season.
So how about Avbs record without the third best player in world vs sherwood a without the third best player in the world?
Well arguably Tim having come in half way through a season hasn't had settled team just as avb didn't this season.
So how about Avbs record without the third best player in world vs sherwood a without the third best player in the world?
Maltese Falcon
Niko Kranjcar
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Somewhere around the 40th minute of the first half, I actually - honestly - asked myself whether my criticism of Sherwood was OTT; his selections were not my cup of tea but, hey, we were winning at Stoke (a team bang in form) and we were actually dominating the game (even though we weren't exactly leaving Begovic breathless). Boy did I lose that uncertainty by the end! It's not that Stoke dominated us with 10 men but the fact that his attempts at correcting it were totally ineffective. Siggy for Chadli?? What was that about? I can guess where he was coming from: "let me send in a goal scoring midfielder to get the second goal that will kill the game" when the problem was that we had relinquished midfield and needed a passer (Bentaleb) to try to wrestle the control back. Then Townsend for Lennon - again WTF? Even if Lennon was not particularly effective his covering is eons better than Townsend's...
Somewhere around the 40th minute of the first half, I actually - honestly - asked myself whether my criticism of Sherwood was OTT; his selections were not my cup of tea but, hey, we were winning at Stoke (a team bang in form) and we were actually dominating the game (even though we weren't exactly leaving Begovic breathless). Boy did I lose that uncertainty by the end! It's not that Stoke dominated us with 10 men but the fact that his attempts at correcting it were totally ineffective. Siggy for Chadli?? What was that about? I can guess where he was coming from: "let me send in a goal scoring midfielder to get the second goal that will kill the game" when the problem was that we had relinquished midfield and needed a passer (Bentaleb) to try to wrestle the control back. Then Townsend for Lennon - again WTF? Even if Lennon was not particularly effective his covering is eons better than Townsend's...
THFC6061
Paul Robinson
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Sherwood would still win it by a country mile.
And then some.
Sherwood would still win it by a country mile.
And then some.
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Yeah sure, I think Sherwood comes out on top of that list, stato to check?
Yeah sure, I think Sherwood comes out on top of that list, stato to check?
Maltese Falcon
Niko Kranjcar
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Lies, damned lies and statistics...
Sampling size is the most important attribute in achieving a statistically significant end point and Sherwood has not been in charge for enough games to make proper analyses.
Lies, damned lies and statistics...
Sampling size is the most important attribute in achieving a statistically significant end point and Sherwood has not been in charge for enough games to make proper analyses.
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
let's see the stats then Statto
no doubt he would have as he has taken over from a better starting position - but it'd be interesting to see what each of those 3 managers ppg was over their first 20 games V the rest of their times at the club. would go someway to prove that the first 20 games in charge is a fairly poor sample size to make any kind of accurate judgment.
seeings as you're someone who lives by his stats i guess that makes Sherwood our greatest ever manager?
let's see the stats then Statto
no doubt he would have as he has taken over from a better starting position - but it'd be interesting to see what each of those 3 managers ppg was over their first 20 games V the rest of their times at the club. would go someway to prove that the first 20 games in charge is a fairly poor sample size to make any kind of accurate judgment.
seeings as you're someone who lives by his stats i guess that makes Sherwood our greatest ever manager?
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
I agree that sample size is to small, but at what stage does it not become to small?
I agree that sample size is to small, but at what stage does it not become to small?
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
I agree that would be interesting
let's see the stats then Statto
no doubt he would have as he has taken over from a better starting position - but it'd be interesting to see what each of those 3 managers ppg was over their first 20 games V the rest of their times at the club
I agree that would be interesting
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Ok then let's give Tim a full season and then see
Ok then let's give Tim a full season and then see
Rossi22
Pedro Mendes
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
How about Tony Pulis then? He's been in charge of Palace for 23 games(three more than Sherwood), does he deserve no credit for what he's done at Palace then? Too small a sample size? There's nothing to say Holloway wouldn't have done the same or better? When does the sample size become relevant? Also when did AVB's unsettled team become settled? Let me guess, right after he was sacked?
Look, I don't want Tim next season either but you lot are funny, you staunchly defend your side of the argument and will reject anything thrown at you. Are there any reasonably objective posters on here? Are there any others on here like me who don't want Tim for various reasons but at the same time can give him credit for him statistically having us as the 4th best side since he took over? Why does being against Sherwood mean we have to be pro AVB? Can't we see the good and bad in both? No, ok, carry on then.
How about Tony Pulis then? He's been in charge of Palace for 23 games(three more than Sherwood), does he deserve no credit for what he's done at Palace then? Too small a sample size? There's nothing to say Holloway wouldn't have done the same or better? When does the sample size become relevant? Also when did AVB's unsettled team become settled? Let me guess, right after he was sacked?
Look, I don't want Tim next season either but you lot are funny, you staunchly defend your side of the argument and will reject anything thrown at you. Are there any reasonably objective posters on here? Are there any others on here like me who don't want Tim for various reasons but at the same time can give him credit for him statistically having us as the 4th best side since he took over? Why does being against Sherwood mean we have to be pro AVB? Can't we see the good and bad in both? No, ok, carry on then.
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
Pulis can be regarded as good/excellent at what he does because he's done it before. All he's doing at Palace is continuing the same excellent (evil) work he was doing at Stoke.
You can't say that for Timmeh unless you know how good the tea he made Levy was and how neat the paperwork on the loans to Swindon deals were.
Pulis can be regarded as good/excellent at what he does because he's done it before. All he's doing at Palace is continuing the same excellent (evil) work he was doing at Stoke.
You can't say that for Timmeh unless you know how good the tea he made Levy was and how neat the paperwork on the loans to Swindon deals were.
Re: Do you want Tim Sherwood to stay as manager?
asides from a select few i think most people think his ppg at Spurs is very good, the debate as far as i see it isn't 'has he done well here?' - it's 'is he good enough to get the job going in to next season?' - and to answer that question you have to look way beyond a 20 game ppg stat
asides from a select few i think most people think his ppg at Spurs is very good, the debate as far as i see it isn't 'has he done well here?' - it's 'is he good enough to get the job going in to next season?' - and to answer that question you have to look way beyond a 20 game ppg stat