QPR ratings

[jimmyb]

1)there was definite contact which brought him down for the incident in which the QPR fans boo'd him - iirc it wasn't particularly worthy of a free kick though

2)he tripped over his own feet

Re 2).........no contact with Fabio at all?

 

[Rossi22]

We never got round the back once. Nor did we even try. Did Lennon run at this full back? Did Bale? When did Walker or Naughton get to the bye line? When did Parker or Dembele run past the forwards?

Did we put in a single cross all game?

We couldn't get around the back because they parked themselves on top of Cesar. Lennon and Bale couldn't run at the full back because they were already so deep to begin with and not to mention they doubled up on both sides. I do agree that we didn't put many crosses in, but you can contrast that by saying we put hundreds in against Stoke and none of them came to anything as Defoe and Ade juyst don't attack them enough.

This is how QPR lined up for most of the game

It REALLY isn't easy trying to break that down. As said countless times before, our game is built on pace and power, those two facets become worthless when the space is taken away. There's very little craft/guile/brains in this team to get through these games, you can't just keep blaming AVB for it, he doesn't have those players at his disposal - the only two we had were sold.

 

[billyiddo]

Re 2).........no contact with Fabio at all?

i think initially Fabio leaned on him maybe or something outside the area but that isn't what brought Lennon down, he tripped up a couple of strides after

 

[Pirate55]

You can't get round the back if they defend as deep as they did.

Lennon and bale were doubled up on whenever they got the ball so didn't get the opportunity to run at their full backs.

Walker and Naughton didn't get to the bye line, but Naughton is right footed so that would be a silly thing for him to do and Walker sucks at crossing so has likely been told not to do it.

More pressing i thought was the question of why Defoe was coming so deep all the time. You can handle one striker who wanders, but when the second also wanders then you don't have anyone left in the box and the threat you pose is minimal. One of them should stay in the box.

Thats just nonsense. Most teams stay deep against the top teams. Doesnt stop them getting round the back and winning almost all these type of games.

We have two of the best wingers in the PL and yet we cant seem to do it.

 

[braineclipse]

AVB has (rightly) got the credit when we have been on our recent winning run - even winning the cursed Manager of the Month award.

Why are you (and others) not prepared to allow any legitimate criticism of him at all when he patently gets it wrong. Today, Wigan, Norwich, West Brom to name just a few examples.

To play Ade today ahead of Dempsey was just stupid imo. Major error of judgement.

Just because you think it's legitimate criticism doesn't mean that everyone else has to think the same. The fact that you think something is obvious doesn't mean that everyone else must think it's so, nor does it make it right.

It's not that people aren't allowing criticism, it's that people are disagreeing. If Scara or the mods started deleting your posts then it would be a case of not allowing criticism.

 

[jimmyb]

AVB has (rightly) got the credit when we have been on our recent winning run - even winning the cursed Manager of the Month award.

Why are you (and others) not prepared to allow any legitimate criticism of him at all when he patently gets it wrong. Today, Wigan, Norwich, West Brom to name just a few examples.

To play Ade today ahead of Dempsey was just stupid imo. Major error of judgement.

Without having read anything else in this discussion, has allowance been made for the fact that QPR defended en masse and very well today? Sometimes, credit just has to be given to the other team. QPR got what they wanted from the game. They were thrilled at the final whistle. They had little interest in going forward - in the second half, at least. They had a plan and they stuck to it well. Denied our dangerous players space on what is already a very tight pitch and worked their gonad*s off.

We didn't play well because QPR didn't allow us to play well. Sometimes, that just happens. Even to the very best teams.

 

[jimmyb]

i think initially Fabio leaned on him maybe or something outside the area but that isn't what brought Lennon down, he tripped up a couple of strides after

Cheers.

 

[braineclipse]

Without having read anything else in this discussion, has allowance been made for the fact that QPR defended en masse and very well today? Sometimes, credit just has to be given to the other team. QPR got what they wanted from the game. They were thrilled at the final whistle. They had little interest in going forward - in the second half, at least. They had a plan and they stuck to it well. Denied our dangerous players space on what is already a very tight pitch and worked their gonad*s off.

We didn't play well because QPR didn't allow us to play well. Sometimes, that just happens. Even to the very best teams.

Most people have made allowance for that I think. Not all though.

I don't think most people expected us to just go out and beat QPR without resistance today, especially after they beat Chelsea at the bridge and drew against a pretty good WBA side in the cup.

 

[Pirate55]

We couldn't get around the back because they parked themselves on top of Cesar. Lennon and Bale couldn't run at the full back because they were already so deep to begin with and not to mention they doubled up on both sides. I do agree that we didn't put many crosses in, but you can contrast that by saying we put hundreds in against Stoke and none of them came to anything as Defoe and Ade juyst don't attack them enough.

This is how QPR lined up for most of the game

It REALLY isn't easy trying to break that down. As said countless times before, our game is built on pace and power, those two facets become worthless when the space is taken away. There's very little craft/guile/brains in this team to get through these games, you can't just keep blaming AVB for it, he doesn't have those players at his disposal - the only two we had were sold.

I am not saying it is easy. I am saying we dont even try. Lennon and Bale had the ball at their feet quite a few times in wide positions but failed to even attempt to take their man on. When they drift inside, they take their doubled up markers with them, thus giving plenty of space for Naughton and Walker to overlap. I didnt see this once today.

 

[Rossi22]

AVB has (rightly) got the credit when we have been on our recent winning run - even winning the cursed Manager of the Month award.

Why are you (and others) not prepared to allow any legitimate criticism of him at all when he patently gets it wrong. Today, Wigan, Norwich, West Brom to name just a few examples.

To play Ade today ahead of Dempsey was just stupid imo. Major error of judgement.

I don't have a problem with you criticising him, I just feel that you play the tactics card with no real thought behind it. You see us fail to break a team down and shout tactics. It's like whenever we lost earlier during the season people would reel off the old "he's not learning from his Chelsea mistakes" cliche, when it didn't even fit the argument. Why can't we fail to break a team down because the other team got their tactics spot on? Or because the players themselves didn't perform? Why has it always got to be AVB's tactics - that none of us even know what they are anyway.

ps. I would've started Dempsey too but I didn't think it was a massive deal to start Ade instead.

 

[jimmyb]

Thats just nonsense. Most teams stay deep against the top teams. Doesnt stop them getting round the back and winning almost all these type of games.

We have two of the best wingers in the PL and yet we cant seem to do it.

Err.....you must be watching a different Premier League to me! I see plenty of lesser teams frustrating the top teams by sitting deep.

Only Man Utd consistently break other teams down. Because they've had years of experience at it.

 

[NovTHFC]

We couldn't get around the back because they parked themselves on top of Cesar. Lennon and Bale couldn't run at the full back because they were already so deep to begin with and not to mention they doubled up on both sides. I do agree that we didn't put many crosses in, but you can contrast that by saying we put hundreds in against Stoke and none of them came to anything as Defoe and Ade juyst don't attack them enough.

This is how QPR lined up for most of the game

It REALLY isn't easy trying to break that down. As said countless times before, our game is built on pace and power, those two facets become worthless when the space is taken away. There's very little craft/guile/brains in this team to get through these games, you can't just keep blaming AVB for it, he doesn't have those players at his disposal - the only two we had were sold.

Well done to this man, absolutely spot on.

When a team plays so deep with all 11 men behind the ball, it is very very hard to break them down. We cant use our pace, playing intricate balls in & around the box are near impossible due to the sheer bodies in the box. It was going to take an early goal(which we nearly got) or a long shot, of which we failed miserably.

The one thing that annoys me the most is how pundits describe us as disappointing, well course its going to be disappointing trying to break down a team with no attacking intent playing for a draw, & for that I hope QPR go down, as also their fans are utter bell ends, what was the need for the Naughton bashing?

 

[Pirate55]

Just because you think it's legitimate criticism doesn't mean that everyone else has to think the same. The fact that you think something is obvious doesn't mean that everyone else must think it's so, nor does it make it right.

It's not that people aren't allowing criticism, it's that people are disagreeing. If Scara or the mods started deleting your posts then it would be a case of not allowing criticism.

Some think everything AVB does is fantastic. Some think everything he does is brick. I criticise when I dont agree with something and applaud when I do.

For example, would you have started with Ade today? I viewed that as a major mistake and said so before the game. It transpired that he continued to play as he has done this season. AVB and the coaches havent managed to turn it round. Do you still think we should persist with a player who doesnt seem "at it".

 

[Spursalot]

Thats just nonsense. Most teams stay deep against the top teams. Doesnt stop them getting round the back and winning almost all these type of games.

We have two of the best wingers in the PL and yet we cant seem to do it.

It's not nonsense.


Firstly not many top teams consistently win against teams parking the bus, secondly the ones that do don't do it via getting behind them, they use creativity and guile and go through them, exactly like we tried to today.

 

[braineclipse]

Some think everything AVB does is fantastic. Some think everything he does is brick. I criticise when I dont agree with something and applaud when I do.

For example, would you have started with Ade today? I viewed that as a major mistake and said so before the game. It transpired that he continued to play as he has done this season. AVB and the coaches havent managed to turn it round. Do you still think we should persist with a player who doesnt seem "at it".

I thought starting Ade was a good decision. I'm not really looking to get into adetailed discussion with you over this, I think we've been down that road before.

I agree with jimmyb, seems that you're watching a different Premier League to some of the rest of us.

 

[Rossi22]

Some think everything AVB does is fantastic. Some think everything he does is brick. I criticise when I dont agree with something and applaud when I do.

For example, would you have started with Ade today? I viewed that as a major mistake and said so before the game. It transpired that he continued to play as he has done this season. AVB and the coaches havent managed to turn it round. Do you still think we should persist with a player who doesnt seem "at it".

He did score the winning goal in our last league game.

 

[Spur of the moment]

Err.....you must be watching a different Premier League to me! I see plenty of lesser teams frustrating the top teams by sitting deep.

Only Man Utd consistently break other teams down. Because they've had years of experience at it.

True but it's not just that, is it, they also happen to have some of the world's most talented strikers.

 

[Spursalot]

Some think everything AVB does is fantastic. Some think everything he does is brick. I criticise when I dont agree with something and applaud when I do.

For example, would you have started with Ade today? I viewed that as a major mistake and said so before the game. It transpired that he continued to play as he has done this season. AVB and the coaches havent managed to turn it round. Do you still think we should persist with a player who doesnt seem "at it".

I don't think everything he does is fantastic, I think he should have played Dempsey/Sig today instead of one of Ade/Defoe as they are more likely to create something in that type of game.


What i do disagree with is when people criticise him for things just because we lose, even when they are not even remotely correct reasons, imo.

I do think we should persist with a player who is not 'at it'. We don't have the finances to simply write off a player when they have a bad six months. What should be done is him being used as a sub or a lone striker. Mix it up a little as him and defoe is currently not working.

 

[nelto]

Just got back from game

Ade - fudgein hell how fudgein brick
Dawson - very good - yeah a couple of his passes were wayward but did well overall
Parker - very good and wasnt worried about Sandro coming off
Defoe with the minimal of chances he had he did ok and worked the keeper - the only player to do so.
Dembele - was fudgein awful - worst performance by far
Bale/Lennon - were awful.



Overall it was a poor performance but credit to QPR they stifled us and worked well against us - Harry (for all his "tactical naivety") got his tactics spot on

I was there as well today. I agree with all of this.

Folks are rating Verts over Daws, disagree. Jan did nothing going forward, at least Michael tried to make a difference. Ade was dire, should have been subbed earlier, probably shouldn't have started. I didn't really like our lot singing Cheerio to him when he got taken off.

Thought Scotty's contribution was positive and he controlled a lot in midfield. Moussa was crap and I had my heart in my mouth with his handball as he was already on a booking and a QPR player had just been booked for an identical offence.

I would have taken off Bale rather than Azza. At least Lennon was having a go, I don't think I've seen Gareth play worse.

All in all it was a reasonably pleasant day out. QPR fans aren't the worst, even the knob with the horn and Mexican hat.

 

[Pirate55]

I thought starting Ade was a good decision. I'm not really looking to get into adetailed discussion with you over this, I think we've been down that road before.

I agree with jimmyb, seems that you're watching a different Premier League to some of the rest of us.

And exactly how many goals has the Ade/Defoe partnership brought forth? What is it - one goal between them in the last five games - especially when we are in a good run of results.

Not good enough I'm afraid - and too many apologists on here. Ade and Defoe just doesnt work. We tried it a few times last season and quite a few this season. We desperately need a new top notch striker. For AVB to say we dont, is just wrong. It has cost us in the last two seasons and if we dont get one, then I am fearful it might well cost us again. Quality strikers make all the difference. We dont have one, never mind two.