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*** OMT Spurs vs Everton ***

mephitis said:
Me and the bloke in front of me were saying pretty much the same thing on that passage of play. Why pass it back and forth across the area? Why not pass it out to Porro (who was one of our better players and would at least have taken it forward) on the wide right instead of back to Lloris? And who thought passing it to Sanchez to make that killer forward pass was ever an idea that would come to fruition?
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At times it's genuinely seemed to me like Conte/Stellini tactics involve passing backwards to draw the opponent onto us, and then passing through the press to exploit the space in behind. But I don't see us doing anything tactically to actually help the players pass through the press, like clever rotation or the front three dropping deep to give us more options. We just seem to spread out across the pitch, everyone sticking rigidly to their positions, and expect the players to find each other when being pressed. And to do that game after game, without it ever working and without changing anything. I just don't get it, it's truly baffling.
 
glorygloryeze said:
Bissouma has been overall a big disappointment no doubt; but how much is that due to the coaching he's been under?
He showed previously how good he could be and when he was bought i'm sure most on here were very excited to be getting him into the squad
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In my opinion, we tend to think as if there were always one single factor that would explain everything. In Bissouma's case, it's probably a great many things working together to make him look like half the player he was at Brighton: a new system, a new environment, new team-mates and, indeed, new coaching.

Back in the 90s, Nantes won the French Ligue 1 losing only one game all season. It was a team full of nobodies, most of them coming fresh out of the club's academy, who suddenly looked like world beaters. Two years after winning the title, they all went to bigger clubs and, except for Christian Karembeu and Claude Makelele (and it could be argued that Makelele didn't do that well at Marseille), they all flopped. The real stars were Nicolas Ouedec, Patrice Loko, Reynald Pedros, Japhet N'Doram... yeah, nobody remembers them.

Some said it was Nantes' system that was too specific, some said they didn't have the mentality to succeed elsewhere, others said they were so used to playing together since childhood that they couldn't make it in an other team... but none of these explanations looks really satisfying. It's probably a mix of everything or a combination of different factors for each and every one of them. At Brighton, maybe Bissouma played alongside people that made him look better than he really is. But that alone doesn't explain just how poor he's been in a Spurs shirt. Conte was critised for sticking to the same XI but Bissouma is one player who got a lot more game time than he deserved, based on his performances.

That's why scouting is so important these days. You need to know as much as you can about the players you sign and that doesn't mean just looking at the odd video or checking a few stats on the Internet. I think you need to ask questions to people who've worked with your targets if you don't want to throw your money away.
 
Mr Gogolak said:
In my opinion, we tend to think as if there were always one single factor that would explain everything. In Bissouma's case, it's probably a great many things working together to make him look like half the player he was at Brighton: a new system, a new environment, new team-mates and, indeed, new coaching.

Back in the 90s, Nantes won the French Ligue 1 losing only one game all season. It was a team full of nobodies, most of them coming fresh out of the club's academy, who suddenly looked like world beaters. Two years after winning the title, they all went to bigger clubs and, except for Christian Karembeu and Claude Makelele (and it could be argued that Makelele didn't do that well at Marseille), they all flopped. The real stars were Nicolas Ouedec, Patrice Loko, Reynald Pedros, Japhet N'Doram... yeah, nobody remembers them.

Some said it was Nantes' system that was too specific, some said they didn't have the mentality to succeed elsewhere, others said they were so used to playing together since childhood that they couldn't make it in an other team... but none of these explanations looks really satisfying. It's probably a mix of everything or a combination of different factors for each and every one of them. At Brighton, maybe Bissouma played alongside people that made him look better than he really is. But that alone doesn't explain just how poor he's been in a Spurs shirt. Conte was critised for sticking to the same XI but Bissouma is one player who got a lot more game time than he deserved, based on his performances.

That's why scouting is so important these days. You need to know as much as you can about the players you sign and that doesn't mean just looking at the odd video or checking a few stats on the Internet. I think you need to ask questions to people who've worked with your targets if you don't want to throw your money away.
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Also, his injury is a stress fracture. I've had that myself, and I felt something wasn't completely right for weeks, even months before it was discovered. I'm pretty sure it's been an issue for Bissouma as well.
 
Mr Gogolak said:
In my opinion, we tend to think as if there were always one single factor that would explain everything. In Bissouma's case, it's probably a great many things working together to make him look like half the player he was at Brighton: a new system, a new environment, new team-mates and, indeed, new coaching.

Back in the 90s, Nantes won the French Ligue 1 losing only one game all season. It was a team full of nobodies, most of them coming fresh out of the club's academy, who suddenly looked like world beaters. Two years after winning the title, they all went to bigger clubs and, except for Christian Karembeu and Claude Makelele (and it could be argued that Makelele didn't do that well at Marseille), they all flopped. The real stars were Nicolas Ouedec, Patrice Loko, Reynald Pedros, Japhet N'Doram... yeah, nobody remembers them.

Some said it was Nantes' system that was too specific, some said they didn't have the mentality to succeed elsewhere, others said they were so used to playing together since childhood that they couldn't make it in an other team... but none of these explanations looks really satisfying. It's probably a mix of everything or a combination of different factors for each and every one of them. At Brighton, maybe Bissouma played alongside people that made him look better than he really is. But that alone doesn't explain just how poor he's been in a Spurs shirt. Conte was critised for sticking to the same XI but Bissouma is one player who got a lot more game time than he deserved, based on his performances.

That's why scouting is so important these days. You need to know as much as you can about the players you sign and that doesn't mean just looking at the odd video or checking a few stats on the Internet. I think you need to ask questions to people who've worked with your targets if you don't want to throw your money away.
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Helps if your scouting for a philosophy and system
 
djp82 said:
PEH was atrocious last night. Don’t get some of the plaudits he gets. Constantly does what you said above. He’s reactive does not read the game that well. Thought Skipp had a poor game also.

Sarr maybe a young prospect but he certainly looks a better player than PEH with the ball at his feet. His passing looks miles ahead. He’s going to make mistakes but just play him. We got two hod carriers in there at the minute. Nothing more. Sarr offers something different.
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i've always referred to him as hollywood hojberg. he doesn't put in the regular grunt work - often leaving it to skipp or bentancur.
many times he was chasing down the linesman or compaining about his boot instead of recovering his position first as play goes on.
also, i suspect that not many players get along really well with him. As a senior in a midfield he should be directing play more often.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Helps if your scouting for a philosophy and system
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It certainly does. It also makes it easier for players coming in, as they know what to expect but, when you think about it, how many clubs in the world have been implementing the same philosophy and system for more than, say, ten years? Ajax, for one. Barcelona did for a long time. Most clubs opt for a complete overhaul whenever they sack their manager which, I think, is a shame.
 
Mr Gogolak said:
It certainly does. It also makes it easier for players coming in, as they know what to expect but, when you think about it, how many clubs in the world have been implementing the same philosophy and system for more than, say, ten years? Ajax, for one. Barcelona did for a long time. Most clubs opt for a complete overhaul whenever they sack their manager which, I think, is a shame.
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Takes time and commitment
Also needs the fans to buy in
But….the clubs that do it, communicate it too so everyone knows
 
As usual, my first task of the morning is to put the kettle on and make a cup of tea...

As I went to the cupboard where I keep the mugs I saw the two Tottenham ones that I have... I instinctively said, "Of f..k off you c...s".

The last 30 minutes on Monday night were a new low.
 
NLS said:
As usual, my first task of the morning is to put the kettle on and make a cup of tea...

As I went to the cupboard where I keep the mugs I saw the two Tottenham ones that I have... I instinctively said, "Of f..k off you c...s".

The last 30 minutes on Monday night were a new low.
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Yea that performance from the moment we scored had me feeling about as low about Spurs as I’ve done in a long time. How are they not capable of playing better than that against 10 men relegation fodder? Or noticing the brick that they’re trying, passing it around the back, isn’t working so chip it in to Kane and get Kulu and Son around him, we should have the extra man somewhere. Coaches and players should have been able to figure this out.
 
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And what made it even worse was when Stellini said that we didn't sit back after the goal... What hope have we got if the manager can't see what everyone else can....

Unless he was lying of course and hoping to get away with it and that's even more worse.

I despair...
 
Gazza Dazzla said:
... passing it around the back, isn’t working so chip it in to Kane and get Kulu and Son around him, we should have the extra man somewhere. Coaches and players should have been able to figure this out.
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Everton played 3 workers/battlers in midfield Gueye Doucoure Onana and then... no striker so they also had Iwobi Gray McNeil battling for the ball. 6 workers all chasing down our guys.

We had Skipp and Hojbjerg trying to work it through, but they were constantly manhandled and overpowered, and when we got it forwards to our front 3 they too were manhandled and overpowered.

So how does that work, how come we never had any overloads or advantage... what is going on with us? Terrible system.
 
Bullet said:
Everton played 3 workers/battlers in midfield Gueye Doucoure Onana and then... no striker so they also had Iwobi Gray McNeil battling for the ball. 6 workers all chasing down our guys.

We had Skipp and Hojbjerg trying to work it through, but they were constantly manhandled and overpowered, and when we got it forwards to our front 3 they too were manhandled and overpowered.

So how does that work, how come we never had any overloads or advantage... what is going on with us? Terrible system.
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Our forwards are not strong enough in holding the ball. Son has the first touch of a rapist, Kane never wins headers when balls are punted from the back and Kulu has no speed to frighten defenders. We simply have no plan B.
 
metalgear said:
Stellini looks like he wants to protect. Conte's legacy, rather than striking out on his own.
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He made all the wrong choices again today - starting Dier, starting Lloris, sane 3-4-3, subbing no one. Was a blessed relief to see him going off and Mason immediately bringing on Danjuma, because it confirms that at least *someone* on the coaching staff is seeing what 60,000 in the stadium are.

Stellini had a chance to really make his mark here as his own man, but he's basically confirming he's a yes man and nothing more.
 
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