• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

The reason we will play Europa League football next season....

SUIYHA

SUIYHA

Scott Parker
...is because we played it this season.

I have been very vocal in my criticism of our involvement in this competition, and I'm sad to say that it appears to have cost us once again.

Going for the Europa League is the ultimate risk taking strategy. You don't get any "cred" for reaching the quarter-finals. Do you respect Saudi Sportswashing Machine any more for reaching the quarter-finals? No, they had a terrible season. Nobody remembers anything about the campaign from outside the club unless you reach the final, and reaching the final is tricky. Anything can happen along the way. You can concede a sloppy away goal. A player can get sent off at a crucial point of the match. A player can choke in a penalty shoot-out. Even if you are one of the better sides in the competition, the odds are stacked against you, especially when the CL drop-outs come. We all know the stats. You get less prize money for winning the Europa League than you do for simply reaching the CL group stages. Top players would rather join a club that offers them CL football, rather than a chance to walk past the Europa League in a trophy cabinet on their way into the stadium. And we had a great chance of being able to offer them just that. Except...we tried to focus on the Europa League.

So our first team played 12 extra games. Two of them going to extra time. One of them we had to play all of extra time with 10 men. You think that didn't wear the team down? If we'd managed just two more points we'd have CL football this season. If we'd used the EL group stage games to give first team experiences to the likes of Townsend, Carroll, Naughton, Coulibally etc, then not only would they have developed their own games more, but our first teamers would have been fresher. I have no doubt that those 12 extra games could have been 2 more league points if only we'd rested them.

Want some proof? We were 7 points clear of Arsenal at the start of March. They then went out of Europe. We all know what happened, they focused on the league and won 8 and drew 2 of their next 10 games. Whereas we stayed in Europe, and here's what happened:

Spurs 3-0 Inter
Liverpool 3-2 Spurs - a game we threw away in the second half

Inter 4-1 Spurs - After extra-time
Spurs 0-1 Fulham - After a tired, weary performance

Spurs 2-2 Basel - with Bale getting injured
Spurs 2-2 Everton

If we'd won any of those three games, we'd be in the CL now. But we arrogantly tried to compete on two fronts when we don't have the squad for it.




Now before somebody says "But it'll be the same if we get CL football, we have to play the same players". There's a key difference. The big clubs in the CL have bigger budgets from CL football, and therefore bigger squads of top players. What is Man Utd's best XI? It's hard to say. Kagawa, Nani, Valencia, Wellbeck and Hernandez all played regularly throughout the season, as did Young when he was fit. City didn't rotate properly and they had a brick season. Benitez rotated Chelsea and had Europa League "specialists" such as Moses, Torres and Lampard. Arsenal didn't have the squad to compete on two fronts, they dropped points three times after CL group stage games (one at home to Fulham and one against Villa when they were playing terribly), if they'd stayed in Europe they probably would have struggled domestically.

It's not like this stuff is ground breaking. Lots of managers slag off the Europa League. I just hope that AVB now realises that we do not have the resources to finish top 4 AND win the EL right now. A disappointment in AVB's first season has been that he has not developed any youth players into first team regulars, and the EL should be the opportunity to do that, not to tire out the first teamers.
 
The reason we played Europa League last season was because we were in the CL the previous season. We lost focus in the league.

Why should we bother qualifying for anything if it will only hamper us the following season? The financial gains from the CL aren't that great and we can't take on more wages than we can handle without being in it.

I have zero interest in so called 'glamour ties' and the league should always be priority number one, but I believe this club should be in a European competition every season. Our goal should always be to make sure we qualify again the following season. More than anything we need consistency in the league, but we need Europe for the increased exposure.

Things have changed, you no longer build a side over time with the aim of a few years of success. Players and managers come and go all the time. You need a solid structure off the pitch to stay competitive and ours is among the best. The only thing truly "holding us back" is a lack of money compared to our closest rivals and that's not going to change until we have a new stadium and even then it will still take years of consistently fighting at the top end of the table, building the brand, gaining more fans.

There is no short cut or magic spell that will get us success, only long term planning, patience and hard work. Sometimes we will have to suffer in the short term in order to gain something long term. Those of you that continue to have unrealistic expectations season after season and do little but complain because we aren't achieving what was all but impossible in the first place should really consider getting a different hobby or maybe start following a team with more money.

The best thing would probably be for Tottenham to cease to exist. No more failure.
 
So we qualify for a competition and then try our damned hardest to get out of said competition.

Great practice for the CL that is.

For fudge's sake, we finished with more points than we picked up under Harry last year, and that was when we treated the EL like utter dogbrick.
 
DubaiSpur said:
So we qualify for a competition and then try our damned hardest to get out of said competition.

Great practice for the CL that is.

For fudge's sake, we finished with more points than we picked up under Harry last year, and that was when we treated the EL like utter dogbrick.
Click to expand...

Spot on.
 
DubaiSpur said:
So we qualify for a competition and then try our damned hardest to get out of said competition.

Great practice for the CL that is.

For fudge's sake, we finished with more points than we picked up under Harry last year, and that was when we treated the EL like utter dogbrick.
Click to expand...

Fair treatment IMO.

As I said last season, I want us to win every competition we're in, so we should just write UEFA a little letter saying thanks but no thanks.
 
I think we should better integrate squad players and youth into our Europa and other cup games. Continental style football suits them and it's a great opportunity for them to impress the manager and stake a claim for our starting XI; you'd think they'd play much more hungrily than our lethargic seniors who managed to get beaten by Leeds. SAF is the master of rotation and even though he had a deeper squad, I'd hope we'd take a page from his book and at least attempt to institute his system.

The things about the CL-vs-Europa is that the CL raises your profile in Europe and allows you to attract a higher caliber of player, which logically makes fighting on two fronts much easier. With the Europa, you're trying to play extra games and get into the top four with a Europa level squad ... not easy to do when your rivals have mostly CL-caliber squads. Arsenal will always have an advantage over us in the run-in because they're out of everything by then *and* they keep attracting CL players, even though they're even less likely than us to do anything in their competition.

For me, it's worth it making a temporary sacrifice to get over the "hump" and shift to the CL level, with the hope that will boost our summer business (both in terms of signings and sponsorship) and give us a stronger squad in the long term, making us more competitive in both the league and Europe. OTOH, you could say we may not be able to attract many better players anyways, because we can't afford those wages without a guarantee of consistent CL money (which will never happen).
 
I can't give my consent to Spurs not trying to win a competition, i think it has a knock on effect if you accept probable defeat before a match/competition, you have to behave like winners to be winners.

However for next season i would like to see a properly implemented plan whereby youth/fringe players are categorically given the task of getting us out of the group in the EL and to the 1/4 finals of the league cup, then first team players will take over were necessary (including all 11 places). Various bonuses and first team opportunities can be their prize rather than a trophy.

From that point on we play our best team. Fcuk "sticking with the team", they were given a clear, professional task to achieve. In a 100m relay race only one guy of the four is going to get the honour of crossing the finishing line, but the others played their part. Do your damn job to the best of your ability and pass the baton on.

We then play our best players and its up to the youth/fringe to earn their place in that cup team then. No playing the second keeper and freaking out the defence etc, this is a professional sport. You want to play in the final stages? Work harder, apply yourself, train longer, practice more. Thats why you have a contract, thats what you get paid for, and surely thats what you dreamed of as a kid?

This isn't about simply putting out a team of kids like Man U or Arsenal do, its a properly implemented, focused and competitive route to earning a regular first team place.

This isn't about "playing the kids" just to get the matches done, the games will be taken as seriously as first team matches, give the youth and fringe a taste of what is expected of them in all aspects and let them know this is how they get in the first team.

The first teams task is to have a serious go at the title next year with 3 of the top 4 facing changes and upheaval.

For me this isn't about getting into the Champions league per se, i really wouldn't be satisfied if we ever won that BEFORE we won the premier league.

(i reserve the right to change my mind about all this within the next 5mins+!)
 
scaramanga said:
Fair treatment IMO.

As I said last season, I want us to win every competition we're in, so we should just write UEFA a little letter saying thanks but no thanks.
Click to expand...

Ridiculous!

Look at Chelsea's players and fans celebrating when they won it last week. It's a disgusting attitude to treat a major European trophy with this contempt and I don't care how much it's been devalued. I want to win it next year and thankfully so does AVB. Play the likes of Carroll, Livermore they should be good enough to get us out of the group stages so your first team won't even need much involvement until the new year!!
 
Roy1983 said:
Ridiculous!

Look at Chelsea's players and fans celebrating when they won it last week. It's a disgusting attitude to treat a major European trophy with this contempt and I don't care how much it's been devalued. I want to win it next year and thankfully so does AVB. Play the likes of Carroll, Livermore they should be good enough to get us out of the group stages so your first team won't even need much involvement until the new year!!
Click to expand...

I wanted to win it this year too. What I absolutely didn't want is to risk CL qualification in order to get knocked out in the quarters by some team from Switzerland.

If UEFA sort out some proper seeding so that we enter around the time the CL dropouts do (a bit like the FA Cup - no need to bother us with the first round) then I'd be more interested.
 
BucurestiSpur said:
I can't give my consent to Spurs not trying to win a competition, i think it has a knock on effect if you accept probable defeat before a match/competition, you have to behave like winners to be winners.

However for next season i would like to see a properly implemented plan whereby youth/fringe players are categorically given the task of getting us out of the group in the EL and to the 1/4 finals of the league cup, then first team players will take over were necessary (including all 11 places). Various bonuses and first team opportunities can be their prize rather than a trophy.

From that point on we play our best team. Fcuk "sticking with the team", they were given a clear, professional task to achieve. In a 100m relay race only one guy of the four is going to get the honour of crossing the finishing line, but the others played their part. Do your damn job to the best of your ability and pass the baton on.

We then play our best players and its up to the youth/fringe to earn their place in that cup team then. No playing the second keeper and freaking out the defence etc, this is a professional sport. You want to play in the final stages? Work harder, apply yourself, train longer, practice more. Thats why you have a contract, thats what you get paid for, and surely thats what you dreamed of as a kid?

This isn't about simply putting out a team of kids like Man U or Arsenal do, its a properly implemented, focused and competitive route to earning a regular first team place.

This isn't about "playing the kids" just to get the matches done, the games will be taken as seriously as first team matches, give the youth and fringe a taste of what is expected of them in all aspects and let them know this is how they get in the first team.

The first teams task is to have a serious go at the title next year with 3 of the top 4 facing changes and upheaval.

For me this isn't about getting into the Champions league per se, i really wouldn't be satisfied if we ever won that BEFORE we won the premier league.

(i reserve the right to change my mind about all this within the next 5mins+!)
Click to expand...


Pretty much agreed here.

The League Cup is the one that should be used for experimenting. Would have no problem with the yoof playing those early rounds, and the club pricing tickets accordingly.
 
DubaiSpur said:
So we qualify for a competition and then try our damned hardest to get out of said competition.

Great practice for the CL that is.

For fudge's sake, we finished with more points than we picked up under Harry last year, and that was when we treated the EL like utter dogbrick.
Click to expand...

we dont need to practice for the CL....jeez, Arse have been there every year but they still perform sh!te in it season in season out

how much practice did we have before the 2010-11 CL campaign??? not much but we still got to the quarters......

weve got some top players that will perform just fine in the CL without having to fcuk around in the EL
 
What rubbish. Our points total in the league is more than enough to get CL in most seasons, it just so happened that both Arsenal & Chelsea improved quite significantly from last season. Arsenal had a stuttering start as did we as they were getting used to not having RVP, but they bought well last summer and although they initially missed RVP's explosiveness upfront, their overall better and more balanced squad came into its own in the run-in. Despite what many think of Benitez as well, after a shaky start he managed to get Chelsea playing relentless stuff. Both of these teams completely steam-rollered the league from the beginning of the league.

Form-wise, I think we were actually 3rd in the league post-xmas behind those two!

We were just unfortunate that both of these two teams stepped it up to such an extent.

You're always going to have games where you throw away the points, or lose when you don't expect. We did a lot less of that this season than we have in previous seasons when we didn't take the Europa seriously.

Take last season, we played the kids in the Europa under Harry and we STILL looked shot fitness-wise after January and our form from the Saudi Sportswashing Machine win was absolutely horrendous, I think we were 3rd bottom in the form table by the time the season ended.

This season, we were the opposite but it wasn't quite enough. We went on an amazing run after the Fulham defeat which involved our only dropped points being Wigan (a), Everton (h) and Chelsea (a), none of which were losses.

The Europa League is a worth-while trophy to compete in as you should go out to win whatever you can. That winning mentality has helped us this season.

AVB has clearly said to the players i want you to go out and compete in everything on all fronts, i dont want you to give up until the last minute and that has been bourne out in our determination and winning mentality we have seen this season. AVB Is FINALLY changing the culture of the club to be more akin to the top clubs.

We keep going, we score last-minute equalisers and winners, we are hard to beat, we don't roll over and die and get smashed 5-0 and 3-0 and 5-1 by the likes of Chelsea, Man U or Arsenal. We don't throw away 2 goal leads against Arsenal and Man U and end up getting pumped 5-2 with 11 players on the field.

We go out to win every single game and that is finally getting through to our players. Yes, we came up short this season, but with the right additions and if we hold onto Bale for one more season I think we can run them closer next season and that goes for the Manchester clubs too.
 
we are in the EL, so we have to deal with it

id play the younger players(plus Friedel, Dawson and maybe Defoe) in the group stage. If we qualify then id introduce a couple of the best players each round.

the EL in the current format should not be anywhere a priority. Uefa treat it as a second class tournament, what with the Thurs nights, CL dropouts, and the prize money on offer, so why the fcuk should we treat it any different

Uefa dont deserve to have a player like Bale playing in the EL....

for fcuks sake, our whole season nearly blew up because of tackle on Bale in an EL game

this would be my EL team for the group stages with the players we have right now

...................Friedel

Smith......Dawson... Caulker...Rose

.............Holtby... Carroll

...Townsend...Sigurdsson...Ceballos

......................Defoe
 
We need to get used to it so we are equipped to play CL + compete in the league, like we didn't do very well the season we were in the CL (remember all those 'hangover' games).

(Among many things) I used to hate how Redknapp disrespected the UEFA cup. I never want to see us effectively throw games like that again. What's the point of existing if we're not going to try to compete.

Remember the heartache the couple of times (e.g. under Jol) we just missed out on UEFA qualification on the final day, or were praying for a random fair play place to be thrown our way.

I love the UEFA cup anyway and am already looking forward to trying to win it next season.

I hate teams like Arsenal whose aims are calculated (i.e. 4th is all), rather than about the pursuit of glory.
 
In the end we were 1 goal away from finishing 4th. Either Koscielny not scoring or Saudi Sportswashing Machine equalising. Or 1 Spurs goal from one of the games the team did not win during the season.

That could have been vs WBA at home, vs Norwich at home, vs Wigan home or away, vs Fulham at home, vs Liverpool away. In fact, any of the games that were close.

Some of these results have nothing to do with playing in the Europa League. They were individual mistakes such as backpasses or fouls, or misfiring strikers.

The Europa League may be a drain but Chelsea played 71 games this season, finished 3rd and won a cup. We needed to perform better/smarter in just a few games. Two years ago Chelsea finished 2nd with 71 points.

You could argue that having in form strikers removes the individual errors because the pressure is off for the defence and the panic buttons don't get pressed. Fix the strikers, get Sandro and Kaboul back, aim higher next year with or without the Europa League.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back