****Spurs v Burnley****

[milo]

Where did I say we should convert 20% of our corners?

So can you explain what point you were making when you criticised the stat in the Guardian article? Have I got it wrong and it was just badly articulated? It seems odd to criticise a figure and then go on to talk about something else entirely.

 

[Bullet]

What percentage do you have to multiply 3.2% by to get 20%?

Be fair, he only said that 3 of 15 goals were from corners, that is true.




I think we need to separate the fact that 3% of corners lead to goals.... from the % of goals that come from corners

E.g. if 100% of goals came from corners, we should focus all our attention on them. If 1% of goals came from corners, they are not important.



It is somewhere inbetween and they are important, so we should at least beat the first man and attack the ball properly, nobody is suggesting we solely focus all our play on set pieces like Pulis, nobody is saying we should commit all 10 outfield players into the box, but we definitely should do better with corners.

 

[milo]

Be fair, he only said that 3 of 15 goals were from corners, that is true.

I think we need to separate the fact that 3% of corners lead to goals.... from the % of goals that come from corners

E.g. if 100% of goals came from corners, we should focus all our attention on them. If 1% of goals came from corners, they are not important.

It is somewhere inbetween and they are important, so we should at least beat the first man and attack the ball properly, nobody is suggesting we solely focus all our play on set pieces like Pulis, nobody is saying we should commit all 10 outfield players into the box, but we definitely should do better with corners.

I agree. That is what I was trying to do, although admittedly, I've been taking the tinkle a little bit whilst doing it.

 

[scaramanga]

I'm getting some new forum software installed so that I can like this post more than once.

 

[scaramanga]

Be fair, he only said that 3 of 15 goals were from corners, that is true.




I think we need to separate the fact that 3% of corners lead to goals.... from the % of goals that come from corners

E.g. if 100% of goals came from corners, we should focus all our attention on them. If 1% of goals came from corners, they are not important.



It is somewhere inbetween and they are important, so we should at least beat the first man and attack the ball properly, nobody is suggesting we solely focus all our play on set pieces like Pulis, nobody is saying we should commit all 10 outfield players into the box, but we definitely should do better with corners.

That's not really the important stat though.

We need to look at what proportion of various options will lead to a goal or a good chance. Otherwise the figures will be skewed from how many times they're attempted.

Example: If there were 3000 corners attempted this weekend and 90 goals scored but 5 through balls were attempted leading to 1 goal, your method would lead us to believe that crossing is a better use of our time. Clearly it isn't.

 

[Bullet]

That's not really the important stat though.

We need to look at what proportion of various options will lead to a goal or a good chance. Otherwise the figures will be skewed from how many times they're attempted.

Example: If there were 3000 corners attempted this weekend and 90 goals scored but 5 through balls were attempted leading to 1 goal, your method would lead us to believe that crossing is a better use of our time. Clearly it isn't.

I understand that.
But we do get corners, so might as well try to score from them, rather than hit the first man.

 

[scaramanga]

I understand that.
But we do get corners, so might as well try to score from them, rather than hit the first man.

Short corners massively increase our likelihood of keeping possession without decreasing the likelihood of scoring by any measurable amount.

I'd rather we did that.

 

[the dza]

What we need is Dier to become our Sergio Ramos. If we're in jail, lob it in the box and he'll do the rest. If it's good enough for Real Madrid...

IMO, set-pieces really come into their own in big pressure games/moments. They are fairly simple to execute, you get to put loads of players around the opposition goal area and the pressure of the situation increases the chances of a slip-up in the opposition defence. It's so easy to think of finals where goals were scored from set-pieces and the course of football history changed.

 

[glorygloryeze]

What a fukking GREAT win!

First time in a long time we've won up there; great in-game management by Poch; ran them ragged in the end (when even the others who've won there previously have effectively had to cling on for victory. Winning when it was known Chelski were losing.

What was not to like eh?

COYS

 

[Pirate55]

So can you explain what point you were making when you criticised the stat in the Guardian article? Have I got it wrong and it was just badly articulated? It seems odd to criticise a figure and then go on to talk about something else entirely.

Pot. Kettle. Black.

I didn't criticise the Guardian stat, I just didn't accept the bombast and opinion stated in the article.

If you actually read what I said instead of inventing some nonsense figure of 20%, then maybe you will stop your straw man attack.

The figures provided by Steveawol in the corners thread clearly demonstrate our lack of conversion rate compared to say Chelsea and Liverpool as well as the West Brom's of the world. This is an area we need to improve upon, surely even you can see that?

 

[Pirate55]

What a fukking GREAT win!

First time in a long time we've won up there; great in-game management by Poch; ran them ragged in the end (when even the others who've won there previously have effectively had to cling on for victory. Winning when it was known Chelski were losing.

What was not to like eh?

COYS

Agreed. Although some appear to be upset with the OMT

I await others efforts (especially those criticising) with hopefully as good a result!,

Swansea thread anyone?

 

[Spurs7891]

Nice to get our first league win at Burnley since 1976. But we really should have won this match more comfortably. We played well and created enough chances to score 3 or 4 more goals. But we wasted too many chances and were not clinical enough in front of goal. Fortunately for us Burnley were toothless in attack and didn't trouble us. Burnley had one of the best defensive record at home in the league. Thought we would face problems beating them. But it was virtually an easy game which we should have scored more goals from.

Well done to Dier and Son for the goals. It was a perfect time for Dier to score his first league goal of the season. It was a crucial time to score that goal as we didn't look like scoring a goal until then. Despite being a defensive minded player, Dier took the goal well like a striker. We badly needed that goal ! Son, did well to score the goal after coming on but credit should be given to Alli who set up the goal with a inch perfect pass. Despite that, Alli should have scored a hattrick as he had 3 chances which he should have scored from. Janssen played well in attack but really disappointing that he has failed to score yet again.

Thought it was a gamble by Pochettino to start Winks instead of Dembele in midfield. We started this match slowly and only improved after Dembele replaced the injured Wanyama. Winks had a decent match but was careless to get the injury the way he did. Thought Sissoko will make an positive impact after replacing Winks but he failed to do so and even wasted a good chance to score. Eriksen set up the goal for Dier with his corner but had a quiet game apart from that. In fact, Eriksen had a few chances to score but failed to make use of that.

Good to see our defence keeping the clean sheet in this match. Burnley didn't really trouble us but the defenders did their job well. But Lloris again had problems when dealing at back passes. Not sure why we insist on sending those unnecessary back passes to trouble Lloris. Have always worried about Dier starting in defence but thought he had a error-free match and even scored our first goal ! Instead, it was Trippier who made a few errors to put pressure on our goal. Despite that, really glad we managed to stop Burnley from scoring.

Glad we managed to overcome Burnley to move closer to the top of the league. But it is still too early to talk about fighting Chelsea for the league title. We still have many tough away matches like West Ham, Leicester and Palace. Hope this win will give us the much needed confidence when we go to those places in the coming matches.

 

[milo]

Pot. Kettle. Black.

I didn't criticise the Guardian stat, I just didn't accept the bombast and opinion stated in the article.

If you actually read what I said instead of inventing some nonsense figure of 20%, then maybe you will stop your straw man attack.

The figures provided by Steveawol in the corners thread clearly demonstrate our lack of conversion rate compared to say Chelsea and Liverpool as well as the West Brom's of the world. This is an area we need to improve upon, surely even you can see that?

My apologies. Absolutely none of that was clear from your post. It read very much like you misread the stat and then proposed an alternative figure.

There was a piece in the guardian last week saying around 3% of corners result in goals. I don't have the link to hand, but it's a good read. Riveting.

A tip - don't believe anything you read in the Grauniad! Just from this admittedly small sample of games on MOTD tonight there were at least three goals scored from corners. And that is from a sample of games where very few goals were scored -only 15 in total out of 8 games Two games ended 0-0. So three goals out of 15 from corners. I make that 20% of goals scored today.

How many teams are there where neither central defender has scored from a corner or free kick all season? How many corners and free kicks from crossing positions have we had this season? I am delighted we scored from one and even more pleased that Eriksen got it over the first man for a change. I just wish it happened more often to give our big units a chance, that is all.

 

[Pirate55]

My apologies. Absolutely none of that was clear from your post. It read very much like you misread the stat and then proposed an alternative figure.

Ok. Apology accepted.

I hope we can both agree that we all want our current conversion rate from corners to improve.

 

[africanspurs]

Nice to get our first league win at Burnley since 1976. But we really should have won this match more comfortably. We played well and created enough chances to score 3 or 4 more goals. But we wasted too many chances and were not clinical enough in front of goal. Fortunately for us Burnley were toothless in attack and didn't trouble us. Burnley had one of the best defensive record at home in the league. Thought we would face problems beating them. But it was virtually an easy game which we should have scored more goals from.

Well done to Dier and Son for the goals. It was a perfect time for Dier to score his first league goal of the season. It was a crucial time to score that goal as we didn't look like scoring a goal until then. Despite being a defensive minded player, Dier took the goal well like a striker. We badly needed that goal ! Son, did well to score the goal after coming on but credit should be given to Alli who set up the goal with a inch perfect pass. Despite that, Alli should have scored a hattrick as he had 3 chances which he should have scored from. Janssen played well in attack but really disappointing that he has failed to score yet again.

Thought it was a gamble by Pochettino to start Winks instead of Dembele in midfield. We started this match slowly and only improved after Dembele replaced the injured Wanyama. Winks had a decent match but was careless to get the injury the way he did. Thought Sissoko will make an positive impact after replacing Winks but he failed to do so and even wasted a good chance to score. Eriksen set up the goal for Dier with his corner but had a quiet game apart from that. In fact, Eriksen had a few chances to score but failed to make use of that.

Good to see our defence keeping the clean sheet in this match. Burnley didn't really trouble us but the defenders did their job well. But Lloris again had problems when dealing at back passes. Not sure why we insist on sending those unnecessary back passes to trouble Lloris. Have always worried about Dier starting in defence but thought he had a error-free match and even scored our first goal ! Instead, it was Trippier who made a few errors to put pressure on our goal. Despite that, really glad we managed to stop Burnley from scoring.

Glad we managed to overcome Burnley to move closer to the top of the league. But it is still too early to talk about fighting Chelsea for the league title. We still have many tough away matches like West Ham, Leicester and Palace. Hope this win will give us the much needed confidence when we go to those places in the coming matches.

Damn man, i dont remember you being hard to please back in the day......LOL

 

[Daisuk]

Damn man, i dont remember you being hard to please back in the day......LOL

We could win the treble and I'm sure Spurs7891 would bemoan our lack of goals from direct freekicks and the colours of the boots of some etc.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Damn man, i dont remember you being hard to please back in the day......LOL

Their has been a software upgrade to his operating system... i think its the virus guard thats making him harder to please

 

[glorygloryeze]

Certain as I ca be we will lose this one 2-1

What were your thoughts on the game and how we played in the end?

Also, what were your thoughts on the Arsenal vs Emirates Marketing Project game?

 

[90291Spur]

What were your thoughts on the game and how we played in the end?

Also, what were your thoughts on the Arsenal vs Emirates Marketing Project game?

I'm guessing, and excuse me @simon harris for being so presumptuous, that we were turgid in the first half against a Burnley team that cost five guineas to buy and who live on a diet of coal and broken glass and should have scored 15 goals at least before HT. I also guess that Poch should go because they had a corner or two. And none of our players are good enough or show enough passion and commitment.

 

[milo]

I'm guessing, and excuse me @simon harris for being so presumptuous, that we were turgid in the first half against a Burnley team that cost five guineas to buy and who live on a diet of coal and broken glass and should have scored 15 goals at least before HT. I also guess that Poch should go because they had a corner or two. And none of our players are good enough or show enough passion and commitment.

And he's a proper fan and the rest of us are plastics.