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New Striker or New Stadium?

Pirate55 said:
There is no point engaging with you as you clearly dont understand english. Read my posts again.

You will clearly see that I dont say that I dont want a new stadium built - but it is a question of PRIORITIES. My priority now is a top striker to consolidate and make sure we achieve CL
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I'm the one who doesn't understand English???? Arf!

I've read your posts, thanks. So what is it that you don't understand about the words (that you wrote): "or" and "prioritise"? They both, by definition, insist upon the presentation of a choice. And the choice that you presented to us, in your thread title and in your first post, was between a striker now or the stadium now. Your denial of that demonstrable truth merely comes across as a desperate attempt to move the goalposts - after the goal has been conceded, I might add.

No one is claiming that you've ever suggested that Spurs should never build the stadium. We've merely responded to the actual question that you did ask. If it is unclear to you exactly what that question was, then I can't help you other than to suggest that, perhaps, it is you who needs to read your posts again.
 
jimmyb said:
I'm the one who doesn't understand English???? Arf!

I've read your posts, thanks. So what is it that you don't understand about the words (that you wrote): "or" and "prioritise"? They both, by definition, insist upon the presentation of a choice. And the choice that you presented to us, in your thread title and in your first post, was between a striker now or the stadium now. Your denial of that demonstrable truth merely comes across as a desperate attempt to move the goalposts - after the goal has been conceded, I might add.

No one is claiming that you've ever suggested that Spurs should never build the stadium. We've merely responded to the actual question that you did ask. If it is unclear to you exactly what that question was, then I can't help you other than to suggest that, perhaps, it is you who needs to read your posts again.
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So - to take your (incorrect) interpretation of my question. Do you want a stadium NOW or a striker NOW?
 
Guys, it's a good discussion, with valid points on both sides.

Let's not let it get overheated, ok?
 
Pirate55 said:
So - to take your (incorrect) interpretation of my question. Do you want a stadium NOW or a striker NOW?
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As I've already said:

It isn't an either / or situation but, if it was, then the stadium would be the percentage call because it is the only way that we could consistently hope to put ourselves in a position to compete with the other clubs challenging for Champions League places.

And I didn't need to interpret your question. It's there in black and white in the thread title - "New Striker or New Stadium". Not "New Striker and New stadium". Not "New striker and Never New Stadium".

"New Striker or New Stadium"....

Repeat ad infinitum.
 
jimmyb said:
I'm cool, mate.

Fonz cool.

Enjoying it. ;)
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No problem from me either.

I listed above 10 reasons why I consider a top striker should be our leading priority now.

If we dont get a new striker and we fail to make CL (or even EL) would you still be happy to have a new stadium? Probably minus Bale as well?

As I recall, you stated on another thread that you wanted a new striker. Am I wrong there too?
 
we've just signed Lewis Holtby from Schalke - a German International playing for a top German side who compete regularly in the Champions League.

why has he come to Spurs if the CL is the single most important thing to a footballer, why give up on playing for a big club who have several seasons in the competition under their belt and would most likely have a better chance of regular participation in the future when you factor in the competition. could it be that higher wages and the opportunity to play in the Premier League are more inciting than merely being in the CL itself?

what's our best chance at being able to offer these players more money in the future - the off chance at claiming the one realistically attainable CL place every season despite having a club with a much higher revenue competing against us - or would it be moving in to a bigger stadium?

a simple question with a simple answer - but some are more interested in an instant and short lived success than trying to lay down the foundations on which we can start to build towards something special (and sustainable) - but then we're talking 5 years + rather than 6 months . . .

re our big players leaving - you think if any of the top table sides in Europe come calling for our stars that qualifying for the CL qualifiers every other season or so will be enough for them to turn them down? do me a favor :lol: so we qualify for the CL next season and maybe hang on to Bale for another year - all you're doing is delaying the inevitable. eventually they will leave and eventually the younger players here will become the stars and then we rinse and repeat - until we are in a new stadium and can actually build on those CL seasons they're nothing more than an experience to be savored in the moment
 
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Pirate55 said:
If we dont get a new striker and we fail to make CL (or even EL) would you still be happy to have a new stadium? Probably minus Bale as well?
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One does not necessarily lead to the other though.

Would you be happy signing a striker but not one that AVB particularly wanted? We could still miss out on Champions' League football and we might not have the money to sign players that AVB has identified and wants in the summer.
 
billyiddo said:
we've just signed Lewis Holtby from Schalke - a German International playing for a top German side who compete regularly in the Champions League.

why has he come to Spurs if the CL is the single most important thing to a footballer, why give up on playing for a big club who have several seasons in the competition under their belt and would most likely have a better chance of regular participation in the future when you factor in the competition. could it be that higher wages and the opportunity to play in the Premier League are more inciting than merely being in the CL itself?

what's our best chance at being able to offer these players more money in the future - the off chance at claiming the one realistically attainable CL place every season despite having a club with a much higher revenue competing against us - or would it be moving in to a bigger stadium?

a simple question with a simple answer - but some are more interested in an instant and short lived success than trying to lay down the foundations on which we can start to build towards something special (and sustainable) - but then we're talking 5 years + rather than 6 months . . .

re our big players leaving - you think if any of the top table sides in Europe come calling for our stars that qualifying for the CL qualifiers every other season or so will be enough for them to turn them down? do me a favor :lol: so we qualify for the CL next season and maybe hang on to Bale for another year - all you're doing is delaying the inevitable. eventually they will leave and eventually the younger players here will become the stars and then we rinse and repeat - until we are in a new stadium and can actually build on those CL seasons they're nothing more than an experience to be savored in the moment
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Get a striker in, qualify for CL, get better players in, build a stadium, re-qualify for CL. It can be a self perpetuating upward spiral. Arse have been doing it for years(and even cope with losing a virtual team of top class players). Without a financial windfall from a sheik, tycoon etc it is the only way to progress.

To fail to make CL three years running could well see the beginning of a downward spiral it will be difficult to reverse. No CL money, no sponsorship, no stadium, players leaving, midtable mediocrity.

It seems to me that to invest now in a quality striker is a minimal risk given the above risk/reward scenario.
 
Stadium first 100%.
We need to catch up with Arsenal desperately revenue wise. I hope others have seen our recent financial reports and realise that we need to up our game in that sense.
Lets just wait for Ade to come back, hopefully in improved form and keep nurturing our future crop of strikers.
 
milo said:
One does not necessarily lead to the other though.

Would you be happy signing a striker but not one that AVB particularly wanted? We could still miss out on Champions' League football and we might not have the money to sign players that AVB has identified and wants in the summer.
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Cant see that as a realistic option. Unless of course you are talking about the VDV scenario. Then the answer would by yes, yes and thrice yes.
 
Pirate55 said:
Get a striker in, qualify for CL, get better players in, build a stadium, re-qualify for CL. It can be a self perpetuating upward spiral. Arse have been doing it for years(and even cope with losing a virtual team of top class players). Without a financial windfall from a sheik, tycoon etc it is the only way to progress.

To fail to make CL three years running could well see the beginning of a downward spiral it will be difficult to reverse. No CL money, no sponsorship, no stadium, players leaving, midtable mediocrity.

It seems to me that to invest now in a quality striker is a minimal risk given the above risk/reward scenario.
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How is it a minimal risk?


That three year failure after failing to make the CL? All you are doing is accelerating that if you buy too many players and still fail to make the CL.

All you are doing is creating hypothetical situations that fit in with your beliefs and claiming that they 'will' happen!..

It's actually quite concerning..


This season without champions league we have signed Lloris, Vertonghen, Dembele, Holtby.. Is total gonad*s claiming we won't be able to keep signing good players, because why has it not stopped us thus far?
 
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Pirate55 said:
Cant see that as a realistic option. Unless of course you are talking about the VDV scenario. Then the answer would by yes, yes and thrice yes.
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Why not? It is hard to complete deals for the best players in January, particularly if you are not prepared to pay over the odds.

I think that it is entirely possible that AVB wants one of a handful of strikers that he has identified but the deals cannot be completed because of various complications (third party ownership, current club don't want to do business, asking price is too high, too much money up front...). I'm not the first to say that in this thread though.
 
Spursalot said:
How is it a minimal risk?


That three year failure after failing to make the CL? All you are doing is accelerating that if you buy too many players and still fail to make the CL.

All you are doing is creating hypothetical situations that fit in with your beliefs and claiming that they 'will' happen!..

It's actually quite concerning..


THis season without champions league we have signed Lloris, Vertonghen, Dembele, Holtby.. Is total gonad*s claiming we won't be able to keep signing good players, because why has it not stopped us thus far?
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And we have lost three world class players in King, Modric and DVD. Are any of our signings thus far up to their standards? Who next - Bale out and Raziak, Saha, Nelsen (or similar) in?

You cant keep replacing top quality with lower quality and hope to improve. It doesnt work like that.

I am staggered that people think that a strike force of Ade, Defoe and Dempsey are adequate for a club in our position going into the business end of the season.
 
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Pirate55 said:
And we have lost three world class players in King, Modric and DVD. Are any of our signings thus far up to their standards? Who next - Bale out and Raziak(or similar) in?

You cant keep replacing op quality with lower quality and hope to improve. It doesnt work like that.
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We didn't lose King or VdV because of lack of Champions League football and we couldn't have matched the money that Modric was being offered elsewhere Champions League or not.

Bale out Rasiak in? Straw man argument, when was the last time we did that?
 
Pirate55 said:
And we have lost three world class players in King, Modric and DVD. Are any of our signings thus far up to their standards? Who next - Bale out and Raziak(or similar) in?

You cant keep replacing op quality with lower quality and hope to improve. It doesnt work like that.
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None of Bale, King or Modric were world class when we signed them. You can argue that VdV was world class if you want, I don't think so and I don't much care to debate it.

We've rarely been able to sign outright world class players anyway. We must keep signing players with the potential to develop into that world class player and hope that we occasionally can pick up someone like Berba, VdV or Lloris who some will argue were world class when we signed them because we were smarter than other clubs. Both Berba and Lloris signed for us when we weren't qualified for the CL though. The point still remains the same as it is.
 
Pirate55 said:
And we have lost three world class players in King, Modric and DVD. Are any of our signings thus far up to their standards? Who next - Bale out and Raziak(or similar) in?

You cant keep replacing op quality with lower quality and hope to improve. It doesnt work like that.
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King - Vertonghen. Check (mostly because Verts is fit more often then King was)

Modric - Dembele. Check (our system has changed and Dembele is as good for this system as Modric was for our previous)

DVD (LoL) - Dempsey + Sig. Check. (Have contributed to more goals/assists than VDV last season already)


You can't replace quality with lower quality, luckily that's not what we're doing for the most part.
 
milo said:
We didn't lose King or VdV because of lack of Champions League football and we couldn't have matched the money that Modric was being offered elsewhere Champions League or not.

Bale out Rasiak in? Straw man argument, when was the last time we did that?
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saha and nelsen
 
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