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It Evens Itself Out Over A Season - The Ref's A ****

Who is the worst recent Premier League referee?

  • Howard "Red" Webb

    Votes: 24 47.1%
  • Chris "What a Foy" Foy

    Votes: 17 33.3%
  • Mark "Emotional" Clattenburg

    Votes: 3 5.9%
  • Mike "Give us a Clue" Dean

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Uriah "Two Tickets to the UR Show" Rennie

    Votes: 3 5.9%
  • Mike "Beachball" Jones

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • A.N.Other

    Votes: 4 7.8%

  • Total voters
    51
Even worse; that's AFTER the ball has been played

It's disgusting isn't it?

...and you know what, if that exact same decision had denied Man Utd/City or Chelsea a match-winning goal that could be the difference between winning the league or not winning it, you can bet your sorry ass the FA would be giving their paid for Lady-boy fluffy bunnies cuddlings the morning off to re-arrange a meeting to change the way English football is run...

I know I get a tough time for suggesting corruption or conspiracy, but tell me it ain't true... prove to me the FA DON'T have an agenda to protect the CASH COWS of the Premier League, and the disgustingly filthy rich owners who can pretty much dictate the way results and football itself works out for their own needs! Go on FA, fudging PROVE IT YOU *CORRUPT ****S!

*ALLEGEDLY AND TOTALLY WITHOUT FOUNDATION OR PROOF!! JUST A BITTER TWISTED YID WITH TOO MUCH TIME TO SPECULATE THAT bricking IN A LASAGNE, OR DISALLOWING A GOAL THAT IS SO CLEARLY OVER THE LINE AS TO BE EMBARRASSING, OR ALLOWING A GOAL WHICH IS AT BEST ON THE LINE, AND AT BEST NOWHERE NEAR IT, TO STAND IS SIMPLY PART-AND-PARCEL OF THE GAME... LIKE fudge IT IS... ONLY IF THAT GAME IS CORRUPT TO THE CORE, AND THE PEOPLE MAKING THESE DECISIONS HAVE ONLY FINANCIAL BENEFIT TO GAIN FOR ALLOWING SUCH DISGUSTING DECISIONS.

fudge off football... and to think WE'RE being slated for singing the word YID, in a world and a game SO INFLUENCED by corrupt money that they're prepare to forego basic eyesight and fair play at the expense of a fudging dodgy Middle-Easter/Russian Mafia pay packet... it's fudging warped!!
 
So did the decision cause Walker and King's terrible defending for their third goal? Or Cudicini's positioning for the 4th? Or Redknapp's terrible decision to take off VDV for Defoe?

why was that terrible - because he didn't score a hattrick - unlike the one that VDV had scored?

Oh - he hadn't, had he?
 
The worst thing about the Adebayor one is the photo is taken AFTER the ball has been played too, so he's probably even more on the moment the ball is struck
 
why was that terrible - because he didn't score a hattrick - unlike the one that VDV had scored?

Oh - he hadn't, had he?

Because we then lost all control of midfield and they scored 3 goals in 15 minutes? Going gung-ho and 4-4-2, whatever the two strikers, wasn't the solution at that point.
 
Because we then lost all control of midfield and they scored 3 goals in 15 minutes? Going gung-ho and 4-4-2, whatever the two strikers, wasn't the solution at that point.

We lost all control of the midfield from the moment the second half kicked off. The change in formation didn't change that.
 
The response. Last time I actually received a reply from Mike Riley and he took the time to clarify the specific incidents regarding Arsharvin/VDV. This time, it appears to be an almost automated response:

Thank you for your email. *
*
As you may be aware we receive numerous queries referring to individual referee's decisions and indeed in relation to their overall performance.* We are not able to comment on specific incidents such as those you raise, partly because it is only the referee who can answer questions about particular decisions and also because of the high level of correspondence we receive. We understand that it can be perplexing when there appear to be inconsistencies amongst the officials’ decisions.* Each official will have his own interpretation of an incident of course, and no two incidents are ever identical. Even where fouls look similar, the speed of the players may be different, and the referee may be in a different position with a very different viewing angle. However Professional Game Match Officials, (PGMO) the body which employs all the referees, works hard to try and ensure a consistent approach where possible.
*
We report back regularly to Professional Games Match Officials, the body which employs all the referees, to ensure that they are fully aware of all the feedback we receive. The performances of the Select Group Referees are reviewed with each referee in detail in a number of different ways, with a view to improving their performance from week to week. Contrary to popular opinion, referees are under intense scrutiny from within the game and are appropriately criticised if it is felt that an incorrect decision has been made.
*
The referee’s technical performance in a match is assessed by the Independent Assessor, and their overall handling of the match is reported on by an Independent Match Delegate, who is often a former player, manager or coach. These reports focus on the referee’s control of the match, the way that he deals with key incidents as well as the way he communicates his decisions. These reports are shared with the referees on both a formal and informal basis.
*
Whilst I cannot comment on the individual incidents you refer to, I hope the above helps to clarify how we are constantly trying to improve and maintain standards of refereeing. We would like the English style of refereeing to continue – letting the game flow as much as possible, using management skills to control players as opposed to instantly brandishing cards – but we want to also push for improvements in behaviour standards.* The game is full of passion and with very high stakes sometimes that passion spills over.
*
The Premier League is a crucial part of the association of interests that make up the FA, and we have a duty to constructively engage and support with the processes already underway aimed at creating an organisation that can represent the best of English football, at every level.
*
We will keep striving to the best we can possibly be in every area, because what we have achieved so far is something that English football should be proud of, but we recognise that there is more to be done.
*
Thank you for taking the time to contact us. We appreciate every email that reaches us, and understand the passion which you feel for the game and the future of football.
*
Kind regards,
*
Supporter Services
 
....and here's my response:

Thank you for your email. It is with disappointment that I note the generic response to the concerns I have raised, in some cases which do not address my queries sufficiently and in others are irrelevant.

However, I would like to take this opportunity to comment and seek clarification on a few of your statements:

We are not able to comment on specific incidents such as those you raise, partly because it is only the referee who can answer questions about particular decisions and also because of the high level of correspondence we receive.

Indeed, and one of the points I raised, which was not addressed, was the need for referees to publicly take responsibility for their decisions and justify their judgements explicitly, or showing they are prepared to learn from errors. Is this likely to happen and if not, why not? Your referees have a poor public image and the current wall of silence that follows every poor decision only serves to make them appear more and more stubborn and arrogant.

We understand that it can be perplexing when there appear to be inconsistencies amongst the officials’ decisions. *

I find it the exceptionally poor decision making more of a concern, rather than inconsistency. For example, Mata's goal this weekend, Mendes a few years ago, this is inconsistency for sure. But it's the sheer incompetence in the decision making that is more perplexing. Again I ask, why are the same officials still refereeing big games involving the same teams?

However Professional Game Match Officials, (PGMO) the body which employs all the referees, works hard to try and ensure a consistent approach where possible.

I'm sorry to tell you that the PGMO aren't working hard enough. The only consistency I have noticed this season are the poor offside decisions at the expense of Emmanuel Adebayor. Three incorrect calls in successive weeks is indeed quite prolific.

Contrary to popular opinion, referees are under intense scrutiny from within the game and are appropriately criticised if it is felt that an incorrect decision has been made.

Clearly the FA need to work a lot harder too to clarify what is popular opinion. I would suggest that the "appropriate [criticism]" is not sufficient to address the public perception, which is surely the responsibility of your media/PR wing.

The referee’s technical performance in a match is assessed by the Independent Assessor, and their overall handling of the match is reported on by an Independent Match Delegate, who is often a former player, manager or coach. These reports focus on the referee’s control of the match, the way that he deals with key incidents as well as the way he communicates his decisions. These reports are shared with the referees on both a formal and informal basis.

Again, greater transparency is required here. Who are these former players etc? Surely the public can get some reassurance from knowing the second opinion of a respected figure? If there is a contentious decision can they not represent the FA, by name, to support the referees judgement? In short, these formal/informal discussions should be made public.

Whilst I cannot comment on the individual incidents you refer to, I hope the above helps to clarify how we are constantly trying to improve and maintain standards of refereeing. We would like the English style of refereeing to continue – letting the game flow as much as possible, using management skills to control players as opposed to instantly brandishing cards – but we want to also push for improvements in behaviour standards.* The game is full of passion and with very high stakes sometimes that passion spills over.

None of the comments I make refer the flow of the game nor management skills in lieu of booking players. Though it would be useful to know what management skills Howard Webb employed in situations such as Lescott flooring Kaboul with an elbow to the face, or De Jong studding an opponent in a World Cup Final. I'm sure that example alone demonstrated to the globe the English style of refereeing at its best.

Again, thank you for sending your previous message.
However, I look forward to receiving a response that addresses some of the actual concerns I had raised.
 
Last edited:
But is it a coincidence that this exact thing happens to us so often?

I hate to use the example again but Norwich, away to a significantly better team, get denied a clear penalty when they're 1-0 up. Exactly 46 seconds later, its 1-1, a Defoe goal.

In that situation, do you think we would have gone on to win at OT, Stamford Bridge, Emirates, as Norwich did? Or would we have collapsed like we so often do? Then we'd all have been on here, fudging bent refs, give all the decisions to the bigger teams. Well, a couple of weeks ago, we got the decision, as the bigger team. And we stil lost.

At the Emirates, we get a penalty from a Bale dive. We're 2-0 up, with an injustice. Arsenal's confidence is shaken, if it stays like that, we're 13 points ahead of them. They've just been beaten 2-0 and 4-0 in the cups the week before. What do they do? Trounce us 5-2.

Its so easy to just blame the ref after decisions like that.

That game also had one of the worst tackles I've ever seen from Palacios btw, when it was 0-0. Ronaldo was lucky he managed to jump out of the way. I think you'll agree that playing with 10 men at OT probably wouldn't have allowed us to go 2-0 up in the first place. But Man utd got over it, went 2 goals down and then absolutely trounced us.


I do see your point mate, but i really, really felt that last Sunday, we saw the culminate frustration of a season filled with diabolical decisions. Ade has had three goals which were at least 2 yards onside chalked off; none of them even close, all obvious. We saw Shawcross punch a ball off the line with his arm. We saw Lescott forearm smash a player in the head and stay on the pitch. We saw Balotelli stamp on someone's head and stay on the pitch. We saw the phantom goal. And then the final straw was Cech clattering Ade and staying on the pitch (despite what's been said by some, there are two rules which contradict each other but would've allowed Atkinson to send him off...incidently, Bale did the right thing in scoring...he played to the whistle!)...and after that, I saw some spirit sail away...
 
bale had to put the ball in the net. would anyone have trusted atkinson to (a) give a penalty and (b) send cech off ? with his record i'd say it would have been about a 5/1 chance.
 
....and here's my response:

Thank you for your email. It is with disappointment that I note the generic response to the concerns I have raised, in some cases which do not address my queries sufficiently and in others are irrelevant.

However, I would like to take this opportunity to comment and seek clarification on a few of your statements:

We are not able to comment on specific incidents such as those you raise, partly because it is only the referee who can answer questions about particular decisions and also because of the high level of correspondence we receive.

Indeed, and one of the points I raised, which was not addressed, was the need for referees to publicly take responsibility for their decisions and justify their judgements explicitly, or showing they are prepared to learn from errors. Is this likely to happen and if not, why not? Your referees have a poor public image and the current wall of silence that follows every poor decision only serves to make them appear more and more stubborn and arrogant.

We understand that it can be perplexing when there appear to be inconsistencies amongst the officialsÔÇÖ decisions. *

I find it the exceptionally poor decision making more of a concern, rather than inconsistency. For example, Mata's goal this weekend, Mendes a few years ago, this is inconsistency for sure. But it's the sheer incompetence in the decision making that is more perplexing. Again I ask, why are the same officials still refereeing big games involving the same teams?

However Professional Game Match Officials, (PGMO) the body which employs all the referees, works hard to try and ensure a consistent approach where possible.

I'm sorry to tell you that the PGMO aren't working hard enough. The only consistency I have noticed this season are the poor offside decisions at the expense of Emmanuel Adebayor. Three incorrect calls in successive weeks is indeed quite prolific.

Contrary to popular opinion, referees are under intense scrutiny from within the game and are appropriately criticised if it is felt that an incorrect decision has been made.

Clearly the FA need to work a lot harder too to clarify what is popular opinion. I would suggest that the "appropriate [criticism]" is not sufficient to address the public perception, which is surely the responsibility of your media/PR wing.

The refereeÔÇÖs technical performance in a match is assessed by the Independent Assessor, and their overall handling of the match is reported on by an Independent Match Delegate, who is often a former player, manager or coach. These reports focus on the refereeÔÇÖs control of the match, the way that he deals with key incidents as well as the way he communicates his decisions. These reports are shared with the referees on both a formal and informal basis.

Again, greater transparency is required here. Who are these former players etc? Surely the public can get some reassurance from knowing the second opinion of a respected figure? If there is a contentious decision can they not represent the FA, by name, to support the referees judgement? In short, these formal/informal discussions should be made public.

Whilst I cannot comment on the individual incidents you refer to, I hope the above helps to clarify how we are constantly trying to improve and maintain standards of refereeing. We would like the English style of refereeing to continue ÔÇô letting the game flow as much as possible, using management skills to control players as opposed to instantly brandishing cards ÔÇô but we want to also push for improvements in behaviour standards.* The game is full of passion and with very high stakes sometimes that passion spills over.

None of the comments I make refer the flow of the game nor management skills in lieu of booking players. Though it would be useful to know what management skills Howard Webb employed in situations such as Lescott flooring Kaboul with an elbow to the face, or De Jong studding an opponent in a World Cup Final. I'm sure that example alone demonstrated to the globe the English style of refereeing at its best.

Again, thank you for sending your previous message.
However, I look forward to receiving a response that addresses some of the actual concerns I had raised.

You raised some excellent points in your emails. Fair play for the effort you clearly put into both of the emails!

Perhaps you could also ask them why Howard Webb has never been "rested" after making numerous calamitous errors in high profile games. How many more big games does he have to fudge up before they realise he isn't our best ref?
 
Anybody know if Atkinson is sitting out this weeks fixtures as punishment for 2 bad games in a row, I doubt it...
 
Would be interesting to know how many minor and major refereeing errors are made in other leagues. With this many errors involving only Spurs, I can't believe the FA have any credibility left. Given, I'm biased... but I'm not a referee.
The FA are too draconian to do anything about this though. I still think it will be years before we start seeing video replays being introduced to "help" officials.
 
Anybody know if Atkinson is sitting out this weeks fixtures as punishment for 2 bad games in a row, I doubt it...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17733839

Martin Atkinson named as fourth official for Saudi Sportswashing Machine v Stoke

Martin Atkinson will not referee an English game this weekend because of his involvement with an Olympic qualifier on Monday.

The 41-year-old will be the fourth official at Saudi Sportswashing Machine's Premier League clash with Stoke on Saturday.

Atkinson was the referee who awarded Chelsea a controversial goal that did not appear to cross the line in the 5-1 FA Cup win over Tottenham.

He will officiate at Senegal's game with Oman in Coventry.

Fifa rules mean that he cannot referee a game on the eve of a travel day for an international fixture, which still stands even though the match is at the Ricoh Arena, a decision that was made before Sunday's drama.

Atkinson has been involved in high-profile incidents this season on several occasions already.

He did not punish a high challenge by Emirates Marketing Project striker Mario Balotelli on Arsenal midfielder Alex Song last weekend.

He also sent off Everton midfielder Jack Rodwell in October's derby with Liverpool, with the red card overturned on appeal, and he failed to notice that QPR defender Clint Hill had a header which appeared to cross the line against Bolton in March.
 
The impact of poor refereeing

If this has been covered - please dump this - and my apologies for repetition

This shows we wuz robbed

look at the table at the bottom, if reading long stuff bores you
 
Wow...absolutely ridiculous isn't it?

One thing though, it says the decisions would have put us 3 points ahead of Arsenal, but the table shows us 13 ahead? Unless I've read it wrong? I guess we are supposed to be on 66 right now and not 76?
 
Wow...absolutely ridiculous isn't it?

One thing though, it says the decisions would have put us 3 points ahead of Arsenal, but the table shows us 13 ahead? Unless I've read it wrong? I guess we are supposed to be on 66 right now and not 76?

not looking at the table, multiply the points out and its a 13 point spread. Typo in the text I guess
 
Forward it to Levy.....lock him in a cupboard without food for a couple days then unleash him and stand back
 
Wow...absolutely ridiculous isn't it?

One thing though, it says the decisions would have put us 3 points ahead of Arsenal, but the table shows us 13 ahead? Unless I've read it wrong? I guess we are supposed to be on 66 right now and not 76?

Someone's just altered the table; it now has us on 72 and them on 69.
 
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