Harry Kane MBE

[Raziel]

He brought on Henderson to do that I assumed… he was woeful. Kicked quite a few passes out for throw ins
He brought on saka … still can’t work out what Formation we were playing then. He was poor. He looked scared and really didn’t settle for some time. Looked ok when he did though
He had a player who can pass and keep the ball on the bench and kept mount on way way too long
Southgate has players… he hasn’t the balls though.

Whatever credit Southgate had in the bank getting England to the final, he completely brick the bed on the big stage

- Kane actually gets away without blame for me (there have been finals he didn't turn up), his passing in the first half was world class and tore Italy open at least 3 times (goal being one)
- The issue was with 39% possession overall, and not a single teammate in the entire game got the ball to him in a dangerous position

Re Southgate

- Initial formation worked, when Italy adapted, he didn't until post goal even thought it was clear early in 2nd half England was struggling
- Late subs again, and out of all the subs, only Grealish had any impact
- Gave Sancho and Rashford zero time to get warm prior to penalties
- No understanding of why you would give a kid who hasn't even established himself in the first 11 to take the final penalty of the 5

In the role for 5 years and still has failed to get the team to understand the primary tactic needs to be -> get the ball to Kane

 

[Jurgen the German]

Phillips is a headless chicken

You have talent like Grealish/Bellingham on the bench getting a hand full of minutes and he plays every minute

Always been the way with England hasn’t it. We have a history of stifling our best attacking players, exhibit A being Glenn Hoddle. Grealish for me is our most talented player after Kane and I can’t believe the number of minutes he got in this tournament, less than the likes of Saka, Mount etc.

 

[Raziel]

I accept that and it is true but he also never takes the game by the scruff of the neck and says right I’m a world class player I’m going to win this game. He’s played in a lot of semi finals and finals now but you could count on one hand the number of times he’s played well in those games. He was brilliant for 25 mins but you barely heard his or Sterling’s name mentioned after that, unless it was trying to buy a free kick or a penalty. I have no doubt he would win trophies at bigger clubs but he wouldn’t be the main reason.

See my above post, normally I agree with Kane not doing enough, if the side barely manages 39% possession and no one passes the ball to him in final third, there is very little you can realistically expect him to do.

Sterling had an off game, same for Mount, Saka, with the subs Henderson was poor and the last two came on so late there was no point.

 

[glasgowspur]

Harry needs to learn that he can't do everything.
He is trying too hard to make up for deficiencies all across the park.
Time to realise that others aren't as good as he is but will not develop if they aren't given the chance and responsibility.
Do your job harry, let others do theirs.
They may noy be as good as you at it, but you are blunting your own talent.

 

[Raziel]

Harry needs to learn that he can't do everything.
He is trying too hard to make up for deficiencies all across the park.
Time to realise that others aren't as good as he is but will not develop if they aren't given the chance and responsibility.
Do your job harry, let others do theirs.
They may noy be as good as you at it, but you are blunting your own talent.

Fair comment but it's been shocking how little his England teammates pass to him unless he drops very deep into center midfield.

 

[scaramanga]

Fair comment but it's been shocking how little his England teammates pass to him unless he drops very deep into center midfield.

That's because we didn't have a midfield (at least, not when on the ball). Kane had to come back and be the midfield - Mount and Sterling (yet again) failed to make use of the space he made.

 

[Raziel]

That's because we didn't have a midfield (at least, not when on the ball). Kane had to come back and be the midfield - Mount and Sterling (yet again) failed to make use of the space he made.

Yep, but even on the odd occasion (not just this game), when England breaks it's amazing how Kane isn't the "first" target, even with set pieces or crosses it's clear the team isn't targeting him which is beyond comprehension.

 

[Jurgen the German]

See my above post, normally I agree with Kane not doing enough, if the side barely manages 39% possession and no one passes the ball to him in final third, there is very little you can realistically expect him to do.

Sterling had an off game, same for Mount, Saka, with the subs Henderson was poor and the last two came on so late there was no point.

Yeah for sure he didn’t get the ball enough and he was certainly much better last night than he has been in other finals but you look at his talent and you feel a little underwhelmed by his performance levels in finals. Did he have a shot in the 2nd half? Like I said previously, the only times I saw him and Sterling even mentioned after the first half was when they were trying to buy a FK or a penalty.

 

[DeanoAustin]

That's because we didn't have a midfield (at least, not when on the ball). Kane had to come back and be the midfield - Mount and Sterling (yet again) failed to make use of the space he made.

The minute I saw the midfield last night, I feared the worst. Shaw - Phillips - Rice - Tripper. Jesus Christ - in a European final? And Sterling and Mount ahead of them. Which of those 6 is ever going to dictate a game of football? I know the Trippier - Shaw combination led to the goal and Phillips and Rice weren't bad at doing what they do but that's a shocking midfield 4-6 in terms of quality on the ball. No wonder Harry didn't get a kick in their box.

England always seem to tinkle away their talented lads in that position - Hoddle and Carrick being the two biggest examples. I did think Winks had a shot at being that player for us and England but he's stagnated badly in the last 2-3 years.

 

[Raziel]

The minute I saw the midfield last night, I feared the worst. Shaw - Phillips - Rice - Tripper. Jesus Christ - in a European final? And Sterling and Mount ahead of them. Which of those 6 is ever going to dictate a game of football? I know the Trippier - Shaw combination led to the goal and Phillips and Rice weren't bad at doing what they do but that's a shocking midfield 4-6 in terms of quality on the ball. No wonder Harry didn't get a kick in their box.

England always seem to tinkle away their talented lads in that position - Hoddle and Carrick being the two biggest examples. I did think Winks had a shot at being that player for us and England but he's stagnated badly in the last 2-3 years.

Thing is (and sad part) the early goal could have made it work

- England managed the game for first 25-30 minutes well and got the lead.

What needed to happen is very early in 2nd half
- Mount needed to come off, the 5 at back need to change and Grealish needed to come on.

Instead Southgate sat like a deer in the headlights until the game momentum completely changed and still refused to leverage the bench properly.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Thing is (and sad part) the early goal could have made it work

- England managed the game for first 25-30 minutes well and got the lead.

What needed to happen is very early in 2nd half
- Mount needed to come off, the 5 at back need to change and Grealish needed to come on.

Instead Southgate sat like a deer in the headlights until the game momentum completely changed and still refused to leverage the bench properly.

Mount was awful
He is a good player, a very good one
But he was poor last night
He isn’t a player to play in a 3 up front and we had players who do exactly that wasted on the bench
The midfield wasn’t that bad IMO. I thought rice was outstanding when he was on. Winning the ball and driving with it in a way I didn’t think he could. The momentum change when Henderson came on and ran around a bit was notable
Saka is not an impact sub yet. His solid performances have been from the start
IMO at he squad is there now for England to really step up. The manager though is not ready

 

[Legohamster]

The minute I saw the midfield last night, I feared the worst. Shaw - Phillips - Rice - Tripper. Jesus Christ - in a European final? And Sterling and Mount ahead of them. Which of those 6 is ever going to dictate a game of football? I know the Trippier - Shaw combination led to the goal and Phillips and Rice weren't bad at doing what they do but that's a shocking midfield 4-6 in terms of quality on the ball. No wonder Harry didn't get a kick in their box.

England always seem to tinkle away their talented lads in that position - Hoddle and Carrick being the two biggest examples. I did think Winks had a shot at being that player for us and England but he's stagnated badly in the last 2-3 years.

Harsh on Mount, he is a very good player - he was having to try and link our play on his own for most the game - Should have been replace earlier though

Shaw and Walker have been two of our better players as well

 

[Raziel]

Harsh on Mount, he is a very good player - he was having to try and link our play on his own for most the game.

Mount is a good player, not last night.

Both him and Sterling had an off game, Southgate's mistake is you can back one player to come good in the game (he seems to trust Sterling way too much), you can't back multiple. He needed to pull one, the obvious one early was Mount (To me he needed to pull Mount, pull one of the back five, get Grealish and probably Sancho on).

 

[DeanoAustin]

Mount was awful
He is a good player, a very good one
But he was poor last night
He isn’t a player to play in a 3 up front and we had players who do exactly that wasted on the bench
The midfield wasn’t that bad IMO. I thought rice was outstanding when he was on. Winning the ball and driving with it in a way I didn’t think he could. The momentum change when Henderson came on and ran around a bit was notable
Saka is not an impact sub yet. His solid performances have been from the start
IMO at he squad is there now for England to really step up. The manager though is not ready

Rice going off didn't swing the game at all. That was on 74 mins and Italy were battering England at that point. They'd also equalised and had over 70% possession second half at that stage. Rice did well first half at breaking up play and carrying the ball down the sideline. But it rarely went anywhere other than getting England up the pitch. They needed someone with a bit of cleverness and guile on the ball that could move it quickly and get it back. They didn't have that player in the squad which was why they were reduced to chasing shadows for the second half.

Harsh on Mount, he is a very good player - he was having to try and link our play on his own for most the game - Should have been replace earlier though

Shaw and Walker have been two of our better players as well

Mount is a very good player. I agree. But England need someone in the middle of the park to dictate the game and, for whatever reason, don't have that sort of player and suffer badly for it.

 

[Legohamster]

Mount is a good player, not last night.

Both him and Sterling had an off game, Southgate's mistake is you can back one player to come good in the game (he seems to trust Sterling way too much), you can't back multiple. He needed to pull one, the obvious one early was Mount (To me he needed to pull Mount, pull one of the back five, get Grealish and probably Sancho on).

I agree, but it was right to start him -

Sterling was his frustrating Lennon/Walcott mode last night, held on to the ball to long and didnt cross when he could have.

We needed to be braver, which was never going to happen with Southgate - drop phillips and play mount/foden - then you can get another forward on.

Whats the point of having a squad if we dont use them

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Rice going off didn't swing the game at all. That was on 74 mins and Italy were battering England at that point. They'd also equalised and had over 70% possession second half at that stage. Rice did well first half at breaking up play and carrying the ball down the sideline. But it rarely went anywhere other than getting England up the pitch. They needed someone with a bit of cleverness and guile on the ball that could move it quickly and get it back. They didn't have that player in the squad which was why they were reduced to chasing shadows for the second half.



Mount is a very good player. I agree. But England need someone in the middle of the park to dictate the game and, for whatever reason, don't have that sort of player and suffer badly for it.

What hurt us was the guy who came in wasn’t effective. Rice was running past Italy players with ease. Scaring easy IMO which showed a treat dynamic. He may have tired (wasn’t obvious to me). But Henderson came in and lost the ball constantly either with poor passing or poor positioning so we conceded more and more possession
I don’t get the one session with possession. We were masters at it at Spurs… keepin the ball in infective spaces is quite easy. They were still hitting shots from distance and relying in Chiesa to do the clever play.
Even the goal they scored was relatively poor as we let a ball get flicked on, and Mount let his man get in front of him
But you change the game and the dynamic by using your bench better. Grealish is a possession based player who controls tempo when he has the ball (kinda like Chiesa did). We kept Mount on instead who was a passenger
I’m hoping Bellingham can get more games in that CM role as from what I’ve seen of him in Germany he has everything in his locker
What Southgate needs to do is realise that playing your best players can be as affective as playing your favourite, safe formation.

 

[JerusalemMan]

Rice going off didn't swing the game at all. That was on 74 mins and Italy were battering England at that point. They'd also equalised and had over 70% possession second half at that stage. Rice did well first half at breaking up play and carrying the ball down the sideline. But it rarely went anywhere other than getting England up the pitch. They needed someone with a bit of cleverness and guile on the ball that could move it quickly and get it back. They didn't have that player in the squad which was why they were reduced to chasing shadows for the second half.

Berardi for Immobile was a big game changer for the Italians. Huge shift in their ownership and use of the ball after that.
But watching how ineffective Henderson was, I'm sure Rice would have done a bit more. I don't recall him tackling or intercepting once. At least Rice did drive and dribble forward on a few occasions.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Berardi for Immobile was a big game changer for the Italians. Huge shift in their ownership and use of the ball after that.
But watching how ineffective Henderson was, I'm sure Rice would have done a bit more. I don't recall him tackling or intercepting once. At least Rice did drive and dribble forward on a few occasions.

Immobile literally lived up to his name
He has been getting a hell of a lot of abuse in Italy.
Italy threw in more midfielders and that kept the ball for them
We threw in Henderson who treated the ball like bomb and saka who looked like a 19 year old kid
Bardi said something in the extra inch pod the other week. Italy don’t take young players to tournament, they take players who know how to deal with things. It’s hurt them in some tournaments but helped them here
We had Bellingham who he seemed scared to use and sancho too who both had blinding seasons in their leagues

 

[DeanoAustin]

I'd agree on Henderson. He added less than nothing. The only logic I can see is that Southgate thought he might break up play better than Rice. Stupid sub though.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I'd agree on Henderson. He added less than nothing. The only logic I can see is that Southgate thought he might break up play better than Rice. Stupid sub though.

I think he thought his experience would help
Unfortunately his lack of composure or ability didn’t help