Ex-managers: I'm pining for the past and cannot move on

[DHSF]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

1) His short-termism is the cause of many of our problems now. Buying too many Parkers, Friedels, Defoes, Keanes, Nelsen and Sahas, and not enough Walkers and Sandros, have meant we've spent the last 2 years having to replace pretty much his entire aged squad. It was also an imbalanced squad heavily reliant of 4 superstars (3 of whom he inherited).

2) He's been a flop since he left - 1 relegation, a very botched promotion, and another relegation on the way. The same bad old traits coming to the fore (spend loads signing loads of players, tell them to run about a bit, hope a few gems will emerge from the soup to carry the team).

3) Don't forget that in his last 2 seasons, the wheels came off Redknapp teams around about February time, costing us CL qualification. He just couldn't manage a squad to compete in all competitions over a whole season.

Redknapp was always a patch over the wound. A system manager like Poch is a surgeon who will fix the underlying problems through proper structural reforms.

There's also the issue of sustainability. Redknapp's buy them in on high wages approach isn't really compatible with the austerity needed for the stadium build; whereas the Dortmund/Ajax model of organic growth by coaching youth-team products and raw bought it talent is.

Youre starting to sound like a broken record (and im using that in the most favourable manner for you). Its tedious and boring. The facts speak for themselves, we challenged we were entertaining we were all entertained. It was people on here thinking that there is better - the last three years have proved otherwise. We have regressed. We have worse players.

People keep on harping on about the likes of Crouch, Defoe et al yet Harry got those players to produce for us. Youre citing them as if they were bad players and inferior to the current crop - well I have news for you - theyre not. They were better than this lot we have masquerading as THFC footballers.

All this 4231 *******s people were seduced by. Its all *******s. Football is a simple game complicated by a bunch of idiots who think that there is more to it and seduced by it.

What is staggering is people still think we are in a better position than under Harrys regime which is ofcourse *******s and people still think that the likes of Parker and Defoe et al have been serupseded appropriately and sufficiently by the likes of Capoue and ****ing Lamela.

 

[Lemonade Money]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

We cut our nose off because it was cancerous and would have killed us from the inside out.

Yeah, we're much better off now.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

Youre starting to sound like a broken record (and im using that in the most favourable manner for you). Its tedious and boring. The facts speak for themselves, we challenged we were entertaining we were all entertained. It was people on here thinking that there is better - the last three years have proved otherwise. We have regressed. We have worse players.

People keep on harping on about the likes of Crouch, Defoe et al yet Harry got those players to produce for us. Youre citing them as if they were bad players and inferior to the current crop - well I have news for you - theyre not. They were better than this lot we have masquerading as THFC footballers.

All this 4231 *******s people were seduced by. Its all *******s. Football is a simple game complicated by a bunch of idiots who think that there is more to it and seduced by it.

What is staggering is people still think we are in a better position than under Harrys regime which is ofcourse *******s and people still think that the likes of Parker and Defoe et al have been serupseded appropriately and sufficiently by the likes of Capoue and ****ing Lamela.

Brilliant post mate.

I sometimes wonder what GB (and a few others) thoughts of Capoue, Soldado and Pochettino would be if they happened to be English and said "y'know" a few times when they spoke.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

Yeah, we're much better off now.

From what I can see we got rid of (non malignant) nose cancer and swapped it for another type of cancer that has completely got rid of our stomach for a fight.

 

[Lemonade Money]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

1) His short-termism is the cause of many of our problems now. Buying too many Parkers, Friedels, Defoes, Keanes, Nelsen and Sahas, and not enough Walkers and Sandros, have meant we've spent the last 2 years having to replace pretty much his entire aged squad. It was also an imbalanced squad heavily reliant of 4 superstars (3 of whom he inherited).

2) He's been a flop since he left - 1 relegation, a very botched promotion, and another relegation on the way. The same bad old traits coming to the fore (spend loads signing loads of players, tell them to run about a bit, hope a few gems will emerge from the soup to carry the team).

3) Don't forget that in his last 2 seasons, the wheels came off Redknapp teams around about February time, costing us CL qualification. He just couldn't manage a squad to compete in all competitions over a whole season.

Redknapp was always a patch over the wound. A system manager like Poch is a surgeon who will fix the underlying problems through proper structural reforms.

There's also the issue of sustainability. Redknapp's buy them in on high wages approach isn't really compatible with the austerity needed for the stadium build; whereas the Dortmund/Ajax model of organic growth by coaching youth-team products and raw bought it talent is.

1. One superstar is better than none. Do you think Nelsen and Saha were his first choice. I think we'd have Lescott and Song at the club now with Redknapp. That would be short term and fine by me.

2. So the championship is easy, just throw money at it and you'll come straight back up.

3. Can't argue with that but it's a tough league you know. We were competing and playing some good football.

Re: Poch the surgeon, did you say something similar about AVB? I hope Poch succeeds, but how can you **** off Harry's methods that worked, for something that hasn't been proved?

 

[Gutter Boy]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

Why do you call out Neil Warnock in particular? What makes him similar to Redknapp? I see little similarity in the sorts of players they like and the way they get their teams to play.

- They sign/stockpile loads of players, especially mature forwards - scatter gun approach
- They like a brutish British core, especially at the back
- The defence is reasonably well-drilled, but there's little overall game plan going forward
- Old school motivation and distrust of scientific approaches

I'm thinking more of Warnock's Sheff U team than Leeds or Palace (which he had less time to mould), but I'd see them as very similar to Redknapp's West Ham or Portsmouth.

can't argue with much of that GB

not sure Poch has done enough to be considered a surgeon yet but right now he is as good as anyone, he seems like he wants to do it which is a good start

I've always liked warnock, not sure if want him here though, if we did go down the old school English manager route pulis would be the best shout

I want us to stick with poch though, there is no magic button here, we need to give the manager the time and the support to rebuild the squad

Warnock and Pulis are great mid-table/relegation avoiding managers. But both would again delay the structural reforms and set us back further long term.

I've mentioned this before, but people need to look at what happened during Burkinshaw and Nicholson's first seasons in charge, when they starting introducing their systems and building the foundations for their latter successes.

Parker was a very good player for us, we had a need for a player like him, Redknapp identified that and signed him. We need more of that type of pragmatism now. Imagine if instead of having the absolutely dreadful Etienne Capoue in the team we instead had the same Scott Parker that Harry signed? We would have been so abject and gutless as we were yesterday against Stoke? Going and getting Gareth Barry in the Summer would've been a good, pragmatic option for example and provided our attacking players with a platform to play. That is the sort of signing that Redknapp would've made. There was also nothing wrong with signing Friedel at the time - a good, solid, experienced keeper who cost us nothing/almost nothing, did well for us for a few years and still serves the club today. Also I would rather have Defoe than Soldado (even now) and Keane was brought back to give some character and passion in our dressing room (something that we lack in bundles today!) Nelsen and Saha were free signings that Redknapp brought in to bolster the squad after Levy wouldn't/couldn't get him who he wanted.

I think Parker is a bit overrated because of his excellent first 3-4 months with us. I remember him having 2 good autumns, but he didn't have it in the tank anymore to play beyond Christmas.

My point was more about balance. We signed a lot of players who we could maybe eek another year out of. But nowhere near enough longer term investments like Walker and Sandro. At this point in time we actually have more players at the club who pre-date Redknapp (Lennon, Rose, Kaboul, BAE), than we do signed by him (Walker, Naughton, Friedel)

 

[Spur of the moment]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

Parker was a very good player for us, we had a need for a player like him, Redknapp identified that and signed him. We need more of that type of pragmatism now. Imagine if instead of having the absolutely dreadful Etienne Capoue in the team we instead had the same Scott Parker that Harry signed? We would have been so abject and gutless as we were yesterday against Stoke? Going and getting Gareth Barry in the Summer would've been a good, pragmatic option for example and provided our attacking players with a platform to play. That is the sort of signing that Redknapp would've made. There was also nothing wrong with signing Friedel at the time - a good, solid, experienced keeper who cost us nothing/almost nothing, did well for us for a few years and still serves the club today. Also I would rather have Defoe than Soldado (even now) and Keane was brought back to give some character and passion in our dressing room (something that we lack in bundles today!) Nelsen and Saha were free signings that Redknapp brought in to bolster the squad after Levy wouldn't/couldn't get him who he wanted.

=D>

 

[Finney Is Back]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

- They sign/stockpile loads of players, especially mature forwards - scatter gun approach
- They like a brutish British core, especially at the back
- The defence is reasonably well-drilled, but there's little overall game plan going forward
- Old school motivation and distrust of scientific approaches

I'm thinking more of Warnock's Sheff U team than Leeds or Palace (which he had less time to mould), but I'd see them as very similar to Redknapp's West Ham or Portsmouth.

In that case I think perhaps you simply fail to see what is required to be successful in football in this country.

"Brutish British core, especially at the back"..... When was Wenger's Arsenal team most successful?.... Was it with the likes of Adams, Keown and Campbell at the back? Did he seriously prolong the careers of Dixon and Winterburn? Did he bring through Ashley Cole as well? What about Chelsea - John Terry and Ashley Cole were the mainstays of their team for years - with Terry and now Cahill still being the first choice pair there. Look at Ferguson's Man Utd teams - always plethora of English defenders. Do those guys know what they are doing do you think? Could you imagine any of Ferguson, Mourinho or Wenger signing a Vlad ****ing Chiriches?!?

Why did THFC ignore Lescott this summer and instead spend £10 million on Fazio when looking for a commanding centre half who is good in the air? Which of the two of them do you think would look better for us right now? Which do you think Redknapp (or Sherwood) would've signed?

You talk about Redknapp's Pompey and West Ham.... At West Ham Redknapp signed Paulo DiCanio, a young Jermaine Defoe, a young Freddie Kanoute, a young Eyal Berkovic, a young Trevor Sinclair and brought Joe Cole through. I can't really think of the 'mature forwards' that he brought in there? Unless you mean when he brought in Ian Wright or Davor Suker as short term pragmatic signings before he could get a long term choice?

Also at Portsmouth - Redknapp brought in Defoe and Crouch who formed a brilliant partnership for them - neither were what you would call 'mature' then. More approaching (but probably not yet quite at) their peak.

Equally to say that there was little gameplan going forward with Redknapp's teams is ridiculous. Redknapp's Pompey, West Ham and Spurs teams were all excellent going forward.

Admittedly I haven't really paid too much attention to Warnock's teams - however typically he has been brought into clubs in order to gain promotion (which he is bloody good at) and then to try to keep a relegation favourite up (which he has been less good at).

Redknapp came in to our club to manage a team that was heading for the Championship (and yes it was that bad.... I was there) and he turned us around immediately so that we still had a chance of Europa League football at the end of that season. He then finished 4th in his first full season at the club. He then kept us in that area of the league with further 5th, 4th finishes. He gave our team a balance, an identity, a belief and he also made us probably the best team in the country to watch.

I find the way that you belittle this unbelievably insulting and it leads me to believe that you perhaps have little knowledge of what it takes to create a successful football team. Pragmatism might not be sexy, but some of it is always required. Our club has seriously lacked that for a few years now (other than a short spell in the second half of last season).

 

[DHSF]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

Brilliant post mate.

I sometimes wonder what GB (and a few others) thoughts of Capoue, Soldado and Pochettino would be if they happened to be English and said "y'know" a few times when they spoke.

Its absurd. Its just nonsense isnt it. We are the architects of our own downfall. We have this vision of where we want to be (great) but we also have fallen in love with this idea of what kind of Manager we think will get us there but in actual fact that kind of Manager (Harry) didnt fit in with that idea. Its like going out with a girl who makes you the happiest youve been but because she doesnt fit in with the tal blonde criteria you had you ditch her for a tall blonde only to find out that actually she has bored you to death. cut nose off to spite your face and all that ****e.

Then TS came and some of us on here thought he deserved a chance and whilst it wasnt the best it was far far better than this ****e in a short space of time and in difficult circumstances. Yes he also didnt fit the ideaology of what others have been seduced by in the qualities wanted in a Manager. I just find it unfathomable that people still stick to their guns and still think we are in a more improved position. Our squad is devoid of quality, class and motivation.

Now do I blame Poch? no not at all. Do I blame AVB? yep to an extent. Do I blame Baldini and Levy? **** yeah. They have to be held accountable for the demise of the quality of our squad and essentially ripping out any heart (Dawson, Defoe, Livermore, Thudd and even the likes of VDV et) and bringing in alot of ****e. Not every signing has been poor eg Lloris but majority have been.

The doule act have to be held accountable for somewhat poor choices. But what will we do? Yep in six to eight games we will sack Poch and go full circle and getting in some Manager to galvanise the squad and turns out theyre all ****e and the cycle continues. I wouldnt be surprised if Pulis at some point comes in - that will be funny.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

In that case I think perhaps you simply fail to see what is required to be successful in football in this country.

"Brutish British core, especially at the back"..... When was Wenger's Arsenal team most successful?.... Was it with the likes of Adams, Keown and Campbell at the back? Did he seriously prolong the careers of Dixon and Winterburn? Did he bring through Ashley Cole as well? What about Chelsea - John Terry and Ashley Cole were the mainstays of their team for years - with Terry and now Cahill still being the first choice pair there. Look at Ferguson's Man Utd teams - always plethora of English defenders. Do those guys know what they are doing do you think? Could you imagine any of Ferguson, Mourinho or Wenger signing a Vlad ****ing Chiriches?!?

Why did THFC ignore Lescott this summer and instead spend £10 million on Fazio when looking for a commanding centre half who is good in the air? Which of the two of them do you think would look better for us right now? Which do you think Redknapp (or Sherwood) would've signed?

You talk about Redknapp's Pompey and West Ham.... At West Ham Redknapp signed Paulo DiCanio, a young Jermaine Defoe, a young Freddie Kanoute, a young Eyal Berkovic, a young Trevor Sinclair and brought Joe Cole through. I can't really think of the 'mature forwards' that he brought in there? Unless you mean when he brought in Ian Wright or Davor Suker as short term pragmatic signings before he could get a long term choice?

Also at Portsmouth - Redknapp brought in Defoe and Crouch who formed a brilliant partnership for them - neither were what you would call 'mature' then. More approaching (but probably not yet quite at) their peak.

Equally to say that there was little gameplan going forward with Redknapp's teams is ridiculous. Redknapp's Pompey, West Ham and Spurs teams were all excellent going forward.

Admittedly I haven't really paid too much attention to Warnock's teams - however typically he has been brought into clubs in order to gain promotion (which he is bloody good at) and then to try to keep a relegation favourite up (which he has been less good at).

Redknapp came in to our club to manage a team that was heading for the Championship (and yes it was that bad.... I was there) and he turned us around immediately so that we still had a chance of Europa League football at the end of that season. He then finished 4th in his first full season at the club. He then kept us in that area of the league with further 5th, 4th finishes. He gave our team a balance, an identity, a belief and he also made us probably the best team in the country to watch.

I find the way that you belittle this unbelievably insulting and it leads me to believe that you perhaps have little knowledge of what it takes to create a successful football team. Pragmatism might not be sexy, but some of it is always required. Our club has seriously lacked that for a few years now (other than a short spell in the second half of last season).

You do know that England's current CBs are Cahill, Jagielka, Jones and Smalling?!

I loved Dawson and am excited by Dier (and Stones and Gomez), but England's current mature crop of CBs are absolutely terrible.

Redknapp underperformed with the squad he had at his disposal. We've not had 4 world class players in the team for decades (Jol only had 2 [LK, DB], Venables 2 [PG, GL], Pleat 2 [GH, CW]). Yet we have no silverware to show for it.

 

[Mulletperm]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

In that case I think perhaps you simply fail to see what is required to be successful in football in this country.

"Brutish British core, especially at the back"..... When was Wenger's Arsenal team most successful?.... Was it with the likes of Adams, Keown and Campbell at the back? Did he seriously prolong the careers of Dixon and Winterburn? Did he bring through Ashley Cole as well? What about Chelsea - John Terry and Ashley Cole were the mainstays of their team for years - with Terry and now Cahill still being the first choice pair there. Look at Ferguson's Man Utd teams - always plethora of English defenders. Do those guys know what they are doing do you think? Could you imagine any of Ferguson, Mourinho or Wenger signing a Vlad ****ing Chiriches?!?

Why did THFC ignore Lescott this summer and instead spend £10 million on Fazio when looking for a commanding centre half who is good in the air? Which of the two of them do you think would look better for us right now? Which do you think Redknapp (or Sherwood) would've signed?

You talk about Redknapp's Pompey and West Ham.... At West Ham Redknapp signed Paulo DiCanio, a young Jermaine Defoe, a young Freddie Kanoute, a young Eyal Berkovic, a young Trevor Sinclair and brought Joe Cole through. I can't really think of the 'mature forwards' that he brought in there? Unless you mean when he brought in Ian Wright or Davor Suker as short term pragmatic signings before he could get a long term choice?

Also at Portsmouth - Redknapp brought in Defoe and Crouch who formed a brilliant partnership for them - neither were what you would call 'mature' then. More approaching (but probably not yet quite at) their peak.

Equally to say that there was little gameplan going forward with Redknapp's teams is ridiculous. Redknapp's Pompey, West Ham and Spurs teams were all excellent going forward.

Admittedly I haven't really paid too much attention to Warnock's teams - however typically he has been brought into clubs in order to gain promotion (which he is bloody good at) and then to try to keep a relegation favourite up (which he has been less good at).

Redknapp came in to our club to manage a team that was heading for the Championship (and yes it was that bad.... I was there) and he turned us around immediately so that we still had a chance of Europa League football at the end of that season. He then finished 4th in his first full season at the club. He then kept us in that area of the league with further 5th, 4th finishes. He gave our team a balance, an identity, a belief and he also made us probably the best team in the country to watch.

I find the way that you belittle this unbelievably insulting and it leads me to believe that you perhaps have little knowledge of what it takes to create a successful football team. Pragmatism might not be sexy, but some of it is always required. Our club has seriously lacked that for a few years now (other than a short spell in the second half of last season).

That is a cracking post. =D>

 

[Roy1983]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

You do know that England's current CBs are Cahill, Jagielka, Jones and Smalling?!

I loved Dawson and am excited by Dier (and Stones and Gomez), but England's current mature crop of CBs are absolutely terrible.

Redknapp underperformed with the squad he had at his disposal. We've not had 4 world class players in the team for decades (Jol only had 2 [LK, DB], Venables 2 [PG, GL], Pleat 2 [GH, CW]). Yet we have no silverware to show for it.

Sorry but it's doing my head in who's DB under Jol?

 

[a spur from swansea]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

Youre starting to sound like a broken record (and im using that in the most favourable manner for you). Its tedious and boring. The facts speak for themselves, we challenged we were entertaining we were all entertained. It was people on here thinking that there is better - the last three years have proved otherwise. We have regressed. We have worse players.

People keep on harping on about the likes of Crouch, Defoe et al yet Harry got those players to produce for us. Youre citing them as if they were bad players and inferior to the current crop - well I have news for you - theyre not. They were better than this lot we have masquerading as THFC footballers.

All this 4231 *******s people were seduced by. Its all *******s. Football is a simple game complicated by a bunch of idiots who think that there is more to it and seduced by it.

What is staggering is people still think we are in a better position than under Harrys regime which is ofcourse *******s and people still think that the likes of Parker and Defoe et al have been serupseded appropriately and sufficiently by the likes of Capoue and ****ing Lamela.

Well said mate their are some people who spend far too much time playing soccer manager in their spurs tracksuit,thinking they are some clever dingdong in tactics and how we should play,end of the day who gives a toss on how a manager comes across on tv and in the press if he can take us into top 4 playing attcking entertaining football then he'll do for me......harry did that,who did that in the previous ten years no one, whose done it since no one,where are we now back in the same position when harry took over,yeah yeah give or take on some league points.....

Levy and lewis the chuckle brothers of how to run a football club,stick to counting the beans they should do,employ a MD with someone football knowledge let them take control on all football matters give them carte blance along with the manager in buying(of coarse within reason)and selling players with the manager having the final say....

My scenario would have been to have given harry a rolling one year contract with the idea of someone in the background being bedded in sometime in the future with the same philosophy in how to play as what has happened down here in swansea,playing the same way with the manager being told this how we play,in the last four years we've had four different styles,meaning four different groups of players having been bought,we're just going around in circles.

 

[a spur from swansea]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

In that case I think perhaps you simply fail to see what is required to be successful in football in this country.

"Brutish British core, especially at the back"..... When was Wenger's Arsenal team most successful?.... Was it with the likes of Adams, Keown and Campbell at the back? Did he seriously prolong the careers of Dixon and Winterburn? Did he bring through Ashley Cole as well? What about Chelsea - John Terry and Ashley Cole were the mainstays of their team for years - with Terry and now Cahill still being the first choice pair there. Look at Ferguson's Man Utd teams - always plethora of English defenders. Do those guys know what they are doing do you think? Could you imagine any of Ferguson, Mourinho or Wenger signing a Vlad ****ing Chiriches?!?

Why did THFC ignore Lescott this summer and instead spend £10 million on Fazio when looking for a commanding centre half who is good in the air? Which of the two of them do you think would look better for us right now? Which do you think Redknapp (or Sherwood) would've signed?

You talk about Redknapp's Pompey and West Ham.... At West Ham Redknapp signed Paulo DiCanio, a young Jermaine Defoe, a young Freddie Kanoute, a young Eyal Berkovic, a young Trevor Sinclair and brought Joe Cole through. I can't really think of the 'mature forwards' that he brought in there? Unless you mean when he brought in Ian Wright or Davor Suker as short term pragmatic signings before he could get a long term choice?

Also at Portsmouth - Redknapp brought in Defoe and Crouch who formed a brilliant partnership for them - neither were what you would call 'mature' then. More approaching (but probably not yet quite at) their peak.

Equally to say that there was little gameplan going forward with Redknapp's teams is ridiculous. Redknapp's Pompey, West Ham and Spurs teams were all excellent going forward.

Admittedly I haven't really paid too much attention to Warnock's teams - however typically he has been brought into clubs in order to gain promotion (which he is bloody good at) and then to try to keep a relegation favourite up (which he has been less good at).

Redknapp came in to our club to manage a team that was heading for the Championship (and yes it was that bad.... I was there) and he turned us around immediately so that we still had a chance of Europa League football at the end of that season. He then finished 4th in his first full season at the club. He then kept us in that area of the league with further 5th, 4th finishes. He gave our team a balance, an identity, a belief and he also made us probably the best team in the country to watch.

I find the way that you belittle this unbelievably insulting and it leads me to believe that you perhaps have little knowledge of what it takes to create a successful football team. Pragmatism might not be sexy, but some of it is always required. Our club has seriously lacked that for a few years now (other than a short spell in the second half of last season).

Again well said mate.

 

[mudshark]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

I wouldnt be surprised if Pulis at some point comes in - that will be funny.

Me neither. It'd be even more hilarious if we got caught tapping up Koeman, though.

Edit: not that we would, of course; that'd be against the rules, obviously....

 

[Danners9]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

The answer is yes, it was the right thing to do, despite performances declining. It's not like Harry was the best manager in the world, so let's not pretend otherwise.

If he hadn't taken his eye off the ball, we wouldn't have fallen away two seasons in succession. With those players available, he should have been able to achieve something - not lose a crap semi final to Portsmouth, and not pick up a relegation-form points total from the last few months in two consecutive seasons.

He ran players into the ground, overusing and not being aware of their conditions. His constant deflection of defeats, criticism of players like Bent (although it was a horrible miss), make crass comments in the media, almost trying to sell players through the media and sounding out other jobs while employed by Spurs.

Imagine if Spurs had those players now.. the reason for what has happened since is not because of sacking Redknapp, the club needed to move on from him, but in what actually happened - a poor manager, a poor caretaker, poor signings and seemingly trying to do everything cheaply.

The blame lies in the boardroom, and the head of the table, Mr Levy.

 

[billyiddo]

So, the big elephant in the room...

Youre starting to sound like a broken record (and im using that in the most favourable manner for you). Its tedious and boring. The facts speak for themselves, we challenged we were entertaining we were all entertained. It was people on here thinking that there is better - the last three years have proved otherwise. We have regressed. We have worse players.

People keep on harping on about the likes of Crouch, Defoe et al yet Harry got those players to produce for us. Youre citing them as if they were bad players and inferior to the current crop - well I have news for you - theyre not. They were better than this lot we have masquerading as THFC footballers.

All this 4231 *******s people were seduced by. Its all *******s. Football is a simple game complicated by a bunch of idiots who think that there is more to it and seduced by it.

What is staggering is people still think we are in a better position than under Harrys regime which is ofcourse *******s and people still think that the likes of Parker and Defoe et al have been serupseded appropriately and sufficiently by the likes of Capoue and ****ing Lamela.

You've totally missed the point of GBs post - Crouch Parker etc were all good players who done a job but there's only so far you can go if your transfer policy is signing older experienced pro's on high wages - That policy will work great if you have a ton of money and several class players to make the difference - is it a simple coincidence that every club Redknapp has left has suffered in the immediate aftermath? Clubs which gave him free reign suffered financial ruin whilst we were left with a rebuilding job once the old pros tailed off and the top class players moved on.

I see you mention cause and effect in another post (i think it was you) well i think some of you need to look at the cause and effect of the Redknapp era rather than simply look at the league positions and nothing else.

 

[DHSF]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

The answer is yes, it was the right thing to do, despite performances declining. It's not like Harry was the best manager in the world, so let's not pretend otherwise.

If he hadn't taken his eye off the ball, we wouldn't have fallen away two seasons in succession. With those players available, he should have been able to achieve something - not lose a crap semi final to Portsmouth, and not pick up a relegation-form points total from the last few months in two consecutive seasons.

He ran players into the ground, overusing and not being aware of their conditions. His constant deflection of defeats, criticism of players like Bent (although it was a horrible miss), make crass comments in the media, almost trying to sell players through the media and sounding out other jobs while employed by Spurs.

Imagine if Spurs had those players now.. the reason for what has happened since is not because of sacking Redknapp, the club needed to move on from him, but in what actually happened - a poor manager, a poor caretaker, poor signings and seemingly trying to do everything cheaply.

The blame lies in the boardroom, and the head of the table, Mr Levy.

This is the problem here... just because he wasnt the best Manager in the world doesnt mean he wasnt the right one for us. Its all about fit. Like my analogy you dont have to go for the sexiest girl in the world to have a happy successful relationship.

Youre citing all those reasons (some are correct and warranted) but so what? he still produced. Like you said he wasnt the best Manager in the world but he was certainly the best for us - thats what is most important and seems that alot of people are missing or ignoring.

You say that what happened after the sacking is down to poor choices which is fine and totally agree but then the accountability lies with Levy et al and they have had two chances to rectify it and a dozen more before Harry. Right now we have a totally quality devoid squad, ****e football and a Manager who needs to rectify all the ****e decisions by Baldini et al and that in itself is the issue. I dont blame Poch (his team selection is bizarre at times) and will need time but I just find it strange that people still persist with the reasons that are given in your post as the justification for not only sacking Harry but the justification of why we are here right now.

Ill tell you what the issue is, we have a general football forum where we have fans laughing at other clubs and spending time on dissecting other clubs performance when closer to home is the real issue. Glass houses stones throw etc etc etc

 

[DHSF]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

You've totally missed the point of GBs post - Crouch Parker etc were all good players who done a job but there's only so far you can go if your transfer policy is signing older experienced pro's on high wages - That policy will work great if you have a ton of money and several class players to make the difference - is it a simple coincidence that every club Redknapp has left has suffered in the immediate aftermath? Clubs which gave him free reign suffered financial ruin whilst we were left with a rebuilding job once the old pros tailed off a d the top class players moved on.

I see you mention cause and effect in another poster (i think it was you) well i think some of you need to look at the cause and effect of the Redknapp era rather than simply look at the league positions and nothing else.

Yes it wasnt sustainable but like I say firstly they got us to where we wanted to in a shortish space of time and secondly I think Harry will have changed this policy if given the cash - dont forget he did identify the like sof Vertonghen who was coming in anyways.

I am sure his remit was to do something short term as we were in a bad state and he did that. He got us playing, successful in a fairly quick time. Its all about stages and developing. We didnt give him a chance to do that in the summer he was sacked.

Do you think we have a better squad now than under Harry? even with the 100m spent from Bale? No. We have worse players and very much doubt that Harry will have had our squad this bad. Thats the important thing here. Dont forget Harrys buys were sold for a fair amount of money so not like we just spunked 100m. Crouch, Defoe and others were sold for similiar values or even marginally more than their cost price.

Its not just league position, our football was better, team spirit was excellent, our stock was high and players seemed motivated. Instead right now we have players who im sick of, an unmotivated squad who dont seem to be enjoying being at the club and a 100m worse off. Not sure how in any way we are better off... financially? no because our 100m purchases are worth not even half that. Our stock? gone down. Stadium development? yes progressed but not much to do with the football on the pitch and to be honest right now we wouldnt fill it.

 

[Shelfie]

Re: So, the big elephant in the room...

At the time I thought it was the correct decision, in retrospect maybe I, and the club, was wrong. But 'what ifs' are so hard to quantify in a situation so full of variables as this question raises.