AVB - I want him out now!

[90291Spur]

AVB was a football fan who bumped into Bobby Robson and then became something else. Jose M was an interpreter


My point was of course half meant figuratively ,but not entirely . Because what you are saying, taken to its logical conclusion is - no matter how bad AVB does, no non manager could have done any better. I don't believe that .

As I said offensively , it would have been hard to worse than 6 goals from open play in 11 games.

The Southampton manager can't speak a word of English, many would have said that would have prohibited him from doing a good job.

Thanks for the reply. We will have to agree to disagree as to whether a non-manager would do better as there is no way to prove it. I will say that AVB, despite starting off as a fan and not a footballer, has spent a lot of time immersed at football clubs under very good managers - Robson, Jose - and is not just a random with no experience of what the inner workings of a football club are.

And the Southampton manager speaks English pretty well, he just chooses not to conduct post-match interview in English (they spoke about this in the current Guardian football weekly podcast). And I watched Cardiff Swansea and Mackay had a Korean interpreter before he brought on a Korean sub.

 

[Mumorn]

Thanks for the reply. We will have to agree to disagree as to whether a non-manager would do better as there is no way to prove it. I will say that AVB, despite starting off as a fan and not a footballer, has spent a lot of time immersed at football clubs under very good managers - Robson, Jose - and is not just a random with no experience of what the inner workings of a football club are.

And the Southampton manager speaks English pretty well, he just chooses not to conduct post-match interview in English (they spoke about this in the current Guardian football weekly podcast). And I watched Cardiff Swansea and Mackay had a Korean interpreter before he brought on a Korean sub.

yeah, Pocettino does speak good English. I havent seen the podcast on why he chooses to use an interpreter when it comes to the interview at the end of the game but his English is good.

 

[milo]

yeah, Pocettino does speak good English. I havent seen the podcast on why he chooses to use an interpreter when it comes to the interview at the end of the game but his English is good.

It could well be that he does not want to speak to the media and who could blame him?

 

[Jurgen the German]

You are right, we were five points up on our total this season in 2011/12

http://www.myfootballfacts.com/TottenhamHotspurPremierLeaguePointsWon.html

I agree that league position is important but I would go further and say that it is really only the final league placing that counts

Agree 100%

 

[Mumorn]

It could well be that he does not want to speak to the media and who could blame him?

touche

 

[milo]

touche

I'm serious, there have been plenty of foreign managers who have been slaughtered by the tabloids because of their English in interviews. There is a heavy streak of xenophobia that runs through our tabloids and many football pundits.

 

[90291Spur]

I'm serious, there have been plenty of foreign managers who have been slaughtered by the tabloids because of their English in interviews. There is a heavy streak of xenophobia that runs through our tabloids and many football pundits.

That was what exactly what they said on The Guardian podcast. He does it to not get slaughtered.

 

[thfcsteff]

I understand it, but that doesn't make me like it, also now the results aren't that great although I still understand what and why AVB is doing but I've lost faith in it and it's precisely because I understand what's going on that I see it's not in my opinion going to change.

1) I will do
2) I don't know, I don't subscribe to the theory that just because you want a manager out you have to have an idea as to who to get in - that's Levy & Baldini's job!

There are candidates out there though!

This is CLASSIC middle-management commentary on 'creative' matters…they always know what they DON'T want but they seem to actually know what they DO want. It's silly. How on earth can you NOT have an idea who you'd bring in?

 

[thfcsteff]

I personally don't think AVB should get the excuse that he is 'young and feeling the pressure' because it's absolutely irrelevant to me as a fan and to the club. As has been said, he is paid a lot of money to manage an ambitious elite football team. Youth and pressure don't really come into it and they shouldn't do. I expect him to perform as a good 70 year old would.

The difference is I don't think he is necessarily feeling the pressure per se. Scared of losing, very probably. But I think that's because he knows that during a period of transition you need the squad to buy into what you are doing, especially at a club that expects results. He saw at Chelsea that if he wasn't getting results, players were giving up on him and it's not easy to get that trust back. It's the same thing wth us, despite only finishing in the top 4 twice we are expected to be up there every season, that is way more expectation than even Liverpool and if we were falling way behind then the squad wouldn't buy into the transition. Another reason is that we let Harry go to bring him in, so that move has to be justified in terms of results if not style immediately.

The difference with Liverpool is Rodgers could try his desired style straight away without that pressure on results because they hadn't achieved anything the year before. Sure enough they started poorly and finished 7th. This year they have started well but did not lose anyone key and did not make wholesale changes to the squad, especially in an attacking sense, like we did. They've been able to build on what they had and kept Suarez. No surprise them and Arsenal are looking strongest right now but I fully expect Liverpool to have a fairly big dip in form akin to us 2 years ago at some point. It looks simple enough what they are doing right now - flood forward and let the strikers score - but we had good players like that in a similar gameplan and we can still stutter.

But they absolutely do!

That's just life. The more experience you accumulate, the better you become at handling situations and events. AVB is a great manager now IMO, just imagine what he could become, though I suspect he will be long gone from management by the time his 60s roll around...

 

[thfcsteff]

Yes , with help from coaching staff. I don't think they could do much worse - give me £140m to spend and I could come up with a better X1 than the one he picked for Saudi Sportswashing Machine.

BTW - that is all AVB is, a football fan who bumped into Bobby Robson one day.

No you couldn't! You couldn't even close a deal! Please! Enough of this 'I could do that'…if you really believe that, I will make the same suggestion I've made to others in the past, present yourself at the club offices asnthe new manager, coach or DoF. Demand the purse strings. And away you go. Tell you what, in the interests of indulgence, let's see your break-down of how you would spend 140 million pounds? Go on. I'll even give you two windows and guess what, you don't have to sell anyone!

 

[kanoute16]

It's boring, uninteresting and dull! It's ok if you sit at home watching spurs on an internet stream which you so obviously do but for us paying fans it's very frustrating!

A win cannot mask the reality, our style of play is awful and we are not winning that many games playing this way.

I think there are many posters who are desperate to cling onto whole that avb has a plan and it will work but personally I any see it.

 

[thfcsteff]

It's boring, uninteresting and dull! It's ok if you sit at home watching spurs on an internet stream which you so obviously do but for us paying fans it's very frustrating!

A win cannot mask the reality, our style of play is awful and we are not winning that many games playing this way.

I think there are many posters who are desperate to cling onto whole that avb has a plan and it will work but personally I any see it.

Who are you talking to?
Me?
Do I know you?
Do you know me?
Nah, didn't think so
If aimed at me, you're welcome to apologise for the bolded comment now.
By the way, in the last two seasons I estimate I've spent about 4 grand going to various games home and away when time (and budget -as it could be called!) has allowed. Before that? Wouldn't like to guess. What's your 'paying fan' outlay been in that similar time frame?

 

[Mulletperm]

It's boring, uninteresting and dull! It's ok if you sit at home watching spurs on an internet stream which you so obviously do but for us paying fans it's very frustrating!

A win cannot mask the reality, our style of play is awful and we are not winning that many games playing this way.

I think there are many posters who are desperate to cling onto whole that avb has a plan and it will work but personally I any see it.

Hugely presumptious

 

[BrainOfLevy]

But they absolutely do!

That's just life. The more experience you accumulate, the better you become at handling situations and events. AVB is a great manager now IMO, just imagine what he could become, though I suspect he will be long gone from management by the time his 60s roll around...

The way I look at it, I don't think age and experience are contributing or deciding factors towards success. I agree that you will learn some new things as you get older that can contribute, but I don't think it makes a difference.

And that's because a new young manager will often have new ideas and be 'ahead of his time' so to speak in terms of his approach. An experience manager is likely to be more set in their ways and more unable to change and adapt to what is required. They may have had more exposure to different diruations but I think as to whether they means they will be more successful...not really because the benefits of youth and new ideas will combat the disadvantages of experienced rigidity.

I don't look upon AVBs achievements at Porto and think 'great that he won a treble and went undefeated...even better that we was so young' because it was simply a great acheofement in its own right. The fact that he was young probably contributed towards his success, in that he thought about the game in a different way to his peers. And similarly with us, I don't advocate giving him time because he's young and needs to learn, I want to give him time because if we are to compete at the top level and punch above our weight we need to do what Swansea did and establish something long term that gives us different advantages.

You may point to his experiences at Chelsea and I would agree, he came here and approached things differently because he had that experience. But really there are a myriad of reasons why a more experienced manager's face will not fit in one club or another and they can fail too. Kenny Dalglish was very experienced and ingrained in the culture of their club but that didn't stop him wasting money and finishing 8th.

Managerial ability, and cultural fit with the club are what matters IMO. Youth and inexperience evens itself out against age and experience and neither are more likely to be successful, and neither are more or less deserving of time. AVB deserves it because he is good, not because he is young. And when he gets more experienced and we reap the benefits of that, there will be some new young manager at some other club that is able to outwit him because he has no ideas. And the cycle will continue.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Ahh there are a lot of spelling mistakes there...bloody iPhone! Basically the last sentence should read 'new' ideas.

 

[Spurs7891]

Must say, can't help but worried about AVB's future at Spurs now. Levy has proven many times that he can sack a manager anytime he wants, regardless of what the manager has achieved or how it will affect us. Remember GG, Jol and even Redknapp ? And Levy didn't look too impressed during the Saudi Sportswashing Machine match. Now everytime you open a football site like Soccernet, can't help but worried might see a title like "AVB sacked by Spurs, Spurs looking for new manager!"#-o

 

[Jurgen the German]

But they absolutely do!

That's just life. The more experience you accumulate, the better you become at handling situations and events. AVB is a great manager now IMO, just imagine what he could become, though I suspect he will be long gone from management by the time his 60s roll around...

Sorry dude but I really don't agree that AVB is a great manager. Good manager yes, but not great. He's not been around long enough or achieved enough frankly to be considered great.

 

[mudshark]

BTW - that is all AVB is, a football fan who bumped into Bobby Robson one day.

I'd say he was a football nerd, rather than a fan. In fact, the reason I was reserved about his initial appointment was the sneaking suspicion he might be borderline Asperger's

Can't agree with your 'any reasonable, intelligent football fan' comments, though, for all that. AVB is far and away beyond punter status now.

 

[indianspur]

It could well be that he does not want to speak to the media and who could blame him?

if his english is good then he could speak to the media in english....its more likely he is only able to say certain things in english related to training and tactics and that helps him get by.

some people find it difficult with languages, no shame in that

 

[indianspur]

But they absolutely do!

That's just life. The more experience you accumulate, the better you become at handling situations and events. AVB is a great manager now IMO, just imagine what he could become, though I suspect he will be long gone from management by the time his 60s roll around...

lets not throw the word "great" around so easily

id say he is a good manager, successful in Portugal but still with plenty to prove in the PL. Time will tell if he becomes great