Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

[StephenH]

You mean show a little irritation because the same question is being asked again and again?

Bless him! He showed weakness.
I don't want a snowflake for the manager.
The players will take one look and say WTF!
He has now looked like he has a word with himself and is much better, long may it continue.
My worse fears are you can't put that genie back in the bottle. Players are like the rest of us and can be so mercurial and easily upset.

 

[Nigeyman]

Haha, you sound so draconian! Still, when men were men eh?!!!!!!

By the way, your club’s success has been elevated so far beyond you could’ve expected a decade ago that you’ve lost all sight of perspective.

Come and go on about Poch’s “stupidty” in May will you? Let’s give it the season to see how that comment pans out...

...in fairness, this has been your most Cooganesque post for some time, and if I read it with a Coogan/Partridge voice, then it is much easier.

A decade go we had won a trophy the previous season, so me personally I was bouncing. Though the following season came the old legendary 2 points from 8 games scenario, with an sos to arry...

He’s had plenty of time mate, less than Klopp and look at their improvements and state of identity compared to ours...and yes I factor in he’s been financially backed.

Salary doesn’t matter but whether your leading a team to the fa vase final or ucl final, talking about leaving is wholly inappropriate to me personally.

And yes steff, you have offered up criticism of Poch recently, replying to one of my long winded rants, so fair play to you on that score...

I do at least know you feel he isn’t getting the best out of Kane.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Where?

He said above that he genuinely can’t think of another coach who has rambled onto the media like Poch... Mou has most definitely

 

[Bedfordspurs]

A decade go we had won a trophy the previous season, so me personally I was bouncing. Though the following season came the old legendary 2 points from 8 games scenario, with an sos to arry...

He’s had plenty of time mate, less than Klopp and look at their improvements and state of identity compared to ours...and yes I factor in he’s been financially backed.

Salary doesn’t matter but whether your leading a team to the fa vase final or ucl final, talking about leaving is wholly inappropriate to me personally.

And yes steff, you have offered up criticism of Poch recently, replying to one of my long winded rants, so fair play to you on that score...

I do at least know you feel he isn’t getting the best out of Kane.

Klopp is an interesting comparison as basically until they won the CL vs us he was actually doing no better than Poch
He had his team get second place
He has the advantage of teams beat him faltering (like we had a times too)
He also failed to win cup finals
But now he has a BIG trophy won there... again IMO fortunately as the ref made a big error that killed the game but no one can argue that they were not much better than us last season
If he hadn’t won the CL you could argue that despite spending millions he hadn’t got his team over the line

 

[StephenH]

He said above that he genuinely can’t think of another coach who has rambled onto the media like Poch... Mou has most definitely

Who said?
Me Said?


EDIT - he's turning the corner now - Lets all give a virtual cuddle and move on

 

[fernadez]

Klopp is an interesting comparison as basically until they won the CL vs us he was actually doing no better than Poch
He had his team get second place
He has the advantage of teams beat him faltering (like we had a times too)
He also failed to win cup finals
But now he has a BIG trophy won there... again IMO fortunately as the ref made a big error that killed the game but no one can argue that they were not much better than us last season
If he hadn’t won the CL you could argue that despite spending millions he hadn’t got his team over the line

Apart from the fact his team has a sustained identity they haven't deviated from. The style of play suits the players they have.

Not quite being good enough is something fans can live with if they feel understanding with the direction of the team. In previous seasons we were happy cause we had an identity on and off the pitch. The whistle went and you knew what you were getting from Tottenham. Now it's a lottery, and unfortunately you can tell now what sort of performance we are going to put in within 5 mins of a game kicking off.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Apart from the fact his team has a sustained identity they haven't deviated from. The style of play suits the players they have.

Not quite being good enough is something fans can live with if they feel understanding with the direction of the team. In previous seasons we were happy cause we had an identity on and off the pitch. The whistle went and you knew what you were getting from Tottenham. Now it's a lottery, and unfortunately you can tell now what sort of performance we are going to put in within 5 mins of a game kicking off.

Exactly
We had an identity but it’s been lost in transit almost

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Who said?
Me Said?


EDIT - he's turning the corner now - Lets all give a virtual cuddle and move on

No
Not you

 

[elltrev]

That's only the case if you give weighting to the on field decision.

I don't think any weight at all should be given to the on field decision and the VAR refs should be free to make the most accurate decision they can.

That's fine that you think that, but I think the point is that the current system is giving huge weighting to all other decisions, but zero weighting to offside decisions, seemingly on the arguably flawed premise that there is zero ambiguity on whether or not a player is offside. So for me it's the inconsistency that's the issue.

I think a separate issue is a purely subjective one, on whether you place higher value on decisions being correct vs the game being more free-flowing and natural. I can certainly empathise with people who feel that a 3 minute delay to spot someone being a cm or two offside diminishes the spirit of the game. But I think that's purely a matter of personal taste.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

Mauricio Pochettino still Real Madrid's No.1 choice to replace under-fire Zinedine Zidane
Zinedine Zidane is already under pressure at the Bernabeu and Florentino Perez remains keen on the Spurs boss

By John CrossChief Football Writer

Real Madrid are ready to make a fresh approach for Mauricio Pochettino.

The Spanish giants will make the Tottenham boss their No.1 target if they decide to replace Zinedine Zidane this season.

Real Madrid boss Zidane guided his team into second place in La Liga on Sunday after a win at Sevilla but it was the Champions League defeat at Paris Saint Germain last week which is the big concern at the Bernabeu.

Zidane is already under some pressure and it is understood they will go for Pochettino if he gives them any indication that he would be interested.

Pochettino signed a five-year contract in 2018 and has recently reiterated his commitment to the club amid speculation over his long term future.

But that is unlikely to dissuade Real Madrid who have gone for Pochettino in the past and club president Florentino Perez remains a big fan.

There have been concerns among Spurs fans that Pochettino - who guided them to last season’s Champions League final - was frustrated by last summer’s transfer window and therefore may be tempted away.

Pochettino remains one of the most sought-after managers in world football which also guarantees that Tottenham will be determined to keep him to his lucrative £8.5m-a-year contract.

Real Madrid were impressed by Pochettino reaching last season’s Champions League final and believe that would be proof of his credentials as big name appointment.

Spurs have won just two of their opening six Premier League matches this season, suffering a 2-1 reverse at Leicester on Saturday.

Already, Pochettino's men are 10 points off league leaders Liverpool - who beat them in last season's Euro final.





Been thinking about this for a while. Zidane is clearly not long for the sack, so there is an inevitability to these links coming up.

Off hand I would expect Madrid to be more interested in Allegri, but the links to Poch do seem persistent.

And I still maintain Madrid wouldnt be a good move for Poch, but could understand the temptation for any manager.

 

[MKSpur]

If we hadn’t limped to 4th and lost to City in the CL that might have helped Poch!

not refreshing the squad last season had an impact but a combination of the good work already done and a little luck may have painted over some growing cracks. On paper we look to have addressed some of the gaps but have not seen enough of any of the three new signings to assess whether they will improve us, Christmas time might be a more realistic initial review.

Whilst I feel Poch deserves some slack based on what he has delivered (exceeded expectations year on year in my book) I do concur his media interaction does seem to have Mourinhoed over the last 12-18 months. Whether this is frustration at his achievements being seen as failures making him defensive at the line of questioning or frustration at the resources he has been given remains to be seen.
There is some work to be done, it does seem be on the defensive side which hopefully can be addressed in the training ground in the short term. Arguably next season we could have a completely different back 4 so that in itself is a challenge.
I think a few of us may have felt that coming home would miraculous help us kick on overnight, unfortunately there is a new bedding in period at home (atmosphere and familiarity wise, we don’t even kick off the same way any more!!) and still playing catch up on refreshing the squad whilst players may have peaked in between or now have little contractual incentive to give their all.
Our competitive advantage over goons united and Chelsea has been the consistency of our set up, Would be a shame to lose it at the point we can finally compete with them in the transfer market.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Klopp is an interesting comparison as basically until they won the CL vs us he was actually doing no better than Poch
He had his team get second place
He has the advantage of teams beat him faltering (like we had a times too)
He also failed to win cup finals
But now he has a BIG trophy won there... again IMO fortunately as the ref made a big error that killed the game but no one can argue that they were not much better than us last season
If he hadn’t won the CL you could argue that despite spending millions he hadn’t got his team over the line

Football is fine margins. If we had beaten Liverpool then Poch would be the most sought after coach in the world, but we didn’t and people will beat him with the stick of not winning a trophy, rightly or wrongly until he does win something. Personally I think you have to look at the complete picture but if you’re considered to be one of the best coaches in the world I think you have to have had at least some success in terms of league titles or European trophies.

As for Klopp, yes they didn’t win the league ultimately but they achieved a points total that would have won the league in every other season except the last two and they look ready to challenge city again this season. Compare this to us who haven’t finished within even 5 points of 1st place.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

Results are secondary to performances, for me.

I dont mind the lack of trophies, providing the direction of travel is there.

When he started there was a clear intent in what he was doing, and while it took a while to take hold I was completely happy with it. We could see where we were heading, and that we were making progress.

The run now? Thats the missing ingredient, and for me thats the worrying thing.

Where is the stamp on this team? The identity? The clear motive/style/direction it is being built around?

It wouldnt take a huge amount to settle that, but it comes from Poch and his management, and thats the bit that is lacking for me.

He can put his foot down, make some decisions, show a clear intent on the pitch, and we can all settle back in knowing his focus is on the job.

Or he can carry on with the halfwayhouse type set ups, strange selections and substitutions, and effectively stoke the flames of the growing concern around him and his tenure.

 

[MKSpur]

Results are secondary to performances, for me.

I dont mind the lack of trophies, providing the direction of travel is there.

When he started there was a clear intent in what he was doing, and while it took a while to take hold I was completely happy with it. We could see where we were heading, and that we were making progress.

The run now? Thats the missing ingredient, and for me thats the worrying thing.

Where is the stamp on this team? The identity? The clear motive/style/direction it is being built around?

It wouldnt take a huge amount to settle that, but it comes from Poch and his management, and thats the bit that is lacking for me.

He can put his foot down, make some decisions, show a clear intent on the pitch, and we can all settle back in knowing his focus is on the job.

Or he can carry on with the halfwayhouse type set ups, strange selections and substitutions, and effectively stoke the flames of the growing concern around him and his tenure.

What do you think it is that has triggered the change in direction from Poch’s perspective? We weren’t that far away from the ultimate target so it would seem odd to tear up the blueprint at the point austerity has been relaxed.

soneone once suggested the worst thing that happened to Wenger was seeing Barca play, as he tore up his successful blueprint to try and emulate their style without the same quality of players. Perhaps Poch is looking at one of City or Liverpool and feels that trying to do something different to try and catch up with them?

in terms of the strange subs, obviously we aren’t privy to players fitness issues (are they on the bench for their auras rather than being Poch fit??) but the only other reason I can think of is he taking a short term risk to reassert his authority on the group for the long term gain of having everyone aligned to his methods.

 

[Lemonade Money]

Mauricio Pochettino still Real Madrid's No.1 choice to replace under-fire Zinedine Zidane
Zinedine Zidane is already under pressure at the Bernabeu and Florentino Perez remains keen on the Spurs boss

By John CrossChief Football Writer

Real Madrid are ready to make a fresh approach for Mauricio Pochettino.

The Spanish giants will make the Tottenham boss their No.1 target if they decide to replace Zinedine Zidane this season.

Real Madrid boss Zidane guided his team into second place in La Liga on Sunday after a win at Sevilla but it was the Champions League defeat at Paris Saint Germain last week which is the big concern at the Bernabeu.

Zidane is already under some pressure and it is understood they will go for Pochettino if he gives them any indication that he would be interested.

Pochettino signed a five-year contract in 2018 and has recently reiterated his commitment to the club amid speculation over his long term future.

But that is unlikely to dissuade Real Madrid who have gone for Pochettino in the past and club president Florentino Perez remains a big fan.

There have been concerns among Spurs fans that Pochettino - who guided them to last season’s Champions League final - was frustrated by last summer’s transfer window and therefore may be tempted away.

Pochettino remains one of the most sought-after managers in world football which also guarantees that Tottenham will be determined to keep him to his lucrative £8.5m-a-year contract.

Real Madrid were impressed by Pochettino reaching last season’s Champions League final and believe that would be proof of his credentials as big name appointment.

Spurs have won just two of their opening six Premier League matches this season, suffering a 2-1 reverse at Leicester on Saturday.

Already, Pochettino's men are 10 points off league leaders Liverpool - who beat them in last season's Euro final.





Been thinking about this for a while. Zidane is clearly not long for the sack, so there is an inevitability to these links coming up.

Off hand I would expect Madrid to be more interested in Allegri, but the links to Poch do seem persistent.

And I still maintain Madrid wouldnt be a good move for Poch, but could understand the temptation for any manager.

Sell Poch to Madrid for £30M, get Allegri in for nowt? Very Levy.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

What do you think it is that has triggered the change in direction from Poch’s perspective? We weren’t that far away from the ultimate target so it would seem odd to tear up the blueprint at the point austerity has been relaxed.

soneone once suggested the worst thing that happened to Wenger was seeing Barca play, as he tore up his successful blue print to try and emulate their style without the same quality of players. Perhaps Poch is looking at one of City or Liverpool and feels that trying to do something different to try and catch up with them?

I honestly dont know. Dont even know if Im right. Its just the way it seems to me.

I look at the team and its just lacking, lacking direction, identity, and dare I say - leadership.

If Steff is right its all down to Poch having an almighty sulk because he didnt get his own way selling players etc. If thats true I find it greatly concerning.

My take, (hope?), is that he is probably exhausted. The last couple of years have been extremely taxing, and he has higher expectation to live up to thanks to his success, and its taken its toll?

Sometimes, when thats the case, all it takes is a little spark to ignite the old fire again.

Perhaps tonight, some young players really impress, and he gets the buzz again...

Either way, this is the first time in 5 years Ive begun to look past the manager. Right now I dont feel like he is doing the job we know he can (and should). My hope is that whatever is going on, he snaps out of it, and gets back on track.

I would expect Levy to have patience, and if Poch were to leave before the seasons out I would expect it to be his decision, to be honest.

So right now, game to game, Im just looking for signs of life...

Sell Poch to Madrid for £30M, get Allegri in for nowt? Very Levy.

Indeed! Wouldnt put it past him, would you?

Raises an interesting question, though perhaps not for this thread. Who next? Tried and tested, or another up and comer like Poch was?

 

[Nigeyman]

Klopp is an interesting comparison as basically until they won the CL vs us he was actually doing no better than Poch
He had his team get second place
He has the advantage of teams beat him faltering (like we had a times too)
He also failed to win cup finals
But now he has a BIG trophy won there... again IMO fortunately as the ref made a big error that killed the game but no one can argue that they were not much better than us last season
If he hadn’t won the CL you could argue that despite spending millions he hadn’t got his team over the line

You could, football is certainly a game of fine margins. Poch and the boys would have had legendary status forever...

With those fine margins of football involved, I suppose it was also very disappointing for me we didn’t put up any kind of fight at all despite the harsh early setback we didn’t lay a glove on them.

 

[MKSpur]

I honestly dont know. Dont even know if Im right. Its just the way it seems to me.

I look at the team and its just lacking, lacking direction, identity, and dare I say - leadership.

If Steff is right its all down to Poch having an almighty sulk because he didnt get his own way selling players etc. If thats true I find it greatly concerning.

My take, (hope?), is that he is probably exhausted. The last couple of years have been extremely taxing, and he has higher expectation to live up to thanks to his success, and its taken its toll?

Sometimes, when thats the case, all it takes is a little spark to ignite the old fire again.

Perhaps tonight, some young players really impress, and he gets the buzz again...

Either way, this is the first time in 5 years Ive begun to look past the manager. Right now I dont feel like he is doing the job we know he can (and should). My hope is that whatever is going on, he snaps out of it, and gets back on track.

I would expect Levy to have patience, and if Poch were to leave before the seasons out I would expect it to be his decision, to be honest.

So right now, game to game, Im just looking for signs of life...




Indeed! Wouldnt put it past him, would you?

Raises an interesting question, though perhaps not for this thread. Who next? Tried and tested, or another up and comer like Poch was?

As these issues started mid point last season, perhaps that’s why the crest of the CL run was behind his comments behind leaving if we won it(I think a lot more attention was paid to this, I felt winning it might not be matched in the future too!
If Poch thinks our selling policy undermined him he should imagine what Zidane feels like about Bale!

Another perspective is we haven’t really done much to change the team from the last part of last season, except that players getting a rest. We are still using Winks and Sissoko whilst we bed in Dembeles replacement NDombele, Dier and Alli are still missing, we’ve had to use an emergency right back without having an upgrade on the first two choices. Our Eriksen replacement / Lamela upgrade or whatever improvement you beeline GLC brings has been unavailable ditto Sessegnon.

I feel dirty thinking about potential replacements so maybe that’s for another thread but in terms of Levy I think Poch would have to do something drastic behind the scenes with Levy for him to think about replacing him, as long as we remain in contention for top 4.

 

[Nigeyman]

I honestly dont know. Dont even know if Im right. Its just the way it seems to me.

I look at the team and its just lacking, lacking direction, identity, and dare I say - leadership.

If Steff is right its all down to Poch having an almighty sulk because he didnt get his own way selling players etc. If thats true I find it greatly concerning.

My take, (hope?), is that he is probably exhausted. The last couple of years have been extremely taxing, and he has higher expectation to live up to thanks to his success, and its taken its toll?

Sometimes, when thats the case, all it takes is a little spark to ignite the old fire again.

Perhaps tonight, some young players really impress, and he gets the buzz again...

Either way, this is the first time in 5 years Ive begun to look past the manager. Right now I dont feel like he is doing the job we know he can (and should). My hope is that whatever is going on, he snaps out of it, and gets back on track.

I would expect Levy to have patience, and if Poch were to leave before the seasons out I would expect it to be his decision, to be honest.

So right now, game to game, Im just looking for signs of life...




Indeed! Wouldnt put it past him, would you?

Raises an interesting question, though perhaps not for this thread. Who next? Tried and tested, or another up and comer like Poch was?

Enjoyed reading those thoughts.

I too am looking for signs but fear the players no longer are fully confident of themselves, the system, the manager.

Time will tell but Poch just cannot seem to shift this strange mood he’s in.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

As these issues started mid point last season, perhaps that’s why the crest of the CL run was behind his comments behind leaving if we won it(I think a lot more attention was paid to this, I felt winning it might not be matched in the future too!
If Poch thinks our selling policy undermined him he should imagine what Zidane feels like about Bale!

Another perspective is we haven’t really done much to change the team from the last part of last season, except that players getting a rest. We are still using Winks and Sissoko whilst we bed in Dembeles replacement NDombele, Dier and Alli are still missing, we’ve had to use an emergency right back without having an upgrade on the first two choices. Our Eriksen replacement / Lamela upgrade or whatever improvement you beeline GLC brings has been unavailable ditto Sessegnon.

I feel dirty thinking about potential replacements so maybe that’s for another thread but in terms of Levy I think Poch would have to do something drastic behind the scenes with Levy for him to think about replacing him, as long as we remain in contention for top 4.

Im not saying he hasnt had his challenges this season, but he has had a better set of fit players to work with, and still made odd decisions.

Aurier completely in the cold, KWP - a natural RB binned off for Sanchez who (as much as I love him) is clearly not a full back...

Persistence with Sissoko when Dier and Skipp are on the bench.

What on earth has Moura done to warrant never getting a proper look in?

Weird selections, shapes, subs... it goes on. Im not saying everything should be rosy, but it should be better IMO than it has been.

And then there is the performance itself, lacking direction, intent etc. All very "meh". Which really there is no excuse for.

I dont know what is going on with him, I really dont, all any of us can do is speculate.

I do think though that he is not fulfilling his responsibility as well as he can. He seems to have his mind elsewhere/on other things. Politics perhaps? Player issues? Transfer business or available budget? Whatever it may be - I really think he should just be focusing on the team.