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Jan Vertonghen

Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

With the way the season has been, I don't think any of the players are held that highly in the fans minds except Eriksen. The TV pundits made him out to be a monster after the Liverpool game because of his appearance in the tunnel, but most fans had felt he wasn't trying since AVB got sacked. The only way I see the lad staying is if FDB is appointed because of the Ajax connection. Shame because last year he was probably my favourite player.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Maltese Falcon said:
Do you honestly not realise how ridiculous that comment sounds? It make be relevant for a striker but a defender in a poor team often is in the spotlight because he is involved constantly. If he upped his game, he would be seen as a cut above the rest - which would make him even more desirable for CL teams
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no, its not a ridiculous comment, its how players show the coach they want to be sold.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

THFC6061 said:
Vertonghen was only supposed to play 60 to 75 minutes for our U21s, but he insisted on staying on for the full 90 as he wanted to us win the game.

Now does that sound like someone who wants to leave the club?
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.........and with a world cup around the corner,feet up for the last few weeks,nice rest and a gentle run out for the stiffs, and way to go.....

We will know where he stands if Tim picks him to be actually in the squad first of all......
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Maltese Falcon said:
Do you honestly not realise how ridiculous that comment sounds? It make be relevant for a striker but a defender in a poor team often is in the spotlight because he is involved constantly. If he upped his game, he would be seen as a cut above the rest - which would make him even more desirable for CL teams
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Defenders generally look a lot better in well organized teams.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

a spur from swansea said:
.........and with a world cup around the corner,feet up for the last few weeks,nice rest and a gentle run out for the stiffs, and way to go.....

We will know where he stands if Tim picks him to be actually in the squad first of all......
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What are you saying here? How does that relate to what Statto posted?

Sherwood has picked him plenty of times, he's been injured and returned for the reserves. If he wanted the "gentle run out" you claim why complete the game when he didn't have to?
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

I had a dream (nightmare) last night that Jan had joined chavski. I was seeing him in the tunnel in their blue home adidas kit....****ing awful sight. I really hope this is not prophetic on my part.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

if Jan wants to go,I was thinking of the possibility of selling him for 20-25 mill and bringing in Lescott on a free...defensively would we be any worse off?? Jan is far better going forward with the ball
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

I'd like to see Vertonghen in a defensive midfield role, as i think he's an excellent footballer with a good passing range and good vision, with quick feet for a big man and a deceptive turn of pace.

He's a quality footballer, but he's a poor defender IMO. His positioning and concentration just aren't good enough to be a 90 min centre-back in the Premiership.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

I think he was propositioned with that idea, but IIRC he said that he's a CB and that's where he wants to play.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Cochise said:
I think he was propositioned with that idea, but IIRC he said that he's a CB and that's where he wants to play.
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Yeah I know, supposedly he turned down Arsenal to join us as Wenger told him he wanted to use him in midfield and make him into the new Petit.

Problem is I think Wenger is right. I think Wenger is still a good judge of a player and I think midfield is or would be Vertonghen's best position. I think his concentration lapses far too often to play in a top European league at centre-back where you have to either have eyes on the back of your head at all times and excellent positioning (Vidic), or the raw pace and reactions to get you out of a tight spot if you do make a mistake (Ferdinand), ideally obviously both (long live the King of WHL). Don't think Vertonghen has either unfortunately.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

NWND said:
Yeah I know, supposedly he turned down Arsenal to join us as Wenger told him he wanted to use him in midfield and make him into the new Petit.

Problem is I think Wenger is right. I think Wenger is still a good judge of a player and I think midfield is or would be Vertonghen's best position. I think his concentration lapses far too often to play in a top European league at centre-back where you have to either have eyes on the back of your head at all times and excellent positioning (Vidic), or the raw pace and reactions to get you out of a tight spot if you do make a mistake (Ferdinand), ideally obviously both (long live the King of WHL). Don't think Vertonghen has either unfortunately.
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I think a relatively settled centre back partnership with a properly good centre back alongside Vertonghen, perhaps with an upgrade at left back and a team working as a unit ahead of them, would sort out a lot of those issues actually.

If we want to improve on our centre backs I think it's much more likely that we can find one top class centre back to form a partnership with Vertonghen than it is that we find two top class centre backs that are both better than Vertonghen.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

indianspur said:
if Jan wants to go,I was thinking of the possibility of selling him for 20-25 mill and bringing in Lescott on a free...defensively would we be any worse off?? Jan is far better going forward with the ball
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Undoubtedly true, trouble is he doesn't get forward very often, most of the time he seems to duck our and pass across the pitch to Daws.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

NWND said:
Yeah I know, supposedly he turned down Arsenal to join us as Wenger told him he wanted to use him in midfield and make him into the new Petit.

Problem is I think Wenger is right. I think Wenger is still a good judge of a player and I think midfield is or would be Vertonghen's best position. I think his concentration lapses far too often to play in a top European league at centre-back where you have to either have eyes on the back of your head at all times and excellent positioning (Vidic), or the raw pace and reactions to get you out of a tight spot if you do make a mistake (Ferdinand), ideally obviously both (long live the King of WHL). Don't think Vertonghen has either unfortunately.
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Wenger is/was right. Vertonghen is a very good footballer, you can see that his vision, touch and reading of a game are very good but as a defender he is quite last ditch. Part of that is down to not having a massive amount of pace but I think it is also in part to not being able to fully hone his instincts to want to bring the ball out and be part of something further up the pitch. As a result, he does get caught out occasionally and I am also of the opinion that he would make a good withdrawn CM, certainly in terms of breaking things up, nicking the ball and recycling posession quite effectively.

I think we need 2 CBs who can technically play but are actually in the main, interested in pure defending rather than being support artists to the attack. Kaboul would be one of those if he could get his fitness right and get back to the level he was between 2010-2012 but I personally don't think Vertonghen is the other one based on this season tbh.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Central defenders work in pairs. Always there are two, and all that. They need to have an almost telepathic understanding to work out which one tracks a run, when to step up, etc. With some exceptions*, this takes time on the training pitch, and in competitive matches. Oh, and a well-coached system where the defenders know what to do AS A UNIT -- if you're not sure what you're meant to be doing, you lose focus on the game, and that's when the individual f***-ups happen.

* King. He made Dawson, Gardner et al look several rungs better than they actually were.

Verts got into the Premiership Top XI last season. Give Super Jan a solid partner and a decent system, and he's going to get back to his old standards. I can understand the guy being frustrated.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

Part of the reason why we need a reliable backup at LB. Let Vertonghen form a solid central pairing. Like King he can probably manager a good relationship with two different right centre backs, but stop the moving him to LB and the unnecessary chopping and changing of the central pair.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

jts1882 said:
Part of the reason why we need a reliable backup at LB. Let Vertonghen form a solid central pairing. Like King he can probably manager a good relationship with two different right centre backs, but stop the moving him to LB and the unnecessary chopping and changing of the central pair.
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Never saw that at all last season under either manager, if I recall correctly I don't think we managed to get more than 4 straight games in the EPL without having to make an enforced change due to injury/suspension.
 
Re: Super Jan Vertonghen Official

FatBloke said:
Central defenders work in pairs. Always there are two, and all that. They need to have an almost telepathic understanding to work out which one tracks a run, when to step up, etc. With some exceptions*, this takes time on the training pitch, and in competitive matches. Oh, and a well-coached system where the defenders know what to do AS A UNIT -- if you're not sure what you're meant to be doing, you lose focus on the game, and that's when the individual f***-ups happen.

* King. He made Dawson, Gardner et al look several rungs better than they actually were.

Verts got into the Premiership Top XI last season. Give Super Jan a solid partner and a decent system, and he's going to get back to his old standards. I can understand the guy being frustrated.
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You can't compare King to Vertonghen.
King never walked on the pitch and played like he couldnt be arsed.
He performed consistently well regardless of what numbskull was along side him.
 
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