Harry Winks

[NaijaSpurs]

Now Alder is back, I fully expect Dier to reclaim his main position. Wanyama has had a lot of gametime, and we're much more fluid offensively when Dier is the key transitioner.

Yawn

 

[NaijaSpurs]

It needs to be the next on the production line from the academy though - Goddard, Pritchard or Owens etc.

I have no problem with that

 

[Finney Is Back]

Now Alder is back, I fully expect Dier to reclaim his main position. Wanyama has had a lot of gametime, and we're much more fluid offensively when Dier is the key transitioner.

I fully expect Dier to reclaim his rightful position on the bench. Wanyama has consistently played at a higher level than Dier this season.

 

[milo]

I fully expect Dier to reclaim his rightful position on the bench. Wanyama has consistently played at a higher level than Dier this season.

I cannot see how anyone could argue with that or think that it would be good for either player for Dier to walk back into midfield.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I don't mind whoever plays there be it dier or wanyama

Dier was brilliant there last season and victor has been top notch there this season

It's exactly why we brought Victor and it why we're actually a stronger side

 

[Alaric]

The kid has a decent turn of pace as well. Great chasing back into our own half towards the end of last night's game before facing up against their player. When he set off in the direction of the right-back position, I thought it was Walker for a second or two.

I thought it was Walker too and, like you, was surprised to see that it was Winks instead.

 

[Danishfurniturelover]

Dier seemed last season to show an eye for a pass that I have not seen from Wanamya and I am a fan of his, I would like to see them together. I love Dembele the midfielder but I would be all for letting him go with his age and injury problems which will only get worse, sell and reinvest while his stock is quite high.

 

[DTA]

Dier seemed last season to show an eye for a pass that I have not seen from Wanamya and I am a fan of his, I would like to see them together. I love Dembele the midfielder but I would be all for letting him go with his age and injury problems which will only get worse, sell and reinvest while his stock is quite high.

Dembele is a different player to either of them and when on song a different class. And I'm a fan of all three.

 

[harr1984]

Dier seemed last season to show an eye for a pass that I have not seen from Wanamya and I am a fan of his, I would like to see them together. I love Dembele the midfielder but I would be all for letting him go with his age and injury problems which will only get worse, sell and reinvest while his stock is quite high.

We need a couple of more mature players, you can't have them all in their early twenties. Dembele oozes class, would be ridiculous to get rid of him you can't find anyone else like him in the league....

 

[Mr_B]

I like this boy, he's got one of those enthusiastic spirits you can't put down, going by body language, he has a great rapport with his teammates, i don't think we'll see the best of him for at least 2 or 3 years

 

[Spur of the moment]

Fantastic perfomance by Winks :-O
104 passes, 96% accuracy - best result among all players on Wednesday
Heart of our play

Astonishing.

 

[braineclipse]

Will be interesting to see whether Poch signs another CM in Jan or the summer. Its a gaping hole in our squad if you take the two-players-per-position approach. Winks is progressing well, though I'd be happier if he was our 5th choice after Dier, Wanyama, Dembele and AN Other. Its similar to CB really where CCV is our 4th choice, whereas Poch would probably prefer a 4th senior Cb and then have CCV as 5th choice.

That's very much not the approach Poch has taken so far. And seems quite contrary to what Poch seems to prefer.

We didn't sign a 4th choice midfielder this summer or last January. Seemingly there's been a plan for some time (months to a year at least) to slowly introduce Winks and give him more and more game time as he develops.

If we had signed a 4th choice central midfielder surely we would have had to give him game time on the pitch? That game time would quite likely had come at the cost of the game time Winks has gotten. A 4th choice player like that can effectively block the development of a young player like Winks. As we've seen repeatedly (imo) at other clubs like Chelsea.

Signing someone now that Winks has started stepping up would make even less sense than signing someone in the summer - which we didn't.

As a compromise maybe that 5th "body" could be another young talent with enormous potential just like Harry

Wouldn't that effectively split the game time between them? And potentially again limit the game time for both of them and possibly also Onomah...

I think a key part of our success with young players is providing them with a plausible path into the first team, not just scatter gun signing young talents and hoping one of them makes it.

With Dier + Wanyama for the more holding role and Dembele + Winks for the more creative/attacking deeper role and Onomah hopefully close to breaking through we have plenty of "bodies". We also have the option of going for a central trio with one holder (Dier or Wanyama) and two box to box players (Alli, Eriksen, Dembele, Winks) like we did earlier this season.

I fully expect Dier to reclaim his rightful position on the bench. Wanyama has consistently played at a higher level than Dier this season.

Dier for me was better last season than Wanyama has been this season. He would have to win the place back, but Alderweireld returning opens up the possibility for that happening. Dier at 22 for me has the greatest potential out of him and Wanyama, getting him back on the pitch in the role he thrived in last season would be a very good thing in my book.

 

[NaijaSpurs]

Wouldn't that effectively split the game time between them? And potentially again limit the game time for both of them and possibly also Onomah...

And so what?

We are in the Europa, the league, FA Cup, there will be suspensions, and injuries and loss of form. There is a discussion as to who should now start in midfield Dier or Wanyama, either way it looks like a key first team player will spend time on the bench, it happens. Besides young players are by their very nature inconsistent. Personally I do not see the problem.

 

[NaijaSpurs]

Dier for me was better last season than Wanyama has been this season. He would have to win the place back, but Alderweireld returning opens up the possibility for that happening. Dier at 22 for me has the greatest potential out of him and Wanyama, getting him back on the pitch in the role he thrived in last season would be a very good thing in my book.

I thought Dier was excellent last season but I think Wanyama has been equally as good this season and does not deserve to lose his place.

I never watched Wanyama at 22 but I know he was good enough for Poch to make him his first signing at Southampton, so as to who has the greatest potential is open to debate.

I remember Nicky Barmby playing for Spurs at 22, he looked like he was going to be an amazing player, but it did not work out. Of course I hope it works out for Dier because I rate him immensely. I just think he does not not deserve to walk into this the team ahead of Wanyama

 

[braineclipse]

And so what?

We are in the Europa, the league, FA Cup, there will be suspensions, and injuries and loss of form. There is a discussion as to who should now start in midfield Dier or Wanyama, either way it looks like a key first team player will spend time on the bench, it happens. Besides young players are by their very nature inconsistent. Personally I do not see the problem.

So far this season Winks has gotten 327 minutes of competitive football for us (whoscored.com). Culminating in the rather excellent performance against CSKA. If that game time was halved would we have seen the same development? Just weeks ago there were plenty of posters arguing that Winks should be sent out on loan because he wasn't getting enough game time to develop. How would that have been with half that game time?

Players like this need some amount of first team football I think. I think that's crucial for development. And at some point fairly regular league games will become important for development, motivation and player satisfaction. Effectively cutting that game time in half could be detrimental for development in my opinion.

And I think that's why Mason was let go without signing a real replacement. And why Carroll has been marginalized at this point. After Bentaleb having both of those happen to him over the last year. Keeping Mason at the club would undoubtedly have been beneficial to the club in some games early on this season. But opening up that place in the squad to Winks has the potential of being more beneficial over time because of the game time it has given him.

For me, again and again clubs that succeed with player development trust young players as a part of their squads and give them a realistic path into the first team. Having too much competition and limiting game time does not seem like the way to do it.

Under Pochettino: When we had Kane we didn't sign another young striker to limit his game time. We seem to rate CCV very highly and let another highly rated player in Veljkovic go, I think to be able to focus on the one we thought had the most potential. When we had Bentaleb and Mason developing we didn't sign other young players the same age to compete with them. When Dier was identified as a DM prospect we wanted to trust another young DM wasn't signed that would limit his game time. Now that we have Winks breaking through I think we'll see a similar approach. Because it works... Despite this we've seen repeated wishes from fans to do the opposite. To do what clubs that frequently fail at player development do. Bloat the squad and further limit playing time for talented players.

Having two young inconsistent players might at time be better, if you're able to identify before games which of them will perform. But the nature of inconsistent young players is that they will be unpredictably inconsistent I think. And limiting their game time will only lead to limited development and more inconsistency the way I see it. Having the trust of the club/manager/head coach despite some expected inconsistency is actually important I think.

 

[braineclipse]

I thought Dier was excellent last season but I think Wanyama has been equally as good this season and does not deserve to lose his place.

I never watched Wanyama at 22 but I know he was good enough for Poch to make him his first signing at Southampton, so as to who has the greatest potential is open to debate.

I remember Nicky Barmby playing for Spurs at 22, he looked like he was going to be an amazing player, but it did not work out. Of course I hope it works out for Dier because I rate him immensely. I just think he does not not deserve to walk into this the team ahead of Wanyama

I don't think he should walk back in. He'll have to win his place back. To reclaim that position as GB put it. With Alderweireld back the chance of that happening is a lot higher than it was when Dier was playing at CB just about every game.

 

[Alaric]

We need a couple of more mature players, you can't have them all in their early twenties. Dembele oozes class, would be ridiculous to get rid of him you can't find anyone else like him in the league....

I saw an interview with Winks recently, where he said Dembele was the best player he'd played with. If you haven't seen the interview, below is a link:

 

[Hashegotthesackyet?]

Nice problem for us to have.

 

[harr1984]

I saw an interview with Winks recently, where he said Dembele was the best player he'd played with. If you haven't seen the interview, below is a link:

On the back of them talking about Poch and the F2 guys I watched the YouTube of that aswell - Poch has still got it!

 

[AjaxDeSuperYids]

Now Alder is back, I fully expect Dier to reclaim his main position. Wanyama has had a lot of gametime, and we're much more fluid offensively when Dier is the key transitioner.

When alder was playing before the injury, Wanyama was starting in midfield ahead of Dier.