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Ange in or out?

Ange in or out?

  • In

    Votes: 78 41.3%

  • Out

    Votes: 111 58.7%
  • Total voters
    189
Muttley said:
That interview from Kulu definitely shows the difference between these very young players and a lot of the rest of us fans and media. It's actually quite endearing. As you get older you tend to lose the ability to be wowed so easily by words. You've got a lot of t-shirts in your lifetime. Therefore, it takes a deeper level of presence or charisma to convince you. At his tender age, Kulu won't be seeing these layers that we regularly discuss on here. The journo's certainly don't eat out of his hand like the players do.

It's good the players do though, and perhaps an endorsement that Ange should modify his communications for the external world. We've heard all the stories about his dad. We care more about why the ball keeps hitting our net at an alarming frequency. We need the football conversation in the next phase and that includes the journos.
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I love words my friend, frankly the older I get, the more I love people who use them well!!!

Agreed, less gullible due to age, however much more able to sniff out bull-shi ters IMO. I don't see him as one.

I'm not sure I agree. I admire him in that regard TBH. Can you imagine Brian Clough in today's media world? Shankley? Sir Bill would've been spitting feathers half the time.
As for the journey, most of this this current lot IMO don't deserve anything much. The David Lacey's? Agreed. I also used to spend time with The Guardian's Kevin McCarra, a brilliant writer and a genuinely lovely man who did not allow himself to follow the gutter boys led by the likes of Harry Harris. If only there were a couple more out there like McCarra who would've understood Postecoglu..here's a link to Kevin's obituary if interested. He sadly passed from Alzheimer's way too young...

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...m-former-guardian-football-correspondent-dies
 
tommysvr said:
Right. So why even mention Brighton then? It clearly didn't matter, and it's only people like you who bring it up as just another stick to beat Ange with. People who hate him so much that they forget the trophy he delivered 3 days earlier to complain about a match played with 17 hangovers.
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I wasn’t expecting anything different than what was served up against Brighton.

What worry’s me is the last 18 months.

Tommy i have been on this earth to see us lift trophy’s prior to this. FA cups and league Cups. Brilliant we won a trophy I’m chuffed. Only a handful of clubs win them every year. So I get some are emotional at finally getting to see it again.

What I have a problem with is the utter dross that’s been served up on the pitch since Chelsea last year. That’s why I’m Ange out. Not one game.

I can also take my Spurs tinted glasses off and look at the quality of the comp we just won and I have the view of it being pretty weak.

So Brighton in the grand scheme of things did not matter.
 
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veryoldspur said:
I agree with that totally, but in reality we all know Ange really isn't up to the job, and by winning a trophy doesn't make him a good manager. Remember Ramos?
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In fairness to him, he lost 52 goals at the end of that window in Berba and Keane, with Frazier Campbell coming in for 12 quid and a bag of crisps. That's like sending a one legged-man out to compete in an arse-kicking contest...
 
tommysvr said:
Right. So why even mention Brighton then? It clearly didn't matter, and it's only people like you who bring it up as just another stick to beat Ange with. People who hate him so much that they forget the trophy he delivered 3 days earlier to complain about a match played with 17 hangovers.
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I dont think people hate him (maybe a couple who have been stupid and insulted him). Like I've said before, I actually like him and wish it had gone better for him
 
tommysvr said:
Context? The only fudging context that matters about the Brighton game is that the squad had been on a 3 day bender because Ange and the team delivered our first trophy in 17 years.

Brighton has no business in the discussion about Ange's future.
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That’s how you see it … I see it as a continuation of form in the league … how about the context before the Brighton game in the league.

We won a cup that’s amazing but moving forward it can’t be with this manager. We won’t get away with this league form for much longer and I don’t think he has any ability of pulling the rabbit out of the hat in the champions league looking at the teams in the comp vs some of the dross that we have been beaten by in the league.

I enjoyed the cup win. Time to say thanks for the memories in Europe …. They don’t rose tint my glasses of the reality of our league form and mismanagement
 
thfcsteff said:
I love words my friend, frankly the older I get, the more I love people who use them well!!!

Agreed, less gullible due to age, however much more able to sniff out bull-shi ters IMO. I don't see him as one.

I'm not sure I agree. I admire him in that regard TBH. Can you imagine Brian Clough in today's media world? Shankley? Sir Bill would've been spitting feathers half the time.
As for the journey, most of this this current lot IMO don't deserve anything much. The David Lacey's? Agreed. I also used to spend time with The Guardian's Kevin McCarra, a brilliant writer and a genuinely lovely man who did not allow himself to follow the gutter boys led by the likes of Harry Harris. If only there were a couple more out there like McCarra who would've understood Postecoglu..here's a link to Kevin's obituary if interested. He sadly passed from Alzheimer's way too young...

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...m-former-guardian-football-correspondent-dies
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My favourite was Brian Woolnough. As a home and away England fans we spent times chatting with him. He used fan opinion and took them on board. I was genuinely sad when he left this planet. I've stopped being an England fan, but over the years I met loads in the profession. My worst experience was sitting behind Richard Keys on a flight back from a game. Egotistical little misogynist. This was even before the infamous incident.

You're right in that Ange isn't a BSer. What he is though is a thought controller and manipulator. He backed himself to be able to control the interview environment and has mostly failed at it because of the results on the pitch. He thought he could take some conversations off the table and make them out of scope to the journo's because he didn't have answers. He thought he could get spiky to evade important questions and that technique wouldn't get noticed. These subtleties are never lost on me. The journo's are way too smart to fall for that. Klopp and Jose's gaslighting of the media was notorious. I think Ange has that in him as well but hasn't played that card so far.

I wish Ange was more Clough to be fair. He often misses authenticity. Saying that, If I had met Cloughie I would have happily stood up to his rudeness but only where it wasn't warranted. If I was Teddy, I would have absolutely told him to never call me Edward again. I choose what my name is and Cloughie would have accepted and respected that. I do have the same thing with my own name as it goes.

The problem is the journo's aren't allowed to hit back. Only the managers can cross lines which always seems unfair to me. Ange needs to start answering the actual question being asked or we will have more of the same next season. More importantly, he needs to get the team performing on the pitch. That's when his media life gets easier.
 
tommysvr said:
Context? The only fudging context that matters about the Brighton game is that the squad had been on a 3 day bender because Ange and the team delivered our first trophy in 17 years.

Brighton has no business in the discussion about Ange's future.
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I think there is context in the fact that the Brighton performance post 3 day bender wasn't even one of our worst performances.

I was there and didn't think we played 'badly' in the sense that I don't think we played any worse than we usually do.

Taken singularly the performance has a lot different weight to it then when put up against our other league performances, and I think that there not being any difference on performance levels between a team off the back of a 3 day bender and a team working towards a game plan previously is pretty damming.
 
fernadez said:
I think there is context in the fact that the Brighton performance post 3 day bender wasn't even one of our worst performances.

I was there and didn't think we played 'badly' in the sense that I don't think we played any worse than we usually do.

Taken singularly the performance has a lot different weight to it then when put up against our other league performances, and I think that there not being any difference on performance levels between a team off the back of a 3 day bender and a team working towards a game plan previously is pretty damming.
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I think perhaps the biggest difference between those who are Ange in and out at this point is those different "contexts" over time and how that's seen.

From the hung over Brighton game back to Kane leaving and the mess he inherited and everything in between.

Are those just excuses at this point, it's been too long to accept any context (Ange out). Or yeah, that's a lot, but all very real factors that have had a significant enough impact on results to at least understand a significant amount of it, find the risk of being wrong about that acceptable given the upsides (Ange in).
 
carl said:
I dont think people hate him (maybe a couple who have been stupid and insulted him). Like I've said before, I actually like him and wish it had gone better for him
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I hate him and have done since December he is an awful manager with an arrogance that his managerial ability does not warrant.

He is up there joint with Christian Gross, that people can't see it baffles me.
 
Raziel said:
22 losses in the league, literally the most by any team that hasn't been relegated, the worse by any Spurs team ever?

Beaten/doubled by absolute dross in the league, same mistakes over and over.

His success (and kudos for the achievement) has literally come when we can only play a certain group of players and abandon every principle of his system.
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Hmmm.....that does appear to be the case
 
veryoldspur said:
Football aside I find the man an arrogant pig
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I must admit the snippet of the interview I saw of him after the Brighton Match tinkled me off a bit. When asked how he assessed the season he was smiling saying he was over the moon and how great it was. As he binned so many premier league games maybe he forgot how poor we were in it.

The fact he didn't acknowledge it all was annoying but I haven't seen the whole interview so maybe he did.
 
balesleftboot said:
The league position is pretty irrelevant though. Do you believe we'd be 17th if we hadn't gone so far in the Europa League? Look how heavily we have rotated for the last month or 2. And yesterday was bound to happen after the heroics and subsequent celebrations last week.
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Maybe 14th.

Either way, there is absolutely no way we should be in that position, even with the injuries. It was tactics that caused many of the results.

Ange has a summer to fix it.
 
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