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**** OMT Arsenal v Tottenham Hotspur ****

90291Spur said:
Leaving partay all alone was a quality chance and a fine finish. I don’t think that allowing the oppo to play the ball around our box isn’t a risky strategy. Someone will hit a peach, a shot will be deflected, the keep will parry one to the middle of the box and not gobble up the rebound. If you press higher, they’re further away from the goal. It’s simple geography.
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You're over simplifying it. They had plenty of low quality chances, including the first goal. Our breaks were more dangerous and higher quality one on ones would've happened if Son could pass. It's two different philosophies, lots of low quality chances versus few high quality chances. If we push up we don't get those high quality chances.
I'm not arguing that it is a nice watch etc just that it wasn't the reason we lost today.
 
glasgowspur said:
And son didn’t? Killing ever attack he was involved in?
Peh ball watching as players went past him!

Hugo, fair enough, mistake, but i really can't see how that was a red for royal, you can't legislate for tge ref doing that.
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Not playing well isn't the same as stupidly getting sent off or gifting the opposition a goal.

I was at the game so didn't see clearly but my WhatsApp groups are unanimously saying it was a red - either way as someone else pointed out there was no need in those circumstances to make a challenge anyway - use your brain and the ref doesn't have a decision to make.
 
DubaiSpur said:
And every other side realises that - no top side defends like we do, and they're not all my tits for choosing those approaches that give them possession and keep their opponents away from their goal.

We have my tits like Emerson and players liable to drop a clanger like Dier and Lloris at the back. It is inherently more risky to play like we do than it appears.
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Except Dier has barely dropped close to a clanger in about 18 months
 
1) They cheated by playing a rapist, when City and United are showing how to behave in those situations re Mendy and Greenwood

2) They cheated by withdrawing all their players from international duty with fake injuries

3) That was appalling playacting to get Royal sent off for a soft yellow at worst


Boy I miss when Lamela used to give us an edge on things like that. I expected more from Conte too - we've been naive in the black arts/gamesmanship all week
 
DubSpur said:
You're over simplifying it. They had plenty of low quality chances, including the first goal. Our breaks were more dangerous and higher quality one on ones would've happened if Son could pass. It's two different philosophies, lots of low quality chances versus few high quality chances. If we push up we don't get those high quality chances.
I'm not arguing that it is a nice watch etc just that it wasn't the reason we lost today.
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Whatever happened today, in my opinion, when you play deep like we do, especially against a team with a dynamic attack, you inherently take a risk of giving up more chances, or a worldy, or a mistake.
 
DubSpur said:
Except Dier has barely dropped close to a clanger in about 18 months
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He has, it just hasn't been punished. As an example, I can remember him lumbering up to halfway and being spun and left for dead by the simplest of turns by Brennan Johnson in the Forest game.

I've been saying for years that he just isn't good enough if we want to challenge for things, but his recent surge in form and playing in a system that minimizes his errors meant it was and still is an unpopular viewpoint. He's not bad, but he's just average.
 
billyiddo said:
Not playing well isn't the same as stupidly getting sent off or gifting the opposition a goal.

I was at the game so didn't see clearly but my WhatsApp groups are unanimously saying it was a red - either way as someone else pointed out there was no need in those circumstances to make a challenge anyway - use your brain and the ref doesn't have a decision to make.
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So playing ok but getting done by a very debatable ref decision is worse than being out of form?
 
DubSpur said:
You're over simplifying it. They had plenty of low quality chances, including the first goal. Our breaks were more dangerous and higher quality one on ones would've happened if Son could pass. It's two different philosophies, lots of low quality chances versus few high quality chances. If we push up we don't get those high quality chances.
I'm not arguing that it is a nice watch etc just that it wasn't the reason we lost today.
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The red card skewed it, but we ended up comfortably behind on xG, I think. 2.32 to 0.62 (without the pen).

Hard to argue they didn't outplay us, and their philosophy blew Conte's out of the water.

It's true the system generally plays out the way you outline - loads of low-quality chances conceded, few high quality chances created. But what works in 90% of the games will not work against Arsenal, West Ham and Chelsea away, because our players are mentally stunted and wither at these venues.

It's why I dearly wanted us to switch it up to a 3-5-2.
 
DubaiSpur said:
He has, it just hasn't been punished. As an example, I can remember him lumbering up to halfway and being spun and left for dead by the simplest of turns by Brennan Johnson in the Forest game.

I've been saying for years that he just isn't good enough if we want to challenge for things, but his recent surge in form and playing in a system that minimizes his errors meant it was and still is an unpopular viewpoint. He's not bad, but he's just average.
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I like Dier but as you say we need better eventually. Thought he was a bit culpable for the Xhaka goal. Romero had Martinelli covered yet Dier followed them both and left Xhaka totally free.
 
DubaiSpur said:
The red card skewed it, but we ended up comfortably behind on xG, I think. 2.32 to 0.62 (without the pen).

Hard to argue they didn't outplay us, and their philosophy blew Conte's out of the water.

It's true the system generally plays out the way you outline - loads of low-quality chances conceded, few high quality chances created. But what works in 90% of the games will not work against Arsenal, West Ham and Chelsea away, because our players are mentally stunted and wither at these venues.

It's why I dearly wanted us to switch it up to a 3-5-2.
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It's skewed because we didn't get shots off in those breaks that Son wasted. Romero had a simple square ball that he messed up that should've led to a tap in.
These don't get added in xG which is it's major flaw.
 
DubaiSpur said:
And every other side realises that - no top side defends like we do, and they're not all my tits for choosing those approaches that give them possession and keep their opponents away from their goal.

We have my tits like Emerson and players liable to drop a clanger like Dier and Lloris at the back. It is inherently more risky to play like we do than it appears.
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How are brining Dier into it…
 
yiddo37 said:
I like Dier but as you say we need better eventually. Thought he was a bit culpable for the Xhaka goal. Romero had Martinelli covered yet Dier followed them both and left Xhaka totally free.
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That goal was all about where was royal… off the fudging pitch because he was dumb and the ref was too
 
glasgowspur said:
And son didn’t? Killing ever attack he was involved in?
Peh ball watching as players went past him!

Hugo, fair enough, mistake, but i really can't see how that was a red for royal, you can't legislate for tge ref doing that.
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Ref was equalising for the Chelsea game IMO
 
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