I liked Erik Lamela before it was cool

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

I am frustrated with his injury record as the next Spurs fan but what are we realistically going to get for him because of it? £15-20mil? Not sure there is any point selling him for that sort money even with his injury record.

Boils down to this, for me.

Would you rather Lamela, for the 2 or 3 week spell he is fit (whenever that may be), and then a gaping hole in your squad - or would you rather another player who (while perhaps not as good [arguable, IMO]) is actually available for selection more often than not?

For me it is certainly the latter.

The team is playing at a level now where every squad place is incredibly valuable, we cannot afford to hold places on unreliable players IMO.

 

[DTA]

Well actually he was employed as a "sweeper keeper" and his using his feet and coming out away from goal being a big reason we signed him.

That said, I thnk youre being a bit basic about this. Yes, Lloris' primary job is keeping the ball out of the net, of course it is. Does that mean his kicking isnt important? Doesnt matter? Of course it does. And were he to improve his kicking the team would be better for it (I always find it notable when Gazzanaiga is in goal, his kicking is much better imo). It can really add a dimension.

Eriksen is of course a creative player, and a damn fine one at that. Why does that mean we shouldnt expect him to work on the weaker aspects of his game though (as with all players)? Why is it too much to think he might do better with his tackling, and consequently - much like Lloris' kicking - add something more to the team?

None of this is to suggest he needs to become Roy Keane, David Batty and Paul Ince rolled into one. It is simply to say his tackling IS poor, and could be better.

How many times does he win the ball back compared to other AMs ? Without knowing for certain, I would think he compares favourably. Be interesting to see the stats.

I actually think he is ok at tackling. It's just that his style of tackling is not the blood and thunder 50 50 slide tackling that is easy on the eye.

It's the more intelligent kind. It's the nicking the ball kind.

That's my take on it without looking up the stats. Be interesting to see if it's true.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

How many times does he win the ball back compared to other AMs ? Without knowing for certain, I would think he compares favourably. Be interesting to see the stats.

I actually think he is ok at tackling. It's just that his style of tackling is not the blood and thunder 50 50 slide tackling that is easy on the eye.

It's the more intelligent kind. It's the nicking the ball kind.

That's my take on it without looking up the stats. Be interesting to see if it's true.

I said up thread, he is very good at the movement aspects of defending. Intercepts, closes down, shuts passing lanes - he is really effective.

And Im not even talking about naive charging in either, however eye catching someone might find it.

Im just talking about going into a tackle, the few times he does, with a genuine competitive edge to win the ball. At this point he just pays lip service and thats it.

Players win tackles with tenacity as much as anything, committing and seeing it through - Im not talking about being reckless or doing much to risk injury.

Look at Winks, similarly built to Eriksen and he has a good go with a fair degree of success.

 

[Hootnow]

I am frustrated with his injury record as the next Spurs fan but what are we realistically going to get for him because of it? £15-20mil? Not sure there is any point selling him for that sort money even with his injury record.

It doesn't matter. It could be £5 million for all I care. We need a player who we can rely upon.

6 seasons he's been at Spurs.

17, 46, 44, 12, 33, 31 appearances in total over those 6 seasons. Currently standing at exactly 30 appearances a season on average. So we have him available....for half a season.

As I said before in this thread, I was hugely excited about his arrival. He has not turned out to be the player I thought he would but I have defended him steadfastly for 6 seasons. Its enough now. We need someone we can rely upon and we need that foreign spot in the squad list.

We have literally just 2 attacking injuries in the attacking positions currently and it means we have Llorente and Janssen as bench options. Add in Son's suspension and Llorente's potential start against Ajax today, we have literally no attacking options off the bench for probably our biggest game as a club in decades.

Its not his fault and he seems like a great guy but its just a complete waste now.We need to think about the state of the squad.

 

[glasgowspur]

Well actually he was employed as a "sweeper keeper" and his using his feet and coming out away from goal being a big reason we signed him.

That said, I thnk youre being a bit basic about this. Yes, Lloris' primary job is keeping the ball out of the net, of course it is. Does that mean his kicking isnt important? Doesnt matter? Of course it does. And were he to improve his kicking the team would be better for it (I always find it notable when Gazzanaiga is in goal, his kicking is much better imo). It can really add a dimension.

Eriksen is of course a creative player, and a damn fine one at that. Why does that mean we shouldnt expect him to work on the weaker aspects of his game though (as with all players)? Why is it too much to think he might do better with his tackling, and consequently - much like Lloris' kicking - add something more to the team?

None of this is to suggest he needs to become Roy Keane, David Batty and Paul Ince rolled into one. It is simply to say his tackling IS poor, and could be better.

I was very specific about Hugo and his distribution, sweeper keeper is a misnomer because no keeper plays like a sweeper in a football sense.
As long as a player is fulfilling his primary role to a high and consistent level, as Hugo and Eriksen usually do, and do their best in their weaker areas then I think that's fair.
It is ironic that lamela (is it still his thread we are on?) and Eriksen are poles apart in playing style and get critised for not being more like each other.
Always said we will know when we have made the big time when we have a player that can bring both their talents together.

 

[glasgowspur]

It doesn't matter. It could be £5 million for all I care. We need a player who we can rely upon.

6 seasons he's been at Spurs.

17, 46, 44, 12, 33, 31 appearances in total over those 6 seasons. Currently standing at exactly 30 appearances a season on average. So we have him available....for half a season.

As I said before in this thread, I was hugely excited about his arrival. He has not turned out to be the player I thought he would but I have defended him steadfastly for 6 seasons. Its enough now. We need someone we can rely upon and we need that foreign spot in the squad list.

We have literally just 2 attacking injuries in the attacking positions currently and it means we have Llorente and Janssen as bench options. Add in Son's suspension and Llorente's potential start against Ajax today, we have literally no attacking options off the bench for probably our biggest game as a club in decades.

Its not his fault and he seems like a great guy but its just a complete waste now.We need to think about the state of the squad.

Would be interesting to see how times he's been fit but not selected, sat on the bench quite a bit as I recall.
Not really sure why poch has kept him around tbh, seems reluctant to use him.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

I was very specific about Hugo and his distribution, sweeper keeper is a misnomer because no keeper plays like a sweeper in a football sense.
As long as a player is fulfilling his primary role to a high and consistent level, as Hugo and Eriksen usually do, and do their best in their weaker areas then I think that's fair.
It is ironic that lamela (is it still his thread we are on?) and Eriksen are poles apart in playing style and get critised for not being more like each other.
Always said we will know when we have made the big time when we have a player that can bring both their talents together.

Semantics. A big part of us going for Lloris was that he is comfortable coming into the space behind the defenders even if it is far from goal. Where he is more likely to use his feet etc. Were he to improve this aspect of his game (and it doesnt come at the cost of anything else does it?) it would be better for him, us, and the team. This is a completely fair and valid point to make.

Similarly Eriksen.

I am, at no point, suggesting Eriksen tackle as well as he attacks and becomes the ultimate midfielder. Just as I am not suggesting Lloris learn to match Messi for dribbling skills.

What I am saying, is that if these players improve these obviously weak aspects, they become better players and we become a better team.

EVERY sportsman should be doing exactly this. Looking at what they are not good at/best at/weaker aspects and working on them.

I dont think its controversial to suggest Eriksen could and should tackle better.

I do think its odd to try and excuse this weakness though. "Its ok, thats not really his job". Doesnt really work for me at all.

Would be interesting to see how times he's been fit but not selected, sat on the bench quite a bit as I recall.
Not really sure why poch has kept him around tbh, seems reluctant to use him.

I think, generally (and subject to my admittedly iffy memory) he plays when he is fit.

Plays - injured - back in training - on the bench - plays again... (injured again...)

Once he is back in training he goes on the bench, then gets a few sub appearances, and then is back in starting rotation.

I dont really recall a time when he has been fit and ready to go and just not been used.

I think the thing with Lamela is that he has a great attitude, a real drive. On the pitch he is often the one to get the team to up the tempo and start pressing that extra % quicker/more aggressive. I imagine he is similar off the pitch, and would think this is a valuable thing to Poch.

If Poch is reluctant to use him (not sure Id say as much) I suggest its most likely to do with his fitness/risk of injury.

 

[glasgowspur]

Semantics. A big part of us going for Lloris was that he is comfortable coming into the space behind the defenders even if it is far from goal. Where he is more likely to use his feet etc. Were he to improve this aspect of his game (and it doesnt come at the cost of anything else does it?) it would be better for him, us, and the team. This is a completely fair and valid point to make.

Similarly Eriksen.

I am, at no point, suggesting Eriksen tackle as well as he attacks and becomes the ultimate midfielder. Just as I am not suggesting Lloris learn to match Messi for dribbling skills.

What I am saying, is that if these players improve these obviously weak aspects, they become better players and we become a better team.

EVERY sportsman should be doing exactly this. Looking at what they are not good at/best at/weaker aspects and working on them.

I dont think its controversial to suggest Eriksen could and should tackle better.

I do think its odd to try and excuse this weakness though. "Its ok, thats not really his job". Doesnt really work for me at all.





I think, generally (and subject to my admittedly iffy memory) he plays when he is fit.

Plays - injured - back in training - on the bench - plays again... (injured again...)

Once he is back in training he goes on the bench, then gets a few sub appearances, and then is back in starting rotation.

I dont really recall a time when he has been fit and ready to go and just not been used.

I think the thing with Lamela is that he has a great attitude, a real drive. On the pitch he is often the one to get the team to up the tempo and start pressing that extra % quicker/more aggressive. I imagine he is similar off the pitch, and would think this is a valuable thing to Poch.

If Poch is reluctant to use him (not sure Id say as much) I suggest its most likely to do with his fitness/risk of injury.

Our views obviously differ on this, so rather than persue it endlessly let's call it an Honourable score draw and go onto better things.

As for lamela and his injuries, it seems weird to me the way he can pick up injuries at almost any time doing anything.
It wouldn't look like a mental thing as he seems very driven and positive. Even this latest injury, done the warm up, something didn't feel right, doesn't sound too serious and yet looks like he could be out for 3-4 weeks. Bizarre

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

Our views obviously differ on this, so rather than persue it endlessly let's call it an Honourable score draw and go onto better things.

As for lamela and his injuries, it seems weird to me the way he can pick up injuries at almost any time doing anything.
It wouldn't look like a mental thing as he seems very driven and positive. Even this latest injury, done the warm up, something didn't feel right, doesn't sound too serious and yet looks like he could be out for 3-4 weeks. Bizarre

Fair enough.

Lamela? I think he is just a broken sort of body. Some players really shouldnt be players, they dont have the constitution.

Ive no doubt the spirit is willing, but it certainly seems the flesh is weak.

 

[glasgowspur]

Fair enough.

Lamela? I think he is just a broken sort of body. Some players really shouldnt be players, they dont have the constitution.

Ive no doubt the spirit is willing, but it certainly seems the flesh is weak.

Poch needs to look at his aura, too much fire red, needs some calming blue or green.

 

[DTA]

I said up thread, he is very good at the movement aspects of defending. Intercepts, closes down, shuts passing lanes - he is really effective.

And Im not even talking about naive charging in either, however eye catching someone might find it.

Im just talking about going into a tackle, the few times he does, with a genuine competitive edge to win the ball. At this point he just pays lip service and thats it.

Players win tackles with tenacity as much as anything, committing and seeing it through - Im not talking about being reckless or doing much to risk injury.

Look at Winks, similarly built to Eriksen and he has a good go with a fair degree of success.

Winks gets quite a few injuries though doesn't he?

 

[Spurs7891]

Lamela's injury problems are getting really frustrating. He started the season brilliantly that I thought he would easily score at least 10 league goals this season. Instead, he has been troubled with injury problems since then. But I think it will be more worth to keep him than sell him. I think we should accept the fact Lamela cannot play the whole season without any injuries. We should just make the most of him when he is injury free like earlier in the season.

It is a fact that Spurs are forever cursed with injury problems. King is the best example of it. Also, we just sold Dembele earlier this season due to his injury problems. I still think it is a big mistake to sell Dembele. Instead of expecting injury-prone players to become fully fit all the time, we should just make the most of them when they are fit.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

Winks gets quite a few injuries though doesn't he?

Seems to pick up niggles. Though I get the feeling he is yet to actually fully recover from a prior injury and most since are due to that. Boy needs proper rest and recovery IMO.

 

[DTA]

Lamela's injury problems are getting really frustrating. He started the season brilliantly that I thought he would easily score at least 10 league goals this season. Instead, he has been troubled with injury problems since then. But I think it will be more worth to keep him than sell him. I think we should accept the fact Lamela cannot play the whole season without any injuries. We should just make the most of him when he is injury free like earlier in the season.

It is a fact that Spurs are forever cursed with injury problems. King is the best example of it. Also, we just sold Dembele earlier this season due to his injury problems. I still think it is a big mistake to sell Dembele. Instead of expecting injury-prone players to become fully fit all the time, we should just make the most of them when they are fit.

I tend to agree with this, if he is not on big money, having him as an option off the bench is always going to be useful. Same with dembele.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

I tend to agree with this, if he is not on big money, having him as an option off the bench is always going to be useful. Same with dembele.

Except at least 50% of the time he isnt an option from the bench, but 100% of the time he is taking up a foreign player spot.

 

[Jurgen the German]

His goal/assistant stats are comparable to Zaha's in far fewer games. I imagine that's who you want us to blow 70+ mil on as a replacement?

I won't bother going into the detail, as I've done it before. Just be careful what you wish for is all I'll say.

Where did I say I wanted Zaha? Again people seem to want to deal in absolutes, “you’re annoyed we didn’t sign a player aren’t you? You’re annoyed we didn’t sign Jack Grealish”. Everyone who was critical of the clubs transfer policy this season = being annoyed we didn’t sign Grealish.

I’d be open to signing Zaha, he’s scored 9 league goals for mid table/relegation fodder Crystal Palace side, I’m sure a better coach like Poch could improve him even more. Having said that he wouldn’t be my first choice. I’d like to see us go for Isco if he’s available. Marco Reus would be a great signing, my only concern is his injury record so we may be back to square one if he’s injured regularly.

Also don’t understand why people get so wrapped up regarding the fee. It’s not my money quite frankly. If the club have the funds to go and sign a player who can improve us then why should we concern ourselves over the fee? The club is very well run and is in safe hands.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

I wish for better options than Lamela and Llorente and truly believe it would be impossible to get any worse. I don't dislike either players but neither have provided what we wanted this season and it's unlikely they ever will, both nice guys but it's not about being nice it's ALL about winning us games.

 

[SteveAWOL]

Would be interesting to see how times he's been fit but not selected, sat on the bench quite a bit as I recall.
Not really sure why poch has kept him around tbh, seems reluctant to use him.

According to Transfermarkt, Lamela has been an unused substitute 20 times since he joined Tottenham.

So to compare to his fellow S Club 7 member...

Lamela: 205 times in squad, 185 appearances for a total of 10,670 minutes
Eriksen: 286 times in squad, 272 appearances for a total of 22,067 minutes

 

[90291Spur]

Isn’t this forum for active players?

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

Boat 11, come in, your time is up.