metalgear
Nayim
yeah this - he is going to be raw but he is miles ahead of even Kane who has just tasted the closing of a season. Dier has competed and stuck through a full campaign. He is ready to start.
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General Transfer Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Cochise
- Start date
yeah this - he is going to be raw but he is miles ahead of even Kane who has just tasted the closing of a season. Dier has competed and stuck through a full campaign. He is ready to start.
I'd say the opposite.
Dier has only played 26 games (over two seasons) in the top division in Portugal. And 16 games (also over two seasons) in the second tier (for the Sporting B team). He's also played 4 League Cup games. That's the sum total of his senior career.
Kane has only played 11 Premier League games (8 for Spurs; 3 for Norwich). But he has also played 37 Championship games (for Millwall and Leicester) and 18 League One games (for Orient). He has also played 6 FA Cup games; 3 League Cup games; and 8 Europa League games.
Granted that, as a striker, it's more likely that a greater number of Kane's appearances have been as sub. But against that, Kane has far greater experience of English football; greater experience of first team football; and has played in a far more competitive league at a higher level than Dier - even when in the Championship. He also has the benefit of having been at Spurs since he was a kid and having been a part of the first team squad for the past year. There's also a bigger learning curve for young defenders than there is for young forwards. The Premier League can be an unforgiving place for a rookie defender learning his trade.
So I suspect that Dier will be used sparingly this season. Eased in gently. Europa League, League Cup, FA Cup, the occasional Premier League game.
metalgear
Nayim
I suppose the gap isn't that far.
Can you imagine starting a 18/19 year old in defence and as CB? That is a very demanding position for a young one and anyone there is under severe pressure, getting yelled at by practically anyone and everyone. I think Dier has proven himself in a more trying circumstance. And Sporting Lisbon, with their wealth of attacking talents, also use him as a free kick specialist too. I have no doubt that this is an excellent signing, going by how badly Sporting Lisbon seem to be coping with the loss.
Agreed. At least, I hope that that's right!
But I also think that Harry Kane is ready to make a significant contribution to our first team's efforts this coming season.
Am I the only one really, really excited by the Schneiderlin and Depay transfer rumours? It seems that finally our club have dropped the "my mate's an agent and he wants us to sign......" method and moved into a more modern, efficient method of scouting.
I don't think it's a coincidence that those two players are the ones that top the "stats per £ of cost" ratings out of all the big(ish) leagues in Europe. Ted Knutson recommended them as the deep-lying midfielder Arsenal desperately need and the forward Liverpool need to replace Suarez respectively. This is using his stat-based method of scouting which, when applied retrospectively over the last few years, would have massively outperformed the scouting at any club in Europe. His method also rates Yedlin very highly.
Has Poch brought the 21st century with him?
I don't think it's a coincidence that those two players are the ones that top the "stats per £ of cost" ratings out of all the big(ish) leagues in Europe. Ted Knutson recommended them as the deep-lying midfielder Arsenal desperately need and the forward Liverpool need to replace Suarez respectively. This is using his stat-based method of scouting which, when applied retrospectively over the last few years, would have massively outperformed the scouting at any club in Europe. His method also rates Yedlin very highly.
Has Poch brought the 21st century with him?
Sandman
Dean Austin
I find it very hard to get excited about any signing these days. It seems its much harder to have an instant impact on the Premier league when coming in that almost any other of the top Divisions.
We signed so many players last summer and only one really got near his level of play from his previous club. To me we have a massive squad that needs developing. Not yet more new players added just for the sake of it.
Schniderling looks a very good player. But we have Dembele, Sandro and Capoue. More than enough depth for that kind of position. Do we really need to add another player that may or may not come off. Its almost like every fan now bases success on how much money you spend and if you are buying players or not.
We need a Centre back so we got Dier. If we are getting rid of BAE we needed another left back for cover. So I am fine with us signing Davies. But we have a lot of fringe players who dont want to seem to leave as well.
Depay looks a fine player. The kind I would like to see at Spurs. But lets get rid of Chadli first and have him compete with Townsend.
Coaching. Thats is my main want for this team now. Well coached, improve the players we have and then see what we need. If Poch can coach up some of our own players we may not need to spend yet more money for the sake of it.
Sorry, I didn't mean the individual signings themselves (although I do rate those to highly) - at best with a modern scouting approach you'll only have a 60% hit rate. What excites me is that we're using an approach (or there's some very heavy coincidence here) that might allow us to close the gap on the richer clubs.
As I see it, if we can catch the clubs above us, it will be through:
a) Having a better academy
b) Having a better scouting system
c) Having better players
d) Having better tactics (more than the sum of our parts, yada yada yada)
a) Could work - we have what seems to be an incredible academy. We also have the advantage of being able to promote kids faster than other clubs
b) Will not work using the old methods. They're very unreliable and the best (but still unreliable) scouts will just get poached by richer clubs. We can steal a march with modern techniques though
c) We can't do this. We may have some very good or even great players for a short time but they will eventually move for more money
d) I think we're well on our way here. The last couple of seasons we caught up with the rest of the footballing world, Poch looks to me like he can push us on past the rest
I'd say that our transfer targets suggest we are looking at b) and doing something about it. If we can get in on the more modern methods of scouting at the base level we may be able to steal a march in the way some clubs did at the beginning of the PL.
Bullet
Luka Modric
I understand what you mean. But Schneiderlin is a Harry-type-signing i.e. "He used to be a key player in my team, I'll bring him with me" and not necessarily a stats-driven insightful purchase
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
Schneiderlin was arguably the best CM in the EPL last season. It's more a case of Poch being the only chance we've got of signing him, rather than we're signing him because he's Poch's son's mat
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
So with strong rumours that Musacchio and Yedlin are about to sign, this will be a window we end up signing a complete new back 5 - GK, LB, RB and two CBs.
All under 24 too other than Vorm.
Now that's building from the back.
All under 24 too other than Vorm.
Now that's building from the back.
Reports suggest that Yedlin will stay with the Sounders until the end of their season, though.
And with the Sounders likely to be involved in the playoffs, he wouldn't be available to us until November at the earliest. December if they go all the way. And if it gets to that point, we might as well give him a few weeks off for Christmas and New Year before joining us.
^ What he said.
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
That's still probably enough that we can let Naughton go to Swansea, which is probably the thing hanging on this.
Work permits were abolished several years ago. We now have PBS instead.
Yedlin is also a full international. IIRC Convey was only a youth international at the time.
He wouldn't be eligible to play for us until January anyway once this window has closed. Always good with a complete break from football every once in a while, especially if you're moving between continents.
braineclipse
Willie Hall
Lamela, Bentaleb, Ben Davies, Dier, Kane, Eriksen... We're certainly getting there.
Good to see a renewed focus on younger players for the first team squad - served us well in the recent past. If two or three really make the step up over the next couple of years then it could once again provide a platform from which to break the top four - of course the hope is it won't take that long
(Before Levy stripping it down and selling to the highest bidder /whoopwhoop ...
)
(Before Levy stripping it down and selling to the highest bidder /whoopwhoop ...
)braineclipse
Willie Hall
Good to see a renewed focus on younger players for the first team squad - served us well in the recent past. If two or three really make the step up over the next couple of years then it could once again provide a platform from which to break the top four - of course the hope is it won't take that long
(Before Levy stripping it down and selling to the highest bidder /whoopwhoop ...
Hopefully we'll find a good balance. Certainly it's vital for us to sign younger players with a lot of potential that can improve. But I think sometimes we've taken that too far and a couple more experienced and PL experienced players would have done us good. So far this summer we've seemingly done a good job trying to find that balance.