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F.A statement on the word "yid"

Has the time come for us stop chanting the Y-word?

  • Yes

    Votes: 10 9.0%

  • No

    Votes: 101 91.0%
  • Total voters
    111
Interesting angle that - i guess had we been abused in the 60s/70s for being a 'black' club then it's possible we'd be using an offensive term as we now use the word Yid - although i think the N bomb would probably have been off limits - i don't think Yid is on the same level, but that's from an outsiders perspective.
 
I don't think yid is in the same sphere of offensiveness as nigger. Kike is the more offensive terms. If we called ourselves the kike army, maybe they'd have a point. But we don't.
 
I have stayed out of this debate as it really is one neither side can win. TBH if we start comparing offensiveness of words as a factor in their acceptability then we are on a loser. As I'm sure has been pointed out the context surely is everything. Unfortunately those offended by the Y-word cannot see past the word itself. It makes me wonder if they would be offended if it was written in a book as part of a discussion on Jewish history. Or is perhaps that they are offended because it is not Jewish people, in the main, chanting and non-jews cannot claim any right to "own" an essentially Jewish phrase?
 
The general thrust of the arguments against singing it are correct but every time either Kick Racism Out of Football or whoever injects to say we shouldn't chant it, it just ensures that it is chanted even more. If anything, it was somewhat dying out anyway when it was first suggested we should stop.
 
Robspur12 said:
Or is perhaps that they are offended because it is not Jewish people, in the main, chanting and non-jews cannot claim any right to "own" an essentially Jewish phrase?
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It is a major part of the issue. Having a probably 95% gentile crowd chanting a racial epithet about Jews is very odd. We're not quoting it in a neutral way. The Rabbi on Sunday Morning Live this morning was just blown away by this logic. It was quite funny to watch in a way. Having gentiles angrily tell him that it doesn't cause any issues - as if they'd know compared with him!
 
Harry_Perkins said:
It is a major part of the issue. Having a probably 95% gentile crowd chanting a racial epithet about Jews is very odd. We're not quoting it in a neutral way. The Rabbi on Sunday Morning Live this morning was just blown away by this logic. It was quite funny to watch in a way. Having gentiles angrily tell him that it doesn't cause any issues - as if they'd know compared with him!
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Well by being religious he has shown himself incapable of properly applying logic, so the idea's not ridiculous.
 
scaramanga said:
Well by being religious he has shown himself incapable of properly applying logic, so the idea's not ridiculous.
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Yeah but he wasn't coming at it from a religious perspective, was he? It was from a racial perspective. And lots of gentiles were angrily telling him what for. I wish people would just concede that they don't care if some Jews don't like the chants and move on. When we end up arguing with Jews who don't like the chants... what does that do to the reputation of our club? It is one thing when it is David Baddiel and his brother and we can delude ourselves that they have an agenda because they're Chelsea but it is another when it is ordinary Jewish fans of other clubs or the average Jewish person in the street.
 
It's hardly delusional to think Baddiel has an agenda when he supports his fellow Chelsea skinhead by making excuses for their behavior.
 
Superted said:
It's hardly delusional to think Baddiel has an agenda when he supports his fellow Chelsea skinhead by making excuses for their behavior.
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He is not making excuses though. He doesn't want to hear this **** at football and we're part of the problem. Clearly plenty of other Jews feel the same. Do they all have an agenda or maybe it is their real feelings on the matter?
 
Other Kicks we'd like to see:

Kick Sh*t Refereeing Out of Football
Kick Good Technology Into Football
Kick Corruption Out Of Football
Kick Blatter Out Of Football
Kick Diving Out of Football
Kick Surrounding the Red Out of Football
Kick Real Racism Out of Football
 
Harry_Perkins said:
He is not making excuses though. He doesn't want to hear this **** at football and we're part of the problem. Clearly plenty of other Jews feel the same. Do they all have an agenda or maybe it is their real feelings on the matter?
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But Baddiel excuses the Chelsea fans behavior and blames Spurs using the term yid for it. That's his position and it's so flawed that you can't take him seriously on the issue.
 
Superted said:
But Baddiel excuses the Chelsea fans behavior and blames Spurs using the term yid for it. That's his position and it's so flawed that you can't take him seriously on the issue.
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He doesn't though, does he? He says we can't get rid of it from football by saying this one set of fans are okay to chant it but no one else can. I think that is reasonable. He is not excusing, just pointing out the flawed logic.
 
This has got me thinking about other words that fans use and one word that maybe a lot of people do not realise is another words for gays.

When the Hammers sing 'Come on you Irons' What does this mean? Well in the good old world of ****ney rhyming slang Iron.. Iron Hoof.. ****.

Will the FA therefore stop West Ham singing 'Come on you ****s' :-k :lol:
 
Harry_Perkins said:
He doesn't though, does he? He says we can't get rid of it from football by saying this one set of fans are okay to chant it but no one else can. I think that is reasonable. He is not excusing, just pointing out the flawed logic.
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With all due respect, he does:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/17/david-cameron-yid-really-is-race-hate-word

The fact is that whatever its origins, their continuing use of the Y-word legitimises and sustains the racist abuse aimed at Spurs by other fans. It's a call and response dynamic, like many at football matches. So the more Spurs do it, the more it comes back, with menaces. Many Chelsea fans who I have challenged feel they are justified because "the Yids is what Spurs call themselves".

It's chicken & egg stuff. He says we shoud stop calling ourselves Yid and the abuse from Chelsea fans will stop. This is frankly just bull ****. As others have said which I agree with, if the anti-semitic stuff stopped from Chelsea fans, and there was a movement for us to stop, you'd consider it. If Baddiel was a Liverpool fan (who as far as I'm aware rarely if ever direct anti-semitic abuse to us) then it would carry weight. But he's a Chelsea fan. I have never heard him condemn his fellow fans, and for this as far as I am concerned indicates an acceptance of it.

If Spurs fans started burning the Australian flag and sing anti-Australian songs such that Spurs got themselves a reputation as Anti-Australian, whereby I would feel intimidated and unwelcome at WHL, you can bet your sweet ass I would stop considering myself a Spurs fan.
 
Harry_Perkins said:
He doesn't though, does he? He says we can't get rid of it from football by saying this one set of fans are okay to chant it but no one else can. I think that is reasonable. He is not excusing, just pointing out the flawed logic.
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i posted this earlier in the thread....

The problem with Baddiel is his credibility.

How can you rant on about this issue being disgusting, racist, and offensive, and yet still continue too sit among the worst perpetrators at Stamford Bridge.

His love of Chelsea is greater and of more importance to him than his religion. That is the only conclusion you can draw.

If he cannot make a stand, it's because he is spineless.


1,Has he not bothered making a stand against this by staying away from the Bridge? (and publically announcing it)

2,Has he given up trying to change the behaviour of Chelsea fans because they are thick as pig sh*t or likely to 'kick is f*ckin ead in' (or both)?

So he has turned to us and and tried to reason that if we can refrain then maybe there will be a change from rival fans as well. Baddiel is obviously an educated man but sadly many around him at the Bridge (and the Boleyn for that matter) are not, and would they stop? No they won't.

David.....start off trying points 1 & 2 above, i have a feeling that is the 'logical' order of progression.
 
racism
noun

the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races:
prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one’s own race is superior:


We are not using the term in a racist manner, just because some idiot takes offence to it does not make them right, even if they are Jewish. Some people take offence to girls wearing skimpy outfits, should that be banned? some people take offence to others eating meat, should that be banned? I personally take offence to Arsene Wengers face but they keep showing that on TV despite my complaints.

As I've said before, I'm not particularly fond of these chants as I'm not Jewish and can't really relate to it but it's not racist in any way. Eminem uses the word Nigga in a lot of his songs and guess what, he's white. Some people might take offense but he's not using it in a racist way, he's using it in the same way we're using Yid, he's not been prosecuted as a racist and never will be, nor should we.

I listened to that prick from the racist black lawyers society on SkySports the other day, now he was really offensive. Claiming that our use of it and Chelseas/others hissing etc is the same for the victim, it's all about the victim apparently, what ****ing victim, we're not directing it at anyone or victimising anyone.

Some people are simply easily offended and some people jump on the bandwagon saying they are offended to further their own agenda, none of that makes us wrong.
 
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