ENIC

[parklane1]

Loris too thinks we could have won something under Pochettino. Obviously it would have meant the owners coughing up their own cash then.

Lloris names two key reasons Spurs failed to win a trophy under Pochettino

Ex-Spurs captain gives insight into club’s long wait for silverware

www.standard.co.uk

“We were close to winning. I think at the time, we missed two or three more players to compete for success and for him to win trophies.

“Our progression was too fast for the club because, at that time, they were focused on the new stadium. They did not have the financial reserve as they do now. At that time, we needed to add a few players and regenerate that group of players.”

we did have a team which should have won something but far too often the mentality of some was not strong enough to have won the REAL crunch games.

 

[Bishop]

Loris too thinks we could have won something under Pochettino. Obviously it would have meant the owners coughing up their own cash then.

Lloris names two key reasons Spurs failed to win a trophy under Pochettino

Ex-Spurs captain gives insight into club’s long wait for silverware

www.standard.co.uk

“We were close to winning. I think at the time, we missed two or three more players to compete for success and for him to win trophies.

“Our progression was too fast for the club because, at that time, they were focused on the new stadium. They did not have the financial reserve as they do now. At that time, we needed to add a few players and regenerate that group of players.”

He's not saying anything we don't all know. We lacked depth and support quality.

 

[Bishop]

we did have a team which should have won something but far too often the mentality of some was not strong enough to have won the REAL crunch games.

We had a good starting 11, we didn't have a squad and it's usually the teams with squads that win.

 

[parklane1]

We had a good starting 11, we didn't have a squad and it's usually the teams with squads that win.

And some of the best players in the squad failed to turn a performance in on to many occasions, mentality was not the best far much more of a problem in the BIG games.

 

[Gazza Dazzla]

He's not saying anything we don't all know. We lacked depth and support quality.

And the reason was because we were building a stadium. Like you say, we all know the reasons for the situation.

Still had enough semi’s and a final or two to get it over the line though with that squad (and outstanding first 14-15).

 

[Bishop]

And the reason was because we were building a stadium. Like you say, we all know the reasons for the situation.

Still had enough semi’s and a final or two to get it over the line though with that squad (and outstanding first 14-15).

I think we were unlucky moreso than just not turning up. Typically we were the underdogs and the result went as the form books or expectations would have expected.

Without going into it all again for me it was the lack of depth that caused those problems towards the end of the seasons and in those semis and finals, rather than a lack of mentality.

 

[Baleforce]

And the reason was because we were building a stadium. Like you say, we all know the reasons for the situation.

Still had enough semi’s and a final or two to get it over the line though with that squad (and outstanding first 14-15).

Too many big games, our big players, bottled it.

Kane, Eriksen, Son, Lloris. Didn’t do it when it mattered.

 

[seaside spur]

And the reason was because we were building a stadium. Like you say, we all know the reasons for the situation.

Still had enough semi’s and a final or two to get it over the line though with that squad (and outstanding first 14-15).

The fa cup semi final against Chelsea was a perfect example. We had to put Son left back. That cost us.
They had Hazard on the bench to come on and win them the game. .
Maybe we had more injuries than them , but you know why ? They could afford to rotate more during the season so at the back end of the season they had less injuries and fresher players. That's all because of squad depth.
We've seen it this season. We are slowly getting a deeper squad with better quality but we aren't there yet.

 

[tommysvr]

The fa cup semi final against Chelsea was a perfect example. We had to put Son left back. That cost us.
They had Hazard on the bench to come on and win them the game.

We had Ben Davies on the bench and brought Walker on for Son and moved Trippier to LWB in the 68th minute, so I’m not sure “we had to” play Son there. My memory is that it was a massive fudge up by Pochettino.

 

[Bishop]

We had Ben Davies on the bench and brought Walker on for Son and moved Trippier to LWB in the 68th minute, so I’m not sure “we had to” play Son there. My memory is that it was a massive fudge up by Pochettino.

It was a fudge from Poch trying to get Son and Dele in the same team and playing my dreaded 3 at the back to make it work and it never did.

Again to combat what the likes of @Baleforce say that isn't a bottling from the players, it was a poor setup from the manager changing what had been a wining system to try and fit everyone in. Chelsea on the other hand rested the likes of Hazard and Costa and were able to bring them on at a critical junction, fresh and ready to make an impact.

Our bench had 0 midfield or attacking quality. If people have forgotten our bench was

2 Walker
9 Janssen
14 Nkoudou
17 Sissoko
27 Wimmer
30 López
33 Davies

That's a trash bench, let's not lie to ourselves. Theres absolutely 0 quality to bring on in the midfield or attacking areas.

We could never win because we never had a squad capable of doing so.

 

[Gazza Dazzla]

It was a fudge from Poch trying to get Son and Dele in the same team and playing my dreaded 3 at the back to make it work and it never did.

Again to combat what the likes of @Baleforce say that isn't a bottling from the players, it was a poor setup from the manager changing what had been a wining system to try and fit everyone in. Chelsea on the other hand rested the likes of Hazard and Costa and were able to bring them on at a critical junction, fresh and ready to make an impact.

Our bench had 0 midfield or attacking quality. If people have forgotten our bench was

2 Walker
9 Janssen
14 Nkoudou
17 Sissoko
27 Wimmer
30 López
33 Davies

That's a trash bench, let's not lie to ourselves. Theres absolutely 0 quality to bring on in the midfield or attacking areas.

We could never win because we never had a squad capable of doing so.

He would have had at least 1 good attacking option on the bench if he’d have chosen between Dele or Son instead of shoe horning them in to the same side on the day. We were in good form going in to the game with Davies at full back but the manager changed it for this one. This was 100% on Poch i’m afraid.

 

[Grays_1890]

I think we were unlucky moreso than just not turning up. Typically we were the underdogs and the result went as the form books or expectations would have expected.

Without going into it all again for me it was the lack of depth that caused those problems towards the end of the seasons and in those semis and finals, rather than a lack of mentality.

The underdogs tag is a cop out though. There is a long history of Underdogs winning cups, we proved that by winning loads even when not being anywhere near the top of the game, people make it sound like we were Morecombe.

2 of our last three trophies we were massive underdogs.

We won Semi finals against Arsenal and Chelsea as massive underdogs and sh1t the finals.....

You are talking utter jive to say we could never win because of depth

 

[Grays_1890]

We had Ben Davies on the bench and brought Walker on for Son and moved Trippier to LWB in the 68th minute, so I’m not sure “we had to” play Son there. My memory is that it was a massive fudge up by Pochettino.

Poch confirmed after the game it was "Tactical".

Also one thing that is massively taken for granted with that game IMO is that Chelsea obviously rested players, yes their bench was better but their starting line up was an invitation for that to not even being a factor. If we didn't biazzarely change our set up and went in as we had all season, we should have won that game before the subs became an issue.

Kane, Alli, Eriksen and Son off the bench, against Luiz and Ake (Ake of then not now)....

 

[Bishop]

He would have had at least 1 good attacking option on the bench if he’d have chosen between Dele or Son instead of shoe horning them in to the same side on the day. We were in good form going in to the game with Davies at full back but the manager changed it for this one. This was 100% on Poch i’m afraid.

I agree it was a fudge up by Poch. I was responding to Baleforce and others saying we lost due to a lack of mentality. Which was not the case on the day. I agree we should have just started with Son and had Dele on the bench (or vice versa if that was your view) I would still say that just having one of the on the bench is not pleathra of quality options. It's not even the minimum. Compare the bench even with that change to what Chelsea had and it's not even close. Chelsea had Cesc, Hazard and Costa on their bench and the game which had been even up to that point changed when they were able to bring them on. Even just a Dele or Son alone as the change would not be a comparable substitution.

Poch confirmed after the game it was "Tactical".

Also one thing that is massively taken for granted with that game IMO is that Chelsea obviously rested players, yes their bench was better but their starting line up was an invitation for that to not even being a factor. If we didn't biazzarely change our set up and went in as we had all season, we should have won that game before the subs became an issue.

Kane, Alli, Eriksen and Son off the bench, against Luiz and Ake (Ake of then not now)....

I disagree. The starting line up they went with was as good as the lineup we had. That's the difference in squad depth that I'm talking about. They had a staring line up of comparable quality and then were able to bring on genuine world class players in the likes of Hazard and Cesc along with the also top class Costa. Depth is exactly what won them that game.

Re underdogs, sure underdogs win sometimes but just that, sometimes. It's a shame we weren't able to but you can't call a team the underdog and then criticise them for not actually winning. That's why they were the underdogs in the first place.

 

[Grays_1890]

I agree it was a fudge up by Poch. I was responding to Baleforce and others saying we lost due to a lack of mentality. Which was not the case on the day. I agree we should have just started with Son and had Dele on the bench (or vice versa if that was your view) I would still say that just having one of the on the bench is not pleathra of quality options. It's not even the minimum. Compare the bench even with that change to what Chelsea had and it's not even close. Chelsea had Cesc, Hazard and Costa on their bench and the game which had been even up to that point changed when they were able to bring them on. Even just a Dele or Son alone as the change would not be a comparable substitution.


I disagree. The starting line up they went with was as good as the lineup we had. That's the difference in squad depth that I'm talking about. They had a staring line up of comparable quality and then were able to bring on genuine world class players in the likes of Hazard and Cesc along with the also top class Costa. Depth is exactly what won them that game.

Re underdogs, sure underdogs win sometimes but just that, sometimes. It's a shame we weren't able to but you can't call a team the underdog and then criticise them for not actually winning. That's why they were the underdogs in the first place.

Na sorry, we had a generational back line that Poch decided to break up for the game, had Walker not been naughty stepped it's far superior back line, the midfield of Wanyama and Dembele is a match for anything and I'm sorry, Eriksen, Kane and Alli at that time could and usually would take anyone down, its better than Batshuyi or whatever they started with.

 

[Baleforce]

I agree it was a fudge up by Poch. I was responding to Baleforce and others saying we lost due to a lack of mentality. Which was not the case on the day. I agree we should have just started with Son and had Dele on the bench (or vice versa if that was your view) I would still say that just having one of the on the bench is not pleathra of quality options. It's not even the minimum. Compare the bench even with that change to what Chelsea had and it's not even close. Chelsea had Cesc, Hazard and Costa on their bench and the game which had been even up to that point changed when they were able to bring them on. Even just a Dele or Son alone as the change would not be a comparable substitution.


I disagree. The starting line up they went with was as good as the lineup we had. That's the difference in squad depth that I'm talking about. They had a staring line up of comparable quality and then were able to bring on genuine world class players in the likes of Hazard and Cesc along with the also top class Costa. Depth is exactly what won them that game.

Re underdogs, sure underdogs win sometimes but just that, sometimes. It's a shame we weren't able to but you can't call a team the underdog and then criticise them for not actually winning. That's why they were the underdogs in the first place.

I wasn’t thinking about FA cup games. I rarely do. I was thinking more the league games against Leicester when they won it, and the CL final, where Kane, and especially Eriksen just didn’t do anything.

I’m sure I could come up with many other examples of league and CL games where certain players didn’t show up, that’s bottling it imo.

 

[Bishop]

Na sorry, we had a generational back line that Poch decided to break up for the game, had Walker not been naughty stepped it's far superior back line, the midfield of Wanyama and Dembele is a match for anything and I'm sorry, Eriksen, Kane and Alli at that time could and usually would take anyone down, its better than Batshuyi or whatever they started with.

We are going to have agree to disagree. You're overrating Spurs and underrating Chelsea. Which is funny because they were clearly better than us given they won the match, and won the league that season. You need to take off your Spurs biased glasses and look at the sides objectively.

 

[Bishop]

I wasn’t thinking about FA cup games. I rarely do. I was thinking more the league games against Leicester when they won it, and the CL final, where Kane, and especially Eriksen just didn’t do anything.

I’m sure I could come up with many other examples of league and CL games where certain players didn’t show up, that’s bottling it imo.

Kane was unfit for the CL Final if you've forgotten. He should have never been selected (again another failing of Poch). A unfit player being unable to perform is an example of lacking mentality it's a case of a coach not having the strength to actually pick his fit players over his "star" names.

Eriksen I agree with, but again I agree that's down to the lack of squad depth. We only ever had Eriksen for the creative role, meaning that if he had a poor game or was targeted we had no other means of getting the ball into good areas. Wanyama, Demebele or Dier were never going to help in that respect.

The teams that win things usually have a multitude of options to challenge or supplement their main option. To win you quality and a depth to that quality. We've never had that, my hope is this time around we are actually building as a team that has serious intentions builds.

You can think that 11 was the greatest thing the world has ever seen (it wasn't) but at the end of the day just an 11 is very rarely enough to win unless everything falls your way.

 

[Grays_1890]

We are going to have agree to disagree. You're overrating Spurs and underrating Chelsea. Which is funny because they were clearly better than us given they won the match, and won the league that season. You need to take off your Spurs biased glasses and look at the sides objectively.

No I'm clearly talking about how they rested their stars for an hour and had Poch not tickered we had a much stronger starting 11 and didn't take advantage.

Maybe I am losing my marbles but didn't we beat their strongest side 2-0 and if I recall were very good for that result in the season? So maybe your analysis of their weakened side is over egging the difference in quality and the underdogs tag. We had 3 players score 20 goals that season, GHod knows what Eriksens contribution to goals and assists was but I bet it was substantial. We were second in the league that year so can we stop making out we were not a good side and its a made up rhetoric that we were

Maybe it's because Chelsea are in a final today and the Spurs self loathing in you has come to the fore

 

[Baleforce]

I hope Poch gets it right today.