Ratings vs QPR

[Spursalot]

So, the sum of his attacking contribution was one early cross, one cross that landed between two Spurs players and "looking a threat". When did he take players on, get to the byline, open up the opposition and produce a clear cut chance? As a winger (attacking RM) that has to be his primary role, and his lack of delivery is one of the reasons we are not functioning as an attacking threat at present. I agree he worked hard, but dont think he delivered much at all in the final third. He is too often static and does not make himself available enough for a pass inside the full back. He has phenomonal pace and yet imv doesnt fulfill his potential nearly enough for me.

During the match. Five or six times from deep.

Considering we didn't actually attack that often, the majority of the few we did have went through Lennon. Other then what he created i can remember possiby one charge down field by Vertonghen, and maybe one or two from Dembele.


We looked completely lop sided. The right hand side looked immensely superior to the left. In both halves of the game.

 

[Pirate55]

During the match. Five or six times from deep.Considering we didn't actually attack that often, the majority of the few we did have went through Lennon. Other then what he created i can remember possiby one charge down field by Vertonghen, and maybe one or two from Dembele.


We looked completely lop sided. The right hand side looked immensely superior to the left. In both halves of the game.

My point exactly. We didnt attack that often and when Lennon did it was from deep. It really didnt hurt the opposition and we created diddly squat.

For the first hour, one mibrick shot from Defoe was the total of our attacking intent. Lennon has to take players on and make things happen. For me, he just doesnt do this often enough given his talent. Hence my disappointment in him against QPR. He did it once against Reading and it led to a goal. Why doesnt he do it more. I am not interested in him "retaining possession" when in an advance position, I would much rather him dribble, take men on and create a clear cut chance even if it meant him losing posession two out of three times. The one success would lead to something happening. At the moment, nothing is happening up front. Lennon and Bale are the players that can make it happen. Townsend has created two clear chances in the last two games and he has only been on the park for about five minutes.

 

[Spursalot]

My point exactly. We didnt attack that often and when Lennon did it was from deep. It really didnt hurt the opposition and we created diddly squat.

For the first hour, one mibrick shot from Defoe was the total of our attacking intent. Lennon has to take players on and make things happen. For me, he just doesnt do this often enough given his talent. Hence my disappointment in him against QPR. He did it once against Reading and it led to a goal. Why doesnt he do it more. I am not interested in him "retaining possession" when in an advance position, I would much rather him dribble, take men on and create a clear cut chance even if it meant him losing posession two out of three times. The one success would lead to something happening. At the moment, nothing is happening up front. Lennon and Bale are the players that can make it happen. Townsend has created two clear chances in the last two games and he has only been on the park for about five minutes.

It's not your point exactly. Lennon picking up the ball and going past three or four players is the exact opposite of your point. No, it didn't really 'hurt' the opposition, but they only thing that would actually hurt the opposition is scoring a goal.


Lennon was one of our best players yesterday, if you seriously don't think he's played well enough so far this season, i'd hate to hear what you think about the rest of the team, excluding Freidel, who has been our only other consistent performer thus far.

 

[ArcspacE]

Brad - 6

Walker - 6
Gallas - 6
Vertonghen - 8 - MotM
Bale - 6

Lennon - 7
Dembele - 7
Dempsey - 6
Sandro - 6
Sigurdsson - 5

Defoe - 6

Caulker - 7

 

[Libero]

Friedel - 8

Walker - 6
Gallas - 6
Vertonghen - 9
Bale - 7

Lennon - 8
Dembele -7
Dempsey - 5
Sandro - 6
Sigurdsson - 4

Defoe - 6

Caulker - 6

I thought Vertonghen was absolutely superb. Pretty decent in the first half but outstanding in the second as LB.

Caulker came on and for me was bullied a little bit at times which was annoying, especially as it was against Hoilett. I just wanted him to make sure the next challenge on Hoilett was one where he knew that Caulker wasn't going to let him get away with the nudges and pushes off the ball but it didn't come. I think he needs to show a little more aggression at times but I thought that even when he was shining in the U-18s.

The balance of the side still didn't seem right even at 442, can't put my finger on it but we just look too exposed. We are playing quite high lines at times but without the high pressing deep in the opponents half. For the style and system he wants to play, I really think our personnel would be more suited to 352.

It would give us 2 men up front and allow our pressing to start right from there (which it isnt really doing now) whilst giving us bodies in midfield. Width would also be achieved using Walker and Bale as wing backs whilst allowing them not to be so exposed if they are caught or lose the ball in the opposition half as the extra centre half can sweep round and pick up the pieces if required - a position I think Vertonghen would be superb in.

It also means that we don't isolate the forward quite as much given that we would be employing two and it also means that the 2 wide players are not caught between systems when we do and don't have the ball which is the problem with playing 433/4231 and why it takes quite a while to get used to playing that system.

 

[Pirate55]

It's not your point exactly. Lennon picking up the ball and going past three or four players is the exact opposite of your point. No, it didn't really 'hurt' the opposition, but they only thing that would actually hurt the opposition is scoring a goal.


Lennon was one of our best players yesterday, if you seriously don't think he's played well enough so far this season, i'd hate to hear what you think about the rest of the team, excluding Freidel, who has been our only other consistent performer thus far.

I'm confused by this. That is exactly what I want him to do. This will "hurt" the opposition and create chances or score goals.

To say Lennon is the "best" of our attacking players is all relative. I dont think any of them have exactly shone this season so far. Bale - under par, Defoe - scoring but missing loads and not a line leader, Sig - not yet settled, Dempsey and Ade - not enough minutes and no preseason. All in all - we are not showing nearly enough attacking intent, especially at home. The amount of times they were all static yesterday was hard to watch - especially in the first half when they were all dire, including Lennon.

 

[Mumorn]

Pretty much agree with most ratings given.

Apart of me wants Friedel to start against Man Utd as he has been our best player this season and I think he has deserved it, but part of me knows how dangerous Man Utd are from set pieces etc and I know Lloris is stronger in that respect than Friedel, tricky decision but I think Friedel will keep it up, two great saves.

I really dont know about Walker, if Ekotto was fit, I honestly think Naughton would have taken his place at right back by now, he really has been our worst player this year (tied with Sigurdsson for me), but I have no doubt he'll hit form again soon, he's a talented footballer and obviously still very young.

Caulker was solid I thought, some errors here and there but he's young and hardly played for us in the past, he's come from a team who like to pass it about a bit and it is totally different here, do i think its early to start him against United? If you're good enough you're old enough. Livermore got his first prem start for us against United, so did Gareth Bale. I think he deserves a place ahead of Gallas, but who knows, maybe he'll play Vert left back and if thats the case I'd like Caulker to be given a game against an experienced head like Gallas.

I don't know if it is just me but does anyone else think Lennon is becoming a MUCH improved player under AVB? I thought he was good against QPR and was our best player against Lazio, always a threat in my eyes. Bale is a left midfielder, and with Vertonghen behind him, it could be the start of something very good!

Dembele and Sandro weren't at the best against QPR but both are great defensively, both have that ability to just nick the ball off players, both cover ground very well. I actually think they compliment eachother very well and really like the pairing, both could quite easily be a great partnership for years to come!

Defoe deserves a start against United. Have Dempsey play off him, dembele and Sandro in the centre, Bale and Lennon on the wings, and just go for it. What have we got to lose? we never win at old trafford anyway.

 

[uksb]

It's interesting that now the shine has come off Walker being a young english player - his ratings have gone right down. He isn't really performing any worse than last season.

 

[Raziel]

It's interesting that now the shine has come off Walker being a young english player - his ratings have gone right down. He isn't really performing any worse than last season.

FBs in general get brick, either they are rubbish going forward, or they don't defend well enough, I'd be really interested who as a FB in the PL is really rated high by GG users

Walker is very quick, strong, young and can be a handful going forward. He still needs to work on his decision making, which while very important, can be worked on. Speed/strength cannot be trained

 

[Libero]

It's interesting that now the shine has come off Walker being a young english player - his ratings have gone right down. He isn't really performing any worse than last season.

I have always thought he is quite suspect at times defensively, to me that is totally not in question. He relies on his pace to get him out of trouble quite often because he is switched off. He does though have all the potential in the world to be very good at his job and that is probably why alot of people got over excited with him and will just as quickly be ott in their damning of him.

 

[Libero]

FBs in general get brick, either they are rubbish going forward, or they don't defend well enough, I'd be really interested who as a FB in the PL is really rated high by GG users

Walker is very quick, strong, young and can be a handful going forward. He still needs to work on his decision making, which while very important, can be worked on. Speed/strength cannot be trained

I agree with part of your observations but in bold I think completely the opposite. Speed and Strength can both be trained if you want to spend long enough on regimes. Decision making only improves with experience which is why he will get better. Naturally he is very quick and strong, he just needs to maintain that and top it up as he goes. His decision making will improve by learning from errors and gaining experience. He either learns from it or he doesnt and how well he learns from experience and applies it will dictate just how good he can be.

To your first part, I agree. I think people have warped opinions at times of what a FB should actually be doing. The concept of being a full back has changed dramatically over the last 15-20 years but the main job is the same - defend. If you do that part well then no one really can have a go. It is nice and advantageous to be a quick player who can support the wide midfielder but as you get older and your pace diminishes you need to be able to read the game and defend in a different way.

In terms of FB I like and think are very good in the Prem: Ashley Cole - Forget the person, as a defender, very very good in most aspects of the game. Bacary Sagna is another really solid full back but one who can support as well as defend. Others I quite rate are Micah Richards, Neil Taylor, Gael Clichy and Patrice Evra.

 

[NaijaSpurs]

It's not your point exactly. Lennon picking up the ball and going past three or four players is the exact opposite of your point. No, it didn't really 'hurt' the opposition, but they only thing that would actually hurt the opposition is scoring a goal.


Lennon was one of our best players yesterday, if you seriously don't think he's played well enough so far this season, i'd hate to hear what you think about the rest of the team, excluding Freidel, who has been our only other consistent performer thus far.

Indeed, I am shocked that some people think he has had a poor season. But then should I really considering many people think Defoe should not be starting even though he has scored 4 goals this season

 

[The Moonlit Knight]

It's interesting that now the shine has come off Walker being a young english player - his ratings have gone right down. He isn't really performing any worse than last season.

I was highly critical of him last season too. Makes way too many individual mistakes, isn't that young and I believe will continue to make those sort of mistakes through the rest of his career. He is very athletic and this glosses over a lot of his faults. Glen Johnson (very poorly rated on this forum, and I am not a fan of his either) is better than Walker for example and I doubt Walker will EVER be as good as Johnson is.

 

[DHSF]

I was highly critical of him last season too. Makes way too many individual mistakes, isn't that young and I believe will continue to make those sort of mistakes through the rest of his career. He is very athletic and this glosses over a lot of his faults. Glen Johnson (very poorly rated on this forum, and I am not a fan of his either) is better than Walker for example and I doubt Walker will EVER be as good as Johnson is.

I dont rate Johnson but yeah better than Walker (as it stands now). Compare and contrast the two and most will have to (bias avoided) come to the conclusion that Johnson is better. Walker could be like him which, if you guys dont rate Johnson, means you wouldnt rate Walker.

 

[JoeMo]

It's interesting that now the shine has come off Walker being a young english player - his ratings have gone right down. He isn't really performing any worse than last season.

I don't think this is true. Spurs fans have been amongst the most critical of Walker, with him getting a lot of stick for being suspect defensively, in spite of the adoration from an England perspective. He got caught out a lot last season but as Raziel said, his pace gets him out of trouble an awful lot.

Having said that, I thought yesterday's performance was one of his worst. Passing was poor, didn't offer much going forward and he got caught out of position A LOT. Still think there's the makings of a great player in him though.

 

[uksb]

I don't think this is true. Spurs fans have been amongst the most critical of Walker, with him getting a lot of stick for being suspect defensively, in spite of the adoration from an England perspective. He got caught out a lot last season but as Raziel said, his pace gets him out of trouble an awful lot.

Having said that, I thought yesterday's performance was one of his worst. Passing was poor, didn't offer much going forward and he got caught out of position A LOT. Still think there's the makings of a great player in him though.

For me people are being more critical of him this season than last. I hope some fans will start appreciating how good Corluka was defensively.

 

[ArcspacE]

For me people are being more critical of him this season than last. I hope some fans will start appreciating how good Corluka was defensively.

Corluka was a liability. Imagine if Dawson can't get a game - he most likely wouldn't even make the extended matchday squad.

Walker has been largerly indifferent this season along with most of our players - very few stands out so far bar Vertonghen, Defoe and Lennon to a degree. We are far from flying, mind you.

Tell me - how many goals has Walker cost us this season?

 

[Baleforce]

i think walker has been fine, we have some problems but right back ain't one of them

the first goal at Saudi Sportswashing Machine was his fault though, poor defensive header straight to ba in the box

 

[uksb]

Corluka was a liability. Imagine if Dawson can't get a game - he most likely wouldn't even make the extended matchday squad.

Walker has been largerly indifferent this season along with most of our players - very few stands out so far bar Vertonghen, Defoe and Lennon to a degree. We are far from flying, mind you.

Tell me - how many goals has Walker cost us this season?

Corluka was never a liability. Opposing players very rarely got the better of him 1v1 (despite his supposed lack of pace) and his positioning was excellent.

Walker has been involved in several goals conceded this season already. http://windycoys.blogspot.co.uk/

 

[scotty220]

I think the reason Lennon didn't get forward as often as liked was because he was covering for Walker so much. At one point Lennon actually had a go at Walker because he just disappeared and Lennon had to play LB.