Gazzasrightboot
Pascal Chimbonda
I completely agree with you that we should not be looking down our noses at other clubs. We are just another member of the EPL and we have to earn every victory. There are no easy victories in the EPL.
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Saido Berahino
- Thread starter Superhudd
- Start date
I completely agree with you that we should not be looking down our noses at other clubs. We are just another member of the EPL and we have to earn every victory. There are no easy victories in the EPL.
alekaras
The ITK of IDK
Not only that, but what would be the equivalent of "college" when it comes to european football? The NFL and NBA drafts are based on the fact that players enter those leagues from the college game. There is no such equivalent in football. You could conceivably impose a salary cap but with disparity in salaries across different countries, what do you set it at? One thing that could be examined is how teams acquire players, which is through trades, rather than buying them. So the losing team would get something in return, but then you'd again be limited to a few countries. Say Everton want to trade for Yarmolenko. Who would they send to play in Ukraine? It's a non-starter any way you look at it.
Gazzasrightboot
Pascal Chimbonda
I agree. The principle of a wage cap though say each EPL team can only spend a maximum of £Xm in wages each year would go a long way to even up the competition though. To have a wage cap as a percentage of turnover or whatever will mean that the richest teams will always have the best players.
Would you be insulted by the suggestion that Arsenal are a level above us? I wouldn't. It's simply the truth.
And yet we've been far closer to them over the past decade than the likes of Stoke or Southampton have been to us. Same is true of Everton but for two or three seasons.
The point is that we have earned the right to consider ourselves a level above those other clubs by virtue of our consistent 4th-6th place finishes for all but a couple of the past ten seasons. We have also appeared in a number of finals in that time, winning one of them. And a number of semi finals too. That's more than any of those other clubs. Lastly, we have done all of the aforementioned while also competing regularly in Europe - a burden that they haven't had to carry.
That's not to say that we should make any assumptions or be complacent in the slightest. Nor is it to say that the current pecking order will exist indefinitely. But right now, it is perfectly reasonable and accurate to claim that those other clubs are not at our level - certainly in terms of being able to attract players.
Bedfordspurs
Arthur Rowe
I agree with your logic but invariably the fans of those clubs and possibly the boards don't see it that way
It's why I think we struggle to buy players from clubs that are premier league established but invariably pretty non competitive. They don't see us a step up as they see us as their next target
United for example have been toss really for a couple of years and I'm guessing haven't won as many points as we have in that time (6 point gap last season less the gap the year before) but it's still United and there suddenly going off the title again despite looking very disjointed IMO... But it's still United and that's where the clubs best players should aim ti be in their view
And what makes you so confident that levy could get those deals over the line?
Kandi1977
Terry Dyson
Because it's less than half of what the Berahino deal would cost, and that must mean it's good value.
Agreed. But that's not the point that was actually under discussion!
The claim was that going for players like Austin would take us towards the Everton / Stoke / Southampton level, if it became the norm for us. The counter claim was that that was insulting to those clubs because we have no right to consider ourselves to be a level above them.
I was merely pointing out that we do, currently have that right by virtue of our consistently superior record over the past ten years.
Nigeyman
Chris Armstrong
No not insulted by the suggestion of the goons.
You make very good points.
consider my neck fully wound in!
alekaras
The ITK of IDK
But then the top level EPL teams would cry foul, because that would hamper them from competing in the European cups, if all the other major leagues didn't have the same exact cap.
From what I have seen of the guy I rate him, but he is still a development signing, he isn't the finished article, and that's why stretching this transfer out so long only makes sense if he is not our primary target, and we a 're looking for someone else that is more in the lines of VDV was when we signed him.
If he is the primary target then our negotiating tactics stinks of the game theory that the Greek government played. Wba don't have to sell and if we don't meet their valuation then they can and for their own good keep him. If he has a blinder untill Xmas they get the money they want despite only having 18 months left, If he plays good to average then they keep him and his goals keep them up and ready for the big money deal next year. Even if he is used as a bit part player and scores 6 goals all season that is likely to lead to at least 6 additional points which could be the difference between staying up and all the riches that entails or going down. They can still sell him for 10 mill. Which is only 8 mill down on what we have offered so far, I think over a season he would be worth more to them then 8 million.
If he is the primary target then our negotiating tactics stinks of the game theory that the Greek government played. Wba don't have to sell and if we don't meet their valuation then they can and for their own good keep him. If he has a blinder untill Xmas they get the money they want despite only having 18 months left, If he plays good to average then they keep him and his goals keep them up and ready for the big money deal next year. Even if he is used as a bit part player and scores 6 goals all season that is likely to lead to at least 6 additional points which could be the difference between staying up and all the riches that entails or going down. They can still sell him for 10 mill. Which is only 8 mill down on what we have offered so far, I think over a season he would be worth more to them then 8 million.
Ha!
That's not fair. I don't know what to do now. People on the internet aren't supposed to concede an inch. This is some kind of Zen master tactic.
GrimsbyYid
Gus Poyet
fudge me, the amount of people that bitch and moan about every little thing that hasn't even happened yet and the petulant way of expressing their feelings... Irritating. I moan a lot too, but at least I moan about actual things on the pitch after seeing it....
Anyways, let's hope this is done in the next day or two so he can have some action on Saturday. Not that poch likes doing that of course, but maybe even he will see the sense of using berahino
Anyways, let's hope this is done in the next day or two so he can have some action on Saturday. Not that poch likes doing that of course, but maybe even he will see the sense of using berahino
Nigeyman
Chris Armstrong
No worries,
I am at present, struggling to remain positive and optimistic about our fortunes, this I took out incorrectly on Adam B so apologies to him there.
You made your points really well and emphasised we shouldn't be arrogant, I really liked this...I am forced to concede that I was wrong. Not a zen tactic...just an appreciation that you forced me to think about what I was saying...the conclusion was I think I was wrong and you right.
Doesn't matter if its the internet or any other walk of life, sometimes the greatest/hardest thing someone can do in life is to admit they were wrong about something....your post had that desired effect....it was very good.
Anyway lets hope we get some signings done and as Grimsby suggests I will try hard not to be miserable
NickTB
Alan Hutton
No worries,
I am at present, struggling to remain positive and optimistic about our fortunes, this I took out incorrectly on Adam B so apologies to him there.
You made your points really well and emphasised we shouldn't be arrogant, I really liked this...I am forced to concede that I was wrong. Not a zen tactic...just an appreciation that you forced me to think about what I was saying...the conclusion was I think I was wrong and you right.
Doesn't matter if its the internet or any other walk of life, sometimes the greatest/hardest thing someone can do in life is to admit they were wrong about something....your post had that desired effect....it was very good.
Anyway lets hope we get some signings done and as Grimsby suggests I will try hard not to be miserable
Get a room you two
Nigeyman
Chris Armstrong
Get a room you two
no worries, have you got one of those door signs that says....
'do not disturb for 48 hrs' ??
Nigeyman
Chris Armstrong
Robspur12
John Lacy
Great post. I think we could certainly debate your last point. With the money splashing around now, our current status as a top 5 team is certainly under threat. Players move around for many reasons but the main one is money. Players we would previously have considered to come to us are going to the likes of Stoke, poocastle and other "lesser" teams. While we continue to channel are money into infrastructure projects like the stadium( rightly or wrongly) and training facilities and do not invest in players as the others teams around us are there is a risk that we will put the generally up ward trajectory we have been on under Enic at risk. I understand that it is a very difficult choice and I respect levy greatly and I am not saying that we shouldn't build the stadium. I just think we need to be aware of the risks with this current financial strategy.