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Ratings v West Ham
- Thread starter Mulletperm
- Start date
Yiddo
Cecil Poynton
Not his best game but he was not our worst player like people seem to think.
He did well at certain points, but also allowed himself to be bullied a little bit, I can see that as just lack of competitive match time, we forget how much he's been out.
Let him rest during week, and he'll be much better in a couple of games.
I certainly hope we don't sell our captain. I think Daws would have started the game yesterday but for his pre-season injury. I expect him to start in one and possibly both of our next two games. He was our best CB last season, and indeed has been over the past two seasons, despite being foolishly written off by many, including AVB, who then had to do an embarrassing U-turn.
Kandi1977
Terry Dyson
Yes, they did a good job in keeping it tight, and closing down, but to deserve 8 as an offensive player, you would have to be a dominant figure in the game, and really have an impact. Eriksen didn't, and thus not deserving 8. You even said it yourself, he didn't stand out, an imo you need to do that to get 8/10.
SpurMeUp
Jimmy Cantrell
Yes its not too bad. Take out Fredericks, Fryers and Mason and you have 25 - which Poch said was his ideal squad(?). The 'home grown' three could be loaned or replaced others who are sold. Personally, I think we need to sell one CB and one CM to make for a happier more manageable squad.
If you want to talk about upgrading the squad, then we need to sell more. Buying a better Striker, winger and CM would mean we need to sell or loan 5 current players. More likely, we will sign one more player and shift 2 or 3, in which case I think we'll have done well. Especially if the signing is a world class player who you would want to start every week.
Useful to see it set out like that.
For me it shows we are a good squad with quality in a number of areas, and some decent young players, but it doesn't look a top 4 squad to me.
If we don't sign a new CB, CM and CF, for me we're going to struggle to finish higher than 6th. For me it's the Holtby, Naughton, Kane, Townsend, Chadli, Rose tier of players where we fall down. At City, Chelsea, Liverpool, **** and United i don't think many if any of these players would be anything over and above fringe players. For us, they are knocking on the starting eleven.
Really? Chelsea, City and Arsenal I'll give you. Liverpool and United? Did you see United's line-up versus Swansea? Also, Liverpool aren't as bad as United, but they're only one or two injuries away from Joe Allen in midfield etc.
And we're two injuries away from Mason in midfield. As i said, i don't think MANY of the players i listed would be more than fringe players at those clubs. I agree United and to a lesser extent Liverpool are the weaker squads of the five clubs mentioned, but which of those players (Naugton, Kane, Townsend, Chadli, Holtby and Rose) do you think would be pushing to start at Liverpool or United?
milo
Jack L. Jones
We've got five full internationals and a hand full of other players before we get to Mason.
which is why i didn't include him in my list of players. you get my point though? we have a raft of players (the one's i listed) who we will rely upon pretty heavily but who would be unlikely to feature much at our so-called rival clubs. As i said, can't see Naugton, Kane, Rose, Holtby etc being high up the squad lists on the desks of Wenger, Rodgers, Mourinho or Pelligrini!
It's not a criticism of the individuals concerned. We are where we are and our league position last season reflected that. I suspect given the limited signings we've made so far this summer that our league position won't change materially this term. that's the point i am making.
Liverpool/Man Utd/Spurs central midfield depth comparison:
Sandro/Capoue/Paulinho/Dembele/Holtby
Herrera/Carrick/Fellaini/Fletcher/Cleverley
Gerrard/Henderson/Lucas/Can/Allen
Honestly don't see the issue! I think Kane incidently can be equally as good as Lambert or Wellbeck (ok, more a Lambert than a Wellbeck in style, but in terms of ability he can definately be as good)
I just wish people would stop being so down on our kids. Kane is a quality player, he played great when he came on and looks so intelligent when he's playing and yet everyone just wants to beat him and say he's not good enough.
Rorschach
Sonny Walters
Bentaleb also.
As regards United, i think you have a point, but whether we like it or not, that central midfield group of Liverpool players had a far, far more successful season that we did last year - they've added Can, who looks decent, and we haven't changed. And can i take it from the fact you didn't set out the ****, Chelsea, City players we agree their respective midfields are stronger than ours?
At the end of the day, i wasn't really talking about CM specifically, it was about our second string being inferior to that at the top 4/5 clubs.
And i'm not down on Kane particularly - i agree he's a decent young player - but the point is that when we brought him on at West Ham on Saturday, it showed the lack of depth. If we want to be challenging for the top 4 he's the sort of player we should be using in less important cup games and when we're down to the bare bones, not as (effectively) our second choice frontman.
Yeah, our squad is excellent. And the fact that players like Holtby would be really struggling to even get on the bench with everyone fit shows the depth we have particularly in CM areas. the problem with our squad is the lack of quality coaching.
People now count Henderson and Lucas as quality players, but prior to Rodgers they were a laughing stock. If Pochettino is half the coach people thing he is then we should see a similar level of improvement in our players who have big reputations but maybe haven't shown it, such as Paulinho and Dembele.
Henderson was excellent the season before he joined Liverpool (presumably why they spent c.£20m on him) - he then had a poor season (along with the rest of the team) following which he picked up again last season. Not solely down to Rodgers as he played well at Sunderland, hence his move the Merseyside in the first place. Re Lucas, most Liverpool fans would tell you that he was one of their most important players after his first 'is he definitely Brazilian' season.
That's funny as one of the players you called out is Rose who also had an excellent season at Sunderland,being named their player of the year followed by according to some a poor season last year along with pretty much everyone else. Now under Poch early signs are good.
To be honest your whole argument is flawed, and if you're basing how good teams are on who could get in who's side then you dont really comprehend what a successful side is all about.....
clevelandspur
Pascal Chimbonda
Lloris 8 very good as usual
Naughton N/a hard not to give a pen but the red was not valid IMO loris was behind him on the line and clearly not intentional
Kaboul 6.5 not his best but still holding them at bay with 10 men
Dier 9 MOTM superb finish and playing different positions all match hardly put a foot wrong
Rose 7 again playing a man down covered a ton of ground
Bentaleb 7.5 best of our midfielders
Capoue 6.5 worked hard again having to shift his role after the red
Eriksen 6 not his best day tried but nothing came off
Lamela 6 same as Eriksen tried hard but nothing really of note came off
Lennon 4 did he touch the ball? So much for looking revitalized under poch useless as has become the norm with him sadly
Adebayor 5 isolated for most of match so don't want to be too harsh but he was pretty anonymous
Holtby, Townsend Kane all 7's all of them contributed in positive ways in second half totally swung the game special mention to Townsend who looked very dangerous unlucky not to score
Naughton N/a hard not to give a pen but the red was not valid IMO loris was behind him on the line and clearly not intentional
Kaboul 6.5 not his best but still holding them at bay with 10 men
Dier 9 MOTM superb finish and playing different positions all match hardly put a foot wrong
Rose 7 again playing a man down covered a ton of ground
Bentaleb 7.5 best of our midfielders
Capoue 6.5 worked hard again having to shift his role after the red
Eriksen 6 not his best day tried but nothing came off
Lamela 6 same as Eriksen tried hard but nothing really of note came off
Lennon 4 did he touch the ball? So much for looking revitalized under poch useless as has become the norm with him sadly
Adebayor 5 isolated for most of match so don't want to be too harsh but he was pretty anonymous
Holtby, Townsend Kane all 7's all of them contributed in positive ways in second half totally swung the game special mention to Townsend who looked very dangerous unlucky not to score
yeah but Paulinho had an excellent season before he joined, as did Lamela, as did Eriksen, Chadli, Holtby, Capoue, that's why we signed all these players! Means nothing.
