Official - Defoe

[totman]

Hows the view from that bandwagon?

If you look carefully, you might be able to spot a barber thread, and be able to blame Defoe for inspiring poor tonsorial choices amongst the spurs side

heaven forbid that we would look at Bale's barnet and comment.


Does it actually occur to you that if we had a striker who possessed all of the skill, anticipation and predatory capabilities that you are attempting to beat Defoe to death for failing to possess, he might just be playing for Emirates Marketing Project/Anzi Machakala/PSG or Chelsea by now? Torres went for 50 million and would probably have killed spectators queueing for the toilets with that cross, and Carroll would probably have been ironing the corner flag.

He isn't Eto'o and he isn't Villa, but he is Defoe, he is ours and he is our top scorer - can't you just celebrate him for who he is, and try to get behind him and his committed contributions, rather than analysing his stool samples and criticising him for the way he conducts his life?

Brilliant

 

[totman]

You're ignoring the fact that Lescott starts off marking Defoe. It is only Bale's run that drags him out of position to give Defoe space. If he tries to play inside, there is nothing to guarantee that the pass won't be intercepted... But once he has done Lescott in a foot race, there is no chance of interception.

So Lescott starts off by marking Defoe, but you still think Defoe should have made his run to the far post earlier? Why would he make that run before Bale had dragged Lescott wide?

You say that Defoe knows Bale is alot quicker than he, but you dont accept that he couldnt catch up.....even though you just state that he had no reason to make his run any earlier (as he was marked).

I'll ask those two simple (un answered) questions again:
Did Bale find Defoe with the pass?
Did Bale have more than enough time to find Defoe with the pass?

 

[WookieD]

So Lescott starts off by marking Defoe, but you still think Defoe should have made his run to the far post earlier? Why would he make that run before Bale had dragged Lescott wide?

You say that Defoe knows Bale is alot quicker than he, but you dont accept that he couldnt catch up.....even though you just state that he had no reason to make his run any earlier (as he was marked).

I'll ask those two simple (un answered) questions again:
Did Bale find Defoe with the pass?
Did Bale have more than enough time to find Defoe with the pass?

Mate, you're not even making any sense. Just go and watch it on Yahoo highlights. Of course Defoe should start his run with Bale. Bale has the ball, which means that Lescott has to track him. As soon as Lescott is pulled out of position and Bale is running, so should Defoe be.

To answer your simple sounding question, Bale did not have time for a nailed on, un-intercepted pass, there was always doubt. Aside from that, the second Bale starts his run, anyone that has played football can pretty much say how the move is going to end up. Defoe was slow to react, as simple as that.

 

[ArcspacE]

Wookie, I think it was a combination of being slow to react/understand what is about to occur and of course being slightly slower than Bale (eventhough he was running without the ball)

 

[totman]

Here is the ultimate angle: http://www.101greatgoals.com/gvideos/video-of-the-jermain-defoe-miss-v-manchester-city/

Defoe is not marked at all. Bale does not drag Lescott away. Defoe makes a run, stays onside, but as the commentator points out, Bale overhits the pass.

 

[mick cooper]

Mate, you're not even making any sense. Just go and watch it on Yahoo highlights. Of course Defoe should start his run with Bale. Bale has the ball, which means that Lescott has to track him. As soon as Lescott is pulled out of position and Bale is running, so should Defoe be.

To answer your simple sounding question, Bale did not have time for a nailed on, un-intercepted pass, there was always doubt. Aside from that, the second Bale starts his run, anyone that has played football can pretty much say how the move is going to end up. Defoe was slow to react, as simple as that.

thats right, because playing football at high speed and doing everything with pinpoint precision and laser like accuracy is something that we can all do, all of the time

 

[totman]

To answer your simple sounding question, Bale did not have time for a nailed on, un-intercepted pass, there was always doubt. Aside from that, the second Bale starts his run, anyone that has played football can pretty much say how the move is going to end up. Defoe was slow to react, as simple as that.

Bale could have found him by coming inside Lescott early doors, or, having gone passed him, played a lighter pass. Look at the clip I posted.

Defoe makes the exact run you are lambasting him for not making. No pause, no hesitation. He is just slower, as we all know. The pass eluded his full stretch lunge.....a lunge he wouldnt have had to make, if Bale picked him out. Bale ran with that ball at his feet for 5 seconds, and the entire time, Defoe was unmarked in the middle.

The pass never came to his feet, or for him to run onto.

 

[WookieD]

thats right, because playing football at high speed and doing everything with pinpoint precision and laser like accuracy is something that we can all do, all of the time

No Mick, I'm saying that our strikers constantly fail to get on the end of Bale's low crosses. As Defoe did this time. Totman seems to think that Bale passing inside, with pinpoint precision and laser like accuracy, would have guarenteed us a goal. I'm pointing out that, to Bale, the obvious option is run at the defender and draw him out. If you cannot see that Lescott is starting off between the two players and is drawn out to Bale, then what is there to say?

Then, some of you are thinking that Bale merely needs to tap the ball across to Bale. Assuming he has his head up and looking at Defoe at full sprint, when he gets onto the ball, Lescott is almost on him. Bale then needs to come across himself and get a pintpoint, laser accurate pass in front of Defoe's feet. Too far forward, Lescott intercepts, too far back it gets under his feet, Defoe checks his run and is jumped on by two tracking defenders.

Running at Lescott is by far the easier option and is what Bale thrives on, what do you think he is going to do? So, Defoe, having played with Bale for two years, and having missed (like all our strikers do) so many golden opportunities that Bale has "over hit", I would like one of our strikers to recognise the option that Bale takes time and again, and we miss, time and again.

And that, to sum up, is why I think that this particular incident, is Defoe's fault and not Bale's. No fanboy shenanigans, every player makes mistakes, this one was Defoe's.

 

[WookieD]

Bale could have found him by coming inside Lescott early doors, or, having gone passed him, played a lighter pass. Look at the clip I posted.

Defoe makes the exact run you are lambasting him for not making. No pause, no hesitation. He is just slower, as we all know. The pass eluded his full stretch lunge.....a lunge he wouldnt have had to make, if Bale picked him out. Bale ran with that ball at his feet for 5 seconds, and the entire time, Defoe was unmarked in the middle.

The pass never came to his feet, or for him to run onto.

What you are igonoring is that Bale doesn't actually make contact with the ball until Lescott has closed most of the angle. At full sprint, it is far easier to go past Lescott that gamble on the pass. How is he meant to make the early pass when his foot hasn't even touched the ball yet?

 

[Sandman]

The Angle of the pass Bale receives sends him in a direction where he has to sprint past Lescott. If he had turned to try to get a pass inside he would have had to have beaten Lescott and hoped that the Defenders Trailing Defoe had not caught him up or his actions caused defoe to go offside as he was running at full speed.

Bale chooses the right option, continues the run, beats Lescott for enough pace and slides in a pass that is well weighted. For me it looks like Defoe does not anticipate the speed of the ball on the slick surface, he has time to get to it but as you watch his run it looks like he has some speed in reserve but gets caught out and has to lunge at the last second and is not close enough.

But thats football, not everything is perfect. If Defoe had pushed on a bit too far he could have been offiside, which he often is so to be fair to him he held his run. and was inches away from making it perfect. He just got undone by the pace of the pitch in my mind.

 

[totman]

What you are igonoring is that Bale doesn't actually make contact with the ball until Lescott has closed most of the angle. At full sprint, it is far easier to go past Lescott that gamble on the pass. How is he meant to make the early pass when his foot hasn't even touched the ball yet?

He has the ball at his feet for 4 seconds. I checked again. Im not ignoring anything. You are quick to excuse Bale, but what is your take on Defoe's run after seeing it from that angle?

You've accused him of hesitating, not anticipating, not making the right run at the right time etc....Do you take that back?
You also said that Bale dragged Lescott wide. Untrue. Lescott bolted towards him with zero encouragement, and Defoe was unmarked inside, with three defender 5yards behind the whole time.

 

[totman]

Totman seems to think that Bale passing inside, with pinpoint precision and laser like accuracy, would have guarenteed us a goal. I'm pointing out that, to Bale, the obvious option is run at the defender and draw him out. If you cannot see that Lescott is starting off between the two players and is drawn out to Bale, then what is there to say?

Why the silly ridicule?

Laser passing? No, I just think Bale had the opportuntiy to check Lescott, and cut a pass inside...he has the skill set. There is a space where Lescott is about two meters from both Bale and Defoe, and it was a possible opening.

Failing that, he did the right thing by going past him...he still overhit the pass though.

I also never said it would guarantee a goal, just that Defoe would have had a better chance with the ball at his feet in a one on one. Dont you think so?

 

[totman]

And all this "everyone knows what Bale is going to do" argument. Ever thought that Lescott also knew what Bale was going to do, so was able to make it harder. Maybe being a little less predictable, and cutting inside would have left Lescott on his arse sliding towards the corner flag.

Then he would have had the option to go alone too.

Either way, not Defoes fault.

I dont even hold it against Bale. Its just football, but the abuse of Defoe is pathetic, thats why Im not letting it go.

 

[WookieD]

GHod alive, Lescott bolted towards him becuase he is carrying the ball and Bale runs with it. Yes, he the ball at his feet for some time. He's a good player, but to the best of my knowledge he cannot cause physical objects to pass through one another. Literally his first touch of the ball is the only point at which there is any angle to pass to Defoe and you think that he should take that option? "Wasteful" would be the word on every pundits lips if it doesn't arrive inch perfect in Defoe's feet.

So, no, there wasn't really an early pass on, unles Bale has Go-Gadget legs, can cause the ball to travel through Lescott or he wants to gamble on coming across his body at full sprint and laying an inch perfect ball to Defoe.

As for the timing of the run, Bale could maybe have found a touch more angle. But more than a couple of degrees, and Lescott has a foot on it. He is hitting it hard to ensure that neither Lescott or Hart can intercept. Defoe is never at full sprint until the very end, he could have kept up with play but decided on being in a more verstile position. Which is probably fine for most scenarios not involving a delivery coming from the most direct winger in the country.

 

[WookieD]

And all this "everyone knows what Bale is going to do" argument. Ever thought that Lescott also knew what Bale was going to do, so was able to make it harder. Maybe being a little less predictable, and cutting inside would have left Lescott on his arse sliding towards the corner flag.

Then he would have had the option to go alone too.

Either way, not Defoes fault.

I dont even hold it against Bale. Its just football, but the abuse of Defoe is pathetic, thats why Im not letting it go.

The ABUSE! What abuse, until you harped up, all I'd said was this was Defoe's fault, which it was imo. He and all of our strikers have consistently squandered exactly this scoring opportunity countless times. You could have put any other striker in there and if the result was the same, I'd be saying the same. It was the "striker's" fault for being slow to react. Little Jermaine's legs go all a fuzz when Bale plays the ball... becuase he is behind play.

 

[mick cooper]

I'm not sure why we can't all agree that both players could have done things better to have made the goal happen and that either of them could have individually performed better
if they were both infallible supermen.

But they're not, they're flawed but gifted footballers, who on that occasion, didn't hit the back of the net.

Lets move on, particularly as I'm guessing that an amicable agreement is unlikely to be reached.

Go out and kick a gooner, it'll make you both feel better

 

[WookieD]

Why the silly ridicule?

Laser passing? No, I just think Bale had the opportuntiy to check Lescott, and cut a pass inside...he has the skill set. There is a space where Lescott is about two meters from both Bale and Defoe, and it was a possible opening.

Failing that, he did the right thing by going past him...he still overhit the pass though.

I also never said it would guarantee a goal, just that Defoe would have had a better chance with the ball at his feet in a one on one. Dont you think so?

Not ridicule, I'm just using Mick's words as he has a tendancy towards the sarcastic, not aimed at you.

 

[mick cooper]

And all this "everyone knows what Bale is going to do" argument. Ever thought that Lescott also knew what Bale was going to do, so was able to make it harder. Maybe being a little less predictable, and cutting inside would have left Lescott on his arse sliding towards the corner flag.

Then he would have had the option to go alone too.

Either way, not Defoes fault.

I dont even hold it against Bale. Its just football, but the abuse of Defoe is pathetic, thats why Im not letting it go.

I believe a THIS is in order

 

[mick cooper]

Not ridicule, I'm just using Mick's words as he has a tendancy towards the sarcastic, not aimed at you.

Oooh, I do NOT!

catty bitch....

 

[WookieD]

I'm not sure why we can't all agree that both players could have done things better to have made the goal happen and that either of them could have individually performed better
if they were both infallible supermen.

But they're not, they're flawed but gifted footballers, who on that occasion, didn't hit the back of the net.

Lets move on, particularly as I'm guessing that an amicable agreement is unlikely to be reached.

Go out and kick a gooner, it'll make you both feel better

Hey, steady on pal! I'm amicable, just not in agreement

Defoe could have performed better! Next time Bale sky's one over the cross bar with Defoe stood in space pointing at his feet, my vitriol will know no bounds in Pob's direction, you mark my words, Mick.