iPhone 5 - to be announced today

[COYS]

This I agree with. There are some features coming through that I really want to see on an iPhone. For one thing, I love the Samsung Galaxy Beam projecter. What a brilliant idea. I would actually use this all the time, being able to walk into a room and stick a presentation onto the wall without so much as a cable would be excellent. I also like the idea of a projected keyboard, that will be pretty neat.

The iPhone lacking NFC was a massive let down. No doubt it would have got NFC off the ground much more for all phones.

 

[WookieD]

The iPhone lacking NFC was a massive let down. No doubt it would have got NFC off the ground much more for all phones.

Again, not really something that interests me a whole lot unless it could be used as an Oyster for the underground. The idea of some little chav not only nicking my phone but then running around half a dozen offies and supermarkets to buy fags and booze with it before I get it switched off doesn't thrill me though.

 

[Baleforce]

i think passbook will cover that requirement

although if NFC was off the ground they might implement it, I don't think its up to the cell phone makers to advance another companies technology

 

[tommysvr]

This I agree with. There are some features coming through that I really want to see on an iPhone. For one thing, I love the Samsung Galaxy Beam projecter. What a brilliant idea. I would actually use this all the time, being able to walk into a room and stick a presentation onto the wall without so much as a cable would be excellent. I also like the idea of a projected keyboard, that will be pretty neat.

That would benefit such a small amount of people. That's not how Apple works.

 

[tommysvr]

http://www.androidpolice.com/2012/09/18/ux-things-i-hate-about-android

Pretty good article. This is part of the reason iOS is more popular, especially with non-technical people like my parents.

 

[COYS]

That would benefit such a small amount of people. That's not how Apple works.

To me Passbook just looks like a poor man's NFC, which can also surely only benefit a similar audience.

TfL said we won't be getting Oyster cards in our phone until NFC improves and becomes faster. If Apple threw an NFC chip in to their iPhone 5 then there would be a lot more work in to making it workable.

The point in contactless payment is that it's quick and for small purchases only. On your credit/debit card it will SOMETIMES ask you for your PIN, and you can't spend more than £20. You can put a PIN on it as well if you're scared it will go missing.

Right now it only works on Orange quick tap in the UK as far as I know, and if you buy a Galaxy S 3 before October the 5th, you get £50 free to spend on Orange quick tap, so for some that's £50 free McDonalds, Subway and M&S.

 

[COYS]

http://www.androidpolice.com/2012/09/18/ux-things-i-hate-about-android

Pretty good article. This is part of the reason iOS is more popular, especially with non-technical people like my parents.

Half of these things aren't problems, it's just what the author doesn't like. Most of them have't affected me. The only one I can relate to is the point about the back button, as that does a different thing every time, but I've pretty much sussed out what it's gonna do and when.

 

[tommysvr]

To me Passbook just looks like a poor man's NFC, which can also surely only benefit a similar audience.

TfL said we won't be getting Oyster cards in our phone until NFC improves and becomes faster. If Apple threw an NFC chip in to their iPhone 5 then there would be a lot more work in to making it workable.

The point in contactless payment is that it's quick and for small purchases only. On your credit/debit card it will SOMETIMES ask you for your PIN, and you can't spend more than £20. You can put a PIN on it as well if you're scared it will go missing.

Right now it only works on Orange quick tap in the UK as far as I know, and if you buy a Galaxy S 3 before October the 5th, you get £50 free to spend on Orange quick tap, so for some that's £50 free McDonalds, Subway and M&S.

Passbook is nothing like NFC and I was talking about the projector beam thing.

 

[COYS]

Passbook is nothing like NFC and I was talking about the projector beam thing.

I can see where they'd be applied in similar ways. For example payments and coupons.

 

[Baleforce]

i think passbook is very much like NFC, you are in starbucks, rather than tapping on the counter with your phone you wake it up and there's a qr code on screen with your starbucks card details, hold it under the scanner job done

it also seems to me that this implementation is easier to secure

 

[COYS]

i think passbook is very much like NFC, you are in starbucks, rather than tapping on the counter with your phone you wake it up and there's a qr code on screen with your starbucks card details, hold it under the scanner job done

it also seems to me that this implementation is easier to secure

Why does everyone think NFC is so insecure? If you don't wanna use, it don;t use it. If you do wanna use it, but you always lose your phone, then put a PIN code on it. Also it gets locked the second you report it, and on all modern smartphones you can remotely lock your device so there's so little to lose. You also get the same fraud protection as you would with a credit/debit card seeing as its done by Barclaycard so if some prick does somehow spend your money you aren't liable for the losses.

Having an Orange quick tap phone is much more secure than having a contactless credit/debit card which most of us have in our wallets anyway.

NFC is better than passbook because you can actually pay for things on it.

 

[tommysvr]

i think passbook is very much like NFC, you are in starbucks, rather than tapping on the counter with your phone you wake it up and there's a qr code on screen with your starbucks card details, hold it under the scanner job done

it also seems to me that this implementation is easier to secure

You're right - nothing like it is wrong. However, I think there's a lot more to it than just swiping at Starbucks etc. In fact, I can't imagine I would ever use it to pay for something, rather use it to store my tickets and things. At least at this point in time I see that as the major benefits.

I really don't know why NFC is deemed necessary. It's not like paying with a card takes a long time. Seems more like a 'well it would be cool' kind of thing.

 

[COYS]

I really don't know why NFC is deemed necessary. It's not like paying with a card takes a long time. Seems more like a 'well it would be cool' kind of thing.

Many shops don't like card payments under £3 or £5 depending on the shop. Contactless payment gets rid of those silly card fees I think that make retailers dislike that.

 

[Baleforce]

i admit that i've never used a device that NFC is on so please correct me if i'm wrong

i assume that its a service like bluetooth or wifi that is either on or off
i assume therefore that to be useful it's on all the time
and therefore i assume you don't have to pre approve merchants or sign up to use it
i assume its linked to a credit card or bank account
i assume (from the adverts i've seen) that there is no confirmation step

if all those assumptions are correct my security concern would be that someone could squeeze past me on the tube with a dodgy reader and "take payment"

the point about fraud protection is a fair one, but that's what you do when you've already had a brickfest, and if you do lose your phone when you are out doing the shopping how long till you get in front of a computer to send the lock code, you can't call it in as someone just stole your phone, obviously there might be a kind stranger who'll lend you their phone to help, but this cannot be assumed

 

[tommysvr]

Many shops don't like card payments under £3 or £5 depending on the shop. Contactless payment gets rid of those silly card fees I think that make retailers dislike that.

A localized problem. In Toronto, it's common to use debit to pay for anything from $2 up. A guy today paid $2.30 to send a fax on his debit card.

As I say, it's just not a necessary feature at this point.

 

[COYS]

i admit that i've never used a device that NFC is on so please correct me if i'm wrong

i assume that its a service like bluetooth or wifi that is either on or off Correct.
i assume therefore that to be useful it's on all the time Mine is, though I haven't got any payment apps on mine
and therefore i assume you don't have to pre approve merchants or sign up to use it You have to set it up, but otherwise no.
i assume its linked to a credit card or bank account You top it up using your credit card
i assume (from the adverts i've seen) that there is no confirmation step Of course not, it's meant to be quick, but I think you have to go on the app first, and you can have a PIN number if you want.

if all those assumptions are correct my security concern would be that someone could squeeze past me on the tube with a dodgy reader and "take payment". Brilliant point. This has already been recognised as a potential threat to contactless credit cards and you can now even get a lead shield for it. Like I said before, if anything like that does happen (though very unlikely), you are never liable.

the point about fraud protection is a fair one, but that's what you do when you've already had a brickfest, and if you do lose your phone when you are out doing the shopping how long till you get in front of a computer to send the lock code, you can't call it in as someone just stole your phone, obviously there might be a kind stranger who'll lend you there phone to help, but this cannot be assumed

Hope I answered your questions

 

[Baleforce]

yes thanks, personally i'd still be wary of using it, dealing with any kind of card fraud is a massive pain in the arse in my experience, liable or not it's still incredibly stressful

 

[COYS]

yes thanks, personally i'd still be wary of using it, dealing with any kind of card fraud is a massive pain in the arse in my experience, liable or not it's still incredibly stressful

Yeah but NFC was created with this in mind. They wanted to get the balance between making things quick and simple and still secure.

All you need to know can be found here

 

[COYS]

The thing is most of you probably already have contactless cards in your wallet anyway which is basically the exact same as NFC, so there's more risk in having them than having a contactless payment phone.

 

[P.D.]

NFC doesnt seem that great yet. Tried to buy some food in M & S yesterday and it just didnt work with my card at all so gave up and had to pay on cash. Can see that happening a lot till things get smoother.