Frank Give him time or get rid?

[P.D.]

I think he deserves until the summer, that being said I don't see any signs that he's recognising the errors in the way we play and doing anything to change it so I feel him leaving is inevitable.

It's a tricky one because if we spend some money on players he wants and it doesn't work and he leaves then we're left with a load of expensive signings that might stall the next manager.

 

[tommysvr]

I think he should get the summer, if not longer because as much as I think he is unsuited to the club and its ambitions, his appointment makes it very clear to me that the club has no actual idea what it wants and will balls up the next appointment as well.

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

I think he deserves until the summer, that being said I don't see any signs that he's recognising the errors in the way we play and doing anything to change it so I feel him leaving is inevitable.

It's a tricky one because if we spend some money on players he wants and it doesn't work and he leaves then we're left with a load of expensive signings that might stall the next manager.

I think he should get the rest of the season...

the sad thing though is that rest of the season could easily see him be without deki, madders, solanke and Kudus.

...so he plods on with the back ups and youngsters hoping they come good but still has to hand his work in at the end of the year, so could be difficult giving him a grade.

 

[Yiddo]

I think what should happen is if the club do get rid of Thomas Frank they should do a poll on who the fans would like to see as their next manager. Make it only members and Season ticket holders that are allowed to vote to make sure there is no outside interference. That way when it inevitably fails, the club can use it as stick to beat them with. I really have no idea what the fans want at this point.

 

[Mrs Vert]

What scares me is that the club had at least 6 months to think about who’d replace Ange and they came up with TF. Went with give him till summer and I’d take 17th now if offered.

They had the same amount of time to sort out left side and didn't. Its what we do

 

[braineclipse]

I think he should get the rest of the season...

the sad thing though is that rest of the season could easily see him be without deki, madders, solanke and Kudus.

...so he plods on with the back ups and youngsters hoping they come good but still has to hand his work in at the end of the year, so could be difficult giving him a grade.

I'm at the point where if a really good manager that I think (and the club thinks) is a good fit for our club and situation was available I'd say replace Frank. I have serious enough doubts about his fit with us for that. I don't know of a manager like that that's available.

Getting rid to put a caretaker in charge or to then have a 2-3 week process to maybe get someone good I'm not in favour of unless he loses the dressing room or we're in complete free fall/disarray.

In addition to the injury problems and form problems the fixture list will soon be getting tough again. We do have Villa (FA Cup), Dortmund, Frankfurt (CL) coming up. But in the league it's West Ham then Burnley, but after that City, United, Saudi Sportswashing Machine then Arsenal.

He really needs a win or two in the next couple of league matches. Or the feeling that this is getting real ugly will only strengthen. Getting that with injuries, poor form, lack of confidence, struggling for an identity will probably be a significant challenge.

2 wins in the last 12 now in the league. If that becomes 2 wins in 15, closing in on 2 wins in 20... If the cup/CL results also aren't there we're getting to the point where getting a positive grade for the season is starting to look impossible.

It will at the very least be an almost impossible situation to come back from, great manager or not.

 

[Rafa87]

I’d give him till summer and reassess. However, if we lose to West Ham and Burnley (I’ve already decided we’ve lost to Villa) then I imagine the club would pull the trigger and tbh I’d understand it.
Whilst I think the problems here are bigger than just Frank, I do not think this club and set of players have the heart for a relegation scrap at all.

 

[Mr Gogolak]

(Graham was the exception, I could not find it in my soul to give him an ounce of support)...

What about Mourinho?

Regarding Frank, I think people are in for a disappointment if they think he'll change his ways. Managers live and die by their results and, usually, those who are appointed at a club like Spurs have been fairly successful. There's no need for them to reinvent the wheel: Frank knows that with five more wins, the football would still be ugly but few people would be asking for his head. Plus, he could argue that the board knew his philosophy when they appointed him in the first place. What's the point for him to go into uncharted territory and change the way his team plays? If he loses six games on the trot albeit while trying to play more expansive brand of football, do you think the fans will back him?

That's why all managers 'keep making the same mistakes'. It's not mistakes; it's work in progress. If they fine-tune the squad/efficiency on the pitch, they'll get the results and people will get off his back - hell, they'll even jump into the bandwagon.

So he does what he knows worked for him since he became a coach. The blame should lie at the feet of the guy who hired him in the first place, thinking he was a good fit for the club.

 

[Jurgen the German]

I’ve seen people say the fans don’t know what they want, maybe that’s true for some of them, but for the most part I believe the majority want someone who plays on the front foot and understands the philosophy and history of the club and has us challenging at the right end of the table. Poch didn’t win any trophies but we were competing for most of his tenure without playing scintillating football but that was more than enough for the majority of the fanbase. It was enough for Kane too, he only got fidgety when we stopped competing and slid down the table. You can’t guarantee trophies but I think football fans in general will be happy if you’re taking the game to the opposition and playing in a positive way.

 

[Mikey10]

I think what should happen is if the club do get rid of Thomas Frank they should do a poll on who the fans would like to see as their next manager. Make it only members and Season ticket holders that are allowed to vote to make sure there is no outside interference. That way when it inevitably fails, the club can use it as stick to beat them with. I really have no idea what the fans want at this point.

Having sat in the South stand for the Liverpool game just before Christmas, I wouldn't trust a lot of our fans to walk my dog tbh.

 

[Mikey10]

I’ve seen people say the fans don’t know what they want, maybe that’s true for some of them, but for the most part I believe the majority want someone who plays on the front foot and understands the philosophy and history of the club and has us challenging at the right end of the table.

Does a football club exist where the fans wouldn't want that?

 

[Yiddo]

Its easy to blame the coach but he is not sending them out there with the instructions on not passing the ball to team mates accurately. I’m sure it was Roy Keane who mentioned under Ferguson they rarely done any shape training and they were kind of left to make their own decisions on the pitch and didn’t have specific instructions on where to run, how to run and when to run. He said the players took it upon themselves to do the right thing. He said they may have been told to mark a player tightly and not let them turn etc or just give the ball to Giggs and Ronaldo because the full back was a target but other than that, thats all the tactical stuff they done.

 

[Mikey10]

Whilst I think the problems here are bigger than just Frank, I do not think this club and set of players have the heart for a relegation scrap at all.

Surely that sentence suggests that changing the manager won't really change anything at all?

 

[Jurgen the German]

Does a football club exist where the fans wouldn't want that?

Sorry I don’t know what you mean

 

[Jurgen the German]

Having sat in the South stand for the Liverpool game just before Christmas, I wouldn't trust a lot of our fans to walk my dog tbh.

We’ve been severely poor at home for more than a year. Understandable that the fans are fed up. Most fans were content under Poch even without trophies.

 

[Rafa87]

Surely that sentence suggests that changing the manager won't really change anything at all?

I wrote it badly most likely. Personally I don’t think Frank is the issue on his own even if he could be doing a bit better. I think the club has many deep rooted issues, but if he loses the next couple and we drop toward the bottom three I can see the club making the change to see if there’s a new manager bounce… I’m doubtful as to how much it would achieve personally, but I could see the club doing it, and I would understand it from a desperation POV.

I just have real doubts about many of this squad, and honestly I still think that the reaction of a large section of the fan base has basically made Frank’s time here short anyway. I feel sorry for the bloke personally.

I also think we do a lot of damage to our own club.

 

[Baleforce]

I wrote it badly most likely. Personally I don’t think Frank is the issue on his own even if he could be doing a bit better. I think the club has many deep rooted issues, but if he loses the next couple and we drop toward the bottom three I can see the club making the change to see if there’s a new manager bounce… I’m doubtful as to how much it would achieve personally, but I could see the club doing it, and I would understand it from a desperation POV.

I just have real doubts about many of this squad, and honestly I still think that the reaction of a large section of the fan base has basically made Frank’s time here short anyway. I feel sorry for the bloke personally.

I also think we do a lot of damage to our own club.

It feels like a large part of the fan base never reset, and that TF is in the firing line for last year too.

 

[Rafa87]

It feels like a large part of the fan base never reset, and that TF is in the firing line for last year too.

It’s always the same isn’t it, blame the manager. I’m not even saying he’s completely faultless or blameless. However we clearly have large, systemic issues running through the club in terms of direction, leadership, squad building and funding success and we just keep thinking a simple manager change will fix it all…

…I’m just realistic enough to know I think that’s what happens, and more over, keeps happening until someone hopefully addresses the rest of it. It’s a club I (we all) love, but let’s face it, it’s a difficult one to support fairly often!

 

[Raziel]

I’ve seen people say the fans don’t know what they want, maybe that’s true for some of them, but for the most part I believe the majority want someone who plays on the front foot and understands the philosophy and history of the club and has us challenging at the right end of the table. Poch didn’t win any trophies but we were competing for most of his tenure without playing scintillating football but that was more than enough for the majority of the fanbase. It was enough for Kane too, he only got fidgety when we stopped competing and slid down the table. You can’t guarantee trophies but I think football fans in general will be happy if you’re taking the game to the opposition and playing in a positive way.

Somewhat agree

- We want someone who will defend the club and be happy to have aspirations (Ange was good at it)
- We don't want someone who will make us feel they are doing us a favor (Jose/Conte)
- For me the definition of front foot is more, we should aim to own possession (not concede possession without reason), we should have structure (it should look like we are a coached team) and the system should allow one or two of our maverick type players the ability to cause chaos (Deki, Maddison, Kudus, Xavi, maybe even Bergvall and Tel in this squad come to mind)

But, and this may come across the wrong way, the club needs to understand what having season tickets is like, that commitment of time (for me 6-8 hours minimum), the costs of not just the ticket, but additional matchday costs, to do that for 2-3 weeks a month, to watch your team play brick and get rolled over more often that a decent performance is unacceptable, it creates the apathy or toxicity, it drags the club down. All of that to say, both the manager and the squad should be good enough to make our stadium somewhere we win, and somewhere the opposition don't want to come.

And I'm sure some who have known me on this board for a long time, may look at that list of criteria and laugh, say it fits one person (@thfcsteff ?)

 

[markysimmo]

Sonny & Johnson
Kulu, Madders, Solanke not played a minute this season
That is 80+ goals and assists we've lost

No wonder we've been struggling