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SpurMeUp said:
@parklane1 @billyiddo the narrative has evolved slightly. Previously (and I looked it up at HT during the game) it was 'Traore has got no footballing ability' he just fast, may as well sign Usain Bolt. Now people acknowledge talent, but to save face, use the cliche 'there's no end product'.

Which is absolutely true. He has not delivered much. But he has developed. He was and is unplayable at times - against us he was delivering good crosses - and he beats full backs with consumate ease. I never thought he was a perfect player, far from it, I thought he was a good value player who Poch would develop. Just the sort of player Pochettino could transform and he'd be a far better option than GKN. The raw ability has always been there. If someone can help him develop - and at 23 there is time - he can be a potent player. He also fit something Poch was asking for at the time - a player to "punch through" a defence. We missed out on Mane, tried for Zaha, and while Traore is more GKN than anywhere close to Mane and Zaha, he has the physical and technical potential, if that can be combined with hard work, guidance and application he might become someone. Against us the other day he was sintilating, no one could get the ball off him. That takes skill, as well as pace and power.
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I thought he was his usual self. Does nothing at all off the ball. Give him the ball and he will go on a run, probably beating a player or two but then either take the wrong option at the end of that run or hit a poorly executed shot or pass. It thought it was telling that it wasn't until he went off that Wolves actually got into the game and scored their goals.
 
Finney Is Back said:
I thought he was his usual self. Does nothing at all off the ball. Give him the ball and he will go on a run, probably beating a player or two but then either take the wrong option at the end of that run or hit a poorly executed shot or pass. It thought it was telling that it wasn't until he went off that Wolves actually got into the game and scored their goals.
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So the no end product cliche then!

He beat Davies at will and put in perfectly good crosses. Davies also blocked a cross with his hand which could have been a (harsh) pen. He won a number of fks too as Eriksen and others were forced to cut him down. Maybe you didn't see any of that?
 
SpurMeUp said:
@parklane1 @billyiddo the narrative has evolved slightly. Previously (and I looked it up at HT during the game) it was 'Traore has got no footballing ability' he just fast, may as well sign Usain Bolt. Now people acknowledge talent, but to save face, use the cliche 'there's no end product'.

Which is absolutely true. He has not delivered much. But he has developed. He was and is unplayable at times - against us he was delivering good crosses - and he beats full backs with consumate ease. I never thought he was a perfect player, far from it, I thought he was a good value player who Poch would develop. Just the sort of player Pochettino could transform and he'd be a far better option than GKN. The raw ability has always been there. If someone can help him develop - and at 23 there is time - he can be a potent player. He also fit something Poch was asking for at the time - a player to "punch through" a defence. We missed out on Mane, tried for Zaha, and while Traore is more GKN than anywhere close to Mane and Zaha, he has the physical and technical potential, if that can be combined with hard work, guidance and application he might become someone. Against us the other day he was sintilating, no one could get the ball off him. That takes skill, as well as pace and power.
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Well Stop! Hammer time mate but i really see nothing ( apart from his pace) to suggest he is anymore then a guy who can run fast. I remember him coming on against us at M/boro a few seasons back ( i think it was one of his first games), he frightened the brick out of us for about 15 mins with his pace, but then we got a grip and accepted that apart from his pace he had nothing in his game.

I saw excately the same at the game the other day, you may be right and he will go on to be a top player ( who knows) but we shall see.
 
SpurMeUp said:
So the no end product cliche then!

He beat Davies at will and put in perfectly good crosses. Davies also blocked a cross with his hand which could have been a (harsh) pen. He won a number of fks too as Eriksen and others were forced to cut him down. Maybe you didn't see any of that?
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Certainly so far in the PL he's lacking end product. Delivered in one season in the Championship, but that's it.

If he is motivated to receive the Pochettino magic he could be special. Certainly has a lot of quality, I'll agree with that. But he looks nothing like a Pochettino player to me in terms of work rate, discipline and attitude (on the pitch).
 
SpurMeUp said:
So the no end product cliche then!

He beat Davies at will and put in perfectly good crosses. Davies also blocked a cross with his hand which could have been a (harsh) pen. He won a number of fks too as Eriksen and others were forced to cut him down. Maybe you didn't see any of that?
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So he beat Davies at will but all that resulted from that was one dubious penalty shout that would've been very harsh had it been awarded? Sounds the perfect definition of lacking end product to me. I agree that he is a player that does win a lot of free kicks. I think if I was managing a team that had to face him I would tell my players to actively avoid fouling him as letting him keep the ball is likely to be far less hurtful than giving the opposition a free kick where a different player with far better delivery quality can take over.

He is lightning quick, strong and great at running with the ball, I concede that he has all of those attributes to his game. I have just never really seen him do anything decent with the ball after he has beaten those one or two players that is his forte. As an attacking midfield player that final action is the most important. Perhaps he could be converted to play further back and instructed to keep it simple like Sissoko, but I haven't seen anything from Traore to suggest that he is prepared to get involved in the defensive side of the game. So, at best, he would require a lot of coaching here.

He is a player that might be worth a punt at under £15 million or so, but I think he would exasperate us on far more occasions than he would delight us and I wonder whether he would actually get enough first team opportunities with us to improve. Maybe he is the sort of player to buy and then loan out Chelsea style? I just haven't seen anything to suggest we utilise that strategy to acquire players?
 
braineclipse said:
Certainly so far in the PL he's lacking end product. Delivered in one season in the Championship, but that's it.

If he is motivated to receive the Pochettino magic he could be special. Certainly has a lot of quality, I'll agree with that. But he looks nothing like a Pochettino player to me in terms of work rate, discipline and attitude (on the pitch).
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Caught some of his performance against pool, and obviously against us. There are signs of improvment under Santo. Taraore's much more combative. He's holding the ball up more. He's slowing down a bit to assess his options. Under this manager he's maturing. He's still missing some finess. Hazard can move the ball sideways, skip around people etc Traore just uses brute speed which works when skinnig players.

We don't need him now, and its academic. There was an oppotunity to take a raw young player who has a high celing, for not much cash when villa were relegated. Apparently Wolves shelled out 18m for him from Boro, so some must see more to him than most here.
 
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SpurMeUp said:
For anyone interested. He wasn't on all that long, went off around 60 mins with a tweeked hamstring

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Having watched that vid with a view to assessing the ‘no end product’ comment, I’ve come to a completely different conclusion...

- If he played for Spurs, and does what he did on there, then we (as a fan base) would absolutely fudging crucify him; from the stands, and in social media. We’d destroy the poor sod, wreck his confidence and turn him into a shell of a man.

Observation 2. Hairs a bit shiit.
 
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parklane1 said:
Well Stop! Hammer time mate but i really see nothing ( apart from his pace) to suggest he is anymore then a guy who can run fast. I remember him coming on against us at M/boro a few seasons back ( i think it was one of his first games), he frightened the brick out of us for about 15 mins with his pace, but then we got a grip and accepted that apart from his pace he had nothing in his game.

I saw excately the same at the game the other day, you may be right and he will go on to be a top player ( who knows) but we shall see.
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Agreed. In fact, when they took him off I was disappointed as up until then he was just a fast bloke doing nothing.
 
https://twitter.com/x/status/1080849791419105281



Who: JJ
When: Today? Last night?
Where: That place has no name, it's dead to me

“De Jong turned us down, as did Pulisic”



Tottenham boss Mauricio Pochettino has refused to rule out Belgium international midfielder Mousa Dembele, 31, leaving the Lilywhites this month. (Football.London)


As well as Dembele, Tottenham are keen to offload Fernando Llorente, 33, Vincent Janssen, 24, Georges-Kevin Nkoudou, 23, and Victor Wanyama, 27. (Mirror)
 
Ade's folks are ok really said:
How the mighty fall quick. Wasn't so long ago that a regular midfield paring of Wanyama and Dembele was the bedrock of our, ahem, "title chasing" seasons.
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It's a shame as on top form I loved watching that partnership. I wonder if they were both injury free all this time, would they still have been replaced eventually by Dier, Winks, New signings etc. or would they still be the main men.
 
dingdongo said:
It's a shame as on top form I loved watching that partnership. I wonder if they were both injury free all this time, would they still have been replaced eventually by Dier, Winks, New signings etc. or would they still be the main men.
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If they maintained their form then i imagine we'd have seen those two and Dier sharing the bulk of games out between them
 
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