Tim Sherwood…gone \o/

[BrainOfLevy]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I really not sure not playing a DM is the massive mistake people think it is. I'd be interesting in seeing how it functions once the team has clicked with it.

I mean, it did work against Southampton, a team who you'd think would press our defenders into mistakes, and would exacerbate that if they don't have the easy outlet of a holding midfielder. But it worked, maybe there's something else to it.

 

[SPURSphenomenon]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Let's at least give him a decent run before really judging him...

We're football fans, we're judgemental pr**ks by nature

 

[Lilywhite]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Yes our attack and midfield are either overrated (Holtby the main example of this) or because we overpaid for them fans think they are better than they are (Soldado comes to mind).

You say our defence is patched up but aside from Vertonghen missing, who else is?

And besides, if the defence is as bad as you say then why is Tim not providing them with any protection from the midfield?

Way I see it, he's currently attempting to justify the ludicrous decision made by Levy to bestow him the job by trying to get fans onside by throwing as many attacking players on as possible. There has been no shape or rhythm to our play though. It might get slightly better with time, but not by much.

 

[diego_maradona]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I really not sure not playing a DM is the massive mistake people think it is. I'd be interesting in seeing how it functions once the team has clicked with it.

I mean, it did work against Southampton, a team who you'd think would press our defenders into mistakes, and would exacerbate that if they don't have the easy outlet of a holding midfielder. But it worked, maybe there's something else to it.

I think it's perfectly feasible to be honest. What we need to look at though is if the team is capable of nullifying the attacking potential of the opposition through our tactics as a whole unit, and whether the players deployed are capable of performing cohesively to perform the teams defensive duties.

(That was my best AVB impression)

 

[The Portugeezer]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I think it's perfectly feasible to be honest. What we need to look at though is if the team is capable of nullifying the attacking potential of the opposition through our tactics as a whole unit, and whether the players deployed are capable of performing cohesively to perform the teams defensive duties.

(That was my best AVB impression)

 

[Superhudd]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

The fact is, you along with everybody else on here has absolutely no idea just how good a coach Sherwood is and will become. The only ones close to knowing are those that work with him or have worked with him and all seem to hold him in high regard....

IMO most people at Tottenham Hotspur Football Club haven't a clue what makes a decent coach otherwise we wouldn't have the need for a revolving door. That includes the fans also.

Its all about 80% luck, 20% ingenuity... maybe ladies and gentleman that is why Levy has gone and given Sherwood the job. That and Levy doesn't need to fork out ontop of the AVB payoff.

 

[Superhudd]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

These are different times though, you are not afforded as much time any more. Hoddle was supposed to be the one for us, appointed around the same time as Moyes.

So why put your list up in the first place then. Not sure what your getting at tbh if your not comparing chairman.

 

[veron23]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

this is the team to give the epl nightmares

ADEBAYOR SOLDADO
ROSE DEMBELE ERIKSEN PAULINHO WALKER
VERTONGHEN CHIRICHES KABOUL
LLORIS

 

[thfcsteff]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

this is the team to give the epl nightmares

ADEBAYOR SOLDADO
ROSE DEMBELE ERIKSEN PAULINHO WALKER
VERTONGHEN CHIRICHES KABOUL
LLORIS

Not a bad side but Sandro for Dembele…mate, Moussa's alright BUT I couldn't have dinner with him because he'd be dribbling all the time!

 

[Jarrell89]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

This is a great post Chancer. I am guilty of perhaps knee jerking with regards to the appointment of Tim Sherwood and his band of merry men. I think it's madness that right now, he's playing without a more defensively minded player in the side, but that's the ramblings of a "lad on an internet forum".

I think the sacking of AVB and the appointment of Sherwood has sparked a huge backlash of those from within the game attacking the likes of AVB in favour of a "proper football man". Ex-pros like Lineker and Merson are happy to see a young English coach who knows the game inside out.

Wilson picked up on this point in his gg-criticised article:



This whole notion of you have to have played the game to have a valid opinion doesn't sit right with me. It always reads as a slap in the face of people like AVB and Mourinho who are studious about the game of football, and more importantly, us, the fans.

We are obsessive about this game. We absolutely adore this club. We watch every game, judge every player, analyze every detail to death at times. I think I personally qualify as a real "football man" myself! lol.

AVB has always come across as a real student of the game, I think he was heavily influenced by the likes of Van Gaal, Arrigo Saachi, Rinus Michels and real innovators of the game in terms of tactics. Football however has many facets which need to be addressed in order to be successful. Tactics, fitness, talent, not to mention psychology of players and the mindset of a club.

Ultimately for all a persons knowledge about the game and ideals about the way you want to play football, you will always be finally judged by your results and style of football. Perhaps it was correct to get rid of AVB, personally I would have given it until the end of the season, I feel he deserved that at the least. But that's just me.

But I do feel I'm perfectly within my rights to make a call on whether I feel our side is missing a defensive minded midfielder to bring a better balance to our side or not. Sherwood may well be innovative in his thinking here. I am happy to be proven wrong on this.

To be honest, I've read a fair bit about Saachi and his footballing philosophies too, and I subscribe to the school of thought that we don't need these specialist positions within our side but instead should have players capable of every job on the field. So defensive responsibilities should be carried out by the whole team as well as attacking duties.

Great post - the idea that there is this mythical group of "football men" borders on xenophobic at times. Is Roberto Martinez not a "football man", given that he played it professionally and dedicated years to it upon his retirement? I often wish someone would challenge people such as Merson when they make such claims.
I'm not against Sherwood, I hope he does brilliantly ; I do however disapprove of the arrogance that he portrays in every interview. The "football is a simple game" speech is arrogant and hypocritical, and simply designed to unite fans/journalists in a nostalgia and snobbery. Sam allardyce is known to heavily utilise statistics but is never caricatured as a "cerebral" manager, for instance.

 

[Jordinho]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Great post - the idea that there is this mythical group of "football men" borders on xenophobic at times. Is Roberto Martinez not a "football man", given that he played it professionally and dedicated years to it upon his retirement? I often wish someone would challenge people such as Merson when they make such claims.
I'm not against Sherwood, I hope he does brilliantly ; I do however disapprove of the arrogance that he portrays in every interview. The "football is a simple game" speech is arrogant and hypocritical, and simply designed to unite fans/journalists in a nostalgia and snobbery. Sam allardyce is known to heavily utilise statistics but is never caricatured as a "cerebral" manager, for instance.

The way you talk to journalists plays a big role on how they portray you. Tell a few jokes wrapped in a lot of bull**** and they lap it up and don't ever question their ideas on football. Anything they don't understand or agree with they will try to put down.

 

[Jarrell89]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

The way you talk to journalists plays a big role on how they portray you. Tell a few jokes wrapped in a lot of bull**** and they lap it up and don't ever question their ideas on football. Anything they don't understand or agree with they will try to put down.

True. But how do you explain fan reaction to this? The debate on here recently seems to have descended to "look how clever I am believing/not believing in modern progression /fancy foreign nonsense".

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

True. But how do you explain fan reaction to this? The debate on here recently seems to have descended to "look how clever I am believing/not believing in modern progression /fancy foreign nonsense".

I would guess in the coaches' eyes, they think if they get the media on their side, enough fans will follow.

I always think AVB was let down by the fact he never clearly explained what he was trying to achieve with us, why we were playing the way we were. If he did that I reckon he would have had more fans onside. He also seemed to let a select few journalists into his 'circle' but even they never really explained it for him either. There was that interview that appeared when he first came to England but that wasn't really about his system.

AVB not only didn't do that, but also didn't give the journalists the sound bites they would lap up. In a way it's quite nice (as well as a little sickening!) that paying platitudes to the ****s in Fleet Street will see us get some nicer coverage again.

 

[Jarrell89]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I would guess in the coaches' eyes, they think if they get the media on their side, enough fans will follow.

AVB not only didn't do that, but also didn't give the journalists the sound bites they would lap up. In a way it's quite nice (as well as a little sickening!) that [/B] paying platitudes to the ****s in Fleet Street will see us get some nicer coverage again. [/B]

That's the bit that irritates me - why should we care what sort of coverage we get. Clearly we don't want to be seen as a horrible club, but I don't buy the "football is a simple game" spiel, just as I didn't buy AVB's "we have taken the highest number of shots" nonsense, and I was strongly pro- avb. Do we not base our opinions on these things on what we see on the pitch and hear/read from players and coaches themselves? Who cares what the headline says?

Sent from my ST26i using Fapatalk

 

[onlyme]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

this is the team to give the epl nightmares

ADEBAYOR SOLDADO
ROSE DEMBELE ERIKSEN PAULINHO WALKER
VERTONGHEN CHIRICHES KABOUL
LLORIS

Like Steff I would swap Sandro for Dembele but the 3-5-2 formation interests me.

However it is a system beloved by Glennda. Would Tim be willing to have even a glimmer of acknowledgement going in her direction?

 

[kinkygerbil]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I really not sure not playing a DM is the massive mistake people think it is. I'd be interesting in seeing how it functions once the team has clicked with it.

I mean, it did work against Southampton, a team who you'd think would press our defenders into mistakes, and would exacerbate that if they don't have the easy outlet of a holding midfielder. But it worked, maybe there's something else to it.

Southampton were missing half there team, three or four first team defenders, the keeper and arguably there best player Wanyama.

Whilst it was a good result I don't think we can look too much into that game.

 

[lurker of old]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Luckily for us, Stoke will be missing a few too...

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Southampton were missing half there team, three or four first team defenders, the keeper and arguably there best player Wanyama.

Whilst it was a good result I don't think we can look too much into that game.

And we only controlled the match for 20 minutes when they were throwing players forward and leaving us all kinds of space.

 

[veron23]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

442 does not work long term, especially against big teams with astute managers. I actually wanted TS at first but now im worried. WE WILL GET FOUND OUT.

a quote from a couple of not so bad managers

"Look, if I have a triangle in midfield – player x behind and two others just in front – I will always have an advantage against a pure 4-4-2 where the central midfielders are side by side. That’s because I will always have an extra man. It starts with player x, who is between the lines. If nobody comes to him he can see the whole pitch and has time. If he gets closed down it means one of the two other central midfielders is open. If they are closed down and the other team’s wingers come inside to help, it means there is space now for us on the flank, either for our own wingers or for our full-backs. There is nothing a pure 4-4-2 can do to stop things’."

"4-3-3, one-touch combination football. defence, midfield and attacking lines play much closer to each other – increased mobility, fluidity and synergy in midfield has allowed their passing game to flourish, as well as enhancing their creativity and control. But the philosophy is the same: create triangles on the pitch, engineer a numerical advantage in midfield, and create danger from that."

Personally 352 or 433 is what we need. I would love to see us play 352, it covers us in every department (unfortunatley leaves out my fav players lennon and lamela) plus will confuse everyone as no managers prepare for 352 these days.

 

[diego_maradona]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

442 does not work long term, especially against big teams with astute managers. I actually wanted TS at first but now im worried. WE WILL GET FOUND OUT.

a quote from a couple of not so bad managers

"Look, if I have a triangle in midfield – player x behind and two others just in front – I will always have an advantage against a pure 4-4-2 where the central midfielders are side by side. That’s because I will always have an extra man. It starts with player x, who is between the lines. If nobody comes to him he can see the whole pitch and has time. If he gets closed down it means one of the two other central midfielders is open. If they are closed down and the other team’s wingers come inside to help, it means there is space now for us on the flank, either for our own wingers or for our full-backs. There is nothing a pure 4-4-2 can do to stop things’."

"4-3-3, one-touch combination football. defence, midfield and attacking lines play much closer to each other – increased mobility, fluidity and synergy in midfield has allowed their passing game to flourish, as well as enhancing their creativity and control. But the philosophy is the same: create triangles on the pitch, engineer a numerical advantage in midfield, and create danger from that."

Personally 352 or 433 is what we need. I would love to see us play 352, it covers us in every department (unfortunatley leaves out my fav players lennon and lamela) plus will confuse everyone as no managers prepare for 352 these days.

Personally I think you can make any formation work with the right personnel and ensuring the players all buy into the philosophy and are 100% committed to it. If they understand hat they're role is in the overall picture then any formation can be effective.