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The Squad

diego_maradona said:
Absolutely
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Not really. Stats prove whatever point you want. For instance none of our players played europa league, league cup or early rounds FA Cup. They have been flogged to death in the 'high paced' premier league. Chelsea have had their first team exposed to loads more competitive fixtures. That means, they WILL have rotated more than us. Case in point the other day, cant remember who they were playing, but they made 8 changes for a league game sandwiched between Europe.

I think maybe you ARE missing something. Stats prove anything you want and can be totally manipulated.

You could extend it by saying where our players havent played 100% of the fixtures its been down to injury. Chelsea have rotated.
 
Badbrains said:
What concerns me is Harry saying players just need to run around more. Is that all he has to offer now?

Honestly think if Harry was a little selfless he could turn it around, but he will never accept responsibility, which I why we are going to struggle to finish 4th.
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And this is who the FA, and just about everyone else, want to be the next England manager? The FA fudged up horribly by not appointing Clough. Now it appears they are going to fudge up just as horrifically by appointing HR.

Is it any wonder that England are so brick.
 
Armchair Expert said:
Not really. Stats prove whatever point you want. For instance none of our players played europa league, league cup or early rounds FA Cup. They have been flogged to death in the 'high paced' premier league. Chelsea have had their first team exposed to loads more competitive fixtures. That means, they WILL have rotated more than us. Case in point the other day, cant remember who they were playing, but they made 8 changes for a league game sandwiched between Europe.

I think maybe you ARE missing something. Stats prove anything you want and can be totally manipulated.

You could extend it by saying where our players havent played 100% of the fixtures its been down to injury. Chelsea have rotated.
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There's no doubt that Chelsea have rotated more than us. But as you say, they've had to because they've played more competitive games than us. The fact remains that their players have played more games overall. Maybe the Premier League is faster-paced than the Champions League, but that's not enough evidence to counteract this to the point of arguing that our players must be significantly more physically exhausted than theirs.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Harry Redknapp has revealed Tottenham tried to sign Carlos Tevez in the January transfer window - but ended up with Louis Saha instead. "I said to the chairman 'can you get me Carlos Tevez?' That's what I said in January. 'Can we get Tevez?' It wasn't possible, but that was my dream," said Spurs boss Redknapp.
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Priceless!

Getting Saha was an unbelievably shocking move, especially bearing in mind all Spurs other striker transfer woes. So now the HR excuses and personal damage limitation exercise has started......
 
Jurgen the German said:
Lets just sack him now and go back to the dream team combination of Ramos and Comolli, we were doing so bloody well with them at the helm ](*,)](*,)
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Or put HR out on gardening leave and give the reigns to VdV/King, for the last 4 games, to try and salvage the disaster since February. To not qualify for the CL will be a disaster. Player power....because manager power sure ain't doing it at the moment. If the players are not playing for the manager, they sure as hell should play for themselves.
 
elltrev said:
There's no doubt that Chelsea have rotated more than us. But as you say, they've had to because they've played more competitive games than us. The fact remains that their players have played more games overall. Maybe the Premier League is faster-paced than the Champions League, but that's not enough evidence to counteract this to the point of arguing that our players must be significantly more physically exhausted than theirs.
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Again I disagree, our list includes Lennon and King; one cant play two games in a week, and the other has been injured for a large percentage of the season. Had they been availble for selection, they would have both played 40+ games also.

You just admitted in your post that Chelsea have rotated more?? The only reason all our players arent on 40 games is injury.

It's also somewhat ironic that we are having this debate in a thread about one of our players saying we dont have the depth, and Harry has just come out saying the same thing, criticising one of our own players for being too brick, whist saying we dont have enough cover. Where did all the cover go? Out on loan!
 
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First choice players getting exhausted is only on of the aspects related to squad rotation.

If our players are more tired than players at other teams and the reason isn't a lack of squad rotation, then why is it?

Could it have something to do with the fitness work being done at the club? Defoe went away this summer to work with a free lance fitness guy and according to Harry and by the looks of things on the pitch he's been in the shape of his life. Harry has worked with Defoe for many seasons now. You might think his sudden increase in fitness after working with someone outside the club would mean that our players aren't reaching peak fitness levels at Spurs.
 
Comparing stats is never going to tell the whole story, in the same way that someone saying we don't rotate enough is over simplifying things.

A club's training regime and match day performance are directly related. Maybe Chelsea have a more effective training programme? Who knows.

Spurs use the Statsports GPS system to monitor the players' heart rate recovery etc during training, so they will know how exactly how the players' respective fitness levels are looking now compared to when we were flying earlier in the season.

Of course we also know that Harry doesn't have a record of admitting when he has got things wrong.
 
Sheffield Spur said:
Or put HR out on gardening leave and give the reigns to VdV/King, for the last 4 games, to try and salvage the disaster since February. To not qualify for the CL will be a disaster. Player power....because manager power sure ain't doing it at the moment. If the players are not playing for the manager, they sure as hell should play for themselves.
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Not the worst of ideas, though I'd say vdV and Gallas.
 
elltrev said:
Here are the number of STARTS in ALL COMPETITIONS for Spurs and Chelsea, for their top 10 players (not including goalkeepers) [data from http://soccernet.espn.go.com/team/squad/_/id/363/league/all/chelsea?cc=5739]

Walker---------42-----44---Mata
Assou-Ekotto---40----43---Cole
Bale-----------38-----40---Ramires
Modric---------37-----38---Ivanovic
Kaboul---------35-----38---Terry
Parker---------34-----36----Luiz
Adebayor-------31----35----Lampard
Van der Vaart---31----33--- Sturridge
King------------23----30----Meireles
Lennon---------22----29----Torres

So, unless I'm missing something, clearly this talk of the players being physically exhausted due to playing too much is gonad*s, and we can move on from it for good.
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Chelsea have different fitness trainers to us, so this isn't a straight comparison.

My instinct is that our apparent drop in energy is largely down to fitness, which is also why we are picking up so many injuries, rather than a lack of rotation.
 
Gutter Boy said:
Not the worst of ideas, though I'd say vdV and Gallas.
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Fine. We need something. An electric shock to the collective gonad*s. A wake up call. Whatever.

To continue as we are for the rest of the season will be a disaster of biblical proportions. We look like drifting, rudderless, to the conclusion. Redknapp is clearly just treading water until 'the phonecall', that is, unless he has has already had it. Maybe special envoy Spice Boy Jamie has already been acting as an information stream between dad, and Lancaster Gate? Or is that now the even bigger ivory tower in Wembley?
 
Armchair Expert said:
Again I disagree, our list includes Lennon and King; one cant play two games in a week, and the other has been injured for a large percentage of the season. Had they been availble for selection, they would have both played 40+ games also.

You just admitted in your post that Chelsea have rotated more?? The only reason all our players arent on 40 games is injury.

It's also somewhat ironic that we are having this debate in a thread about one of our players saying we dont have the depth, and Harry has just come out saying the same thing, criticising one of our own players for being too brick, whist saying we dont have enough cover. Where did all the cover go? Out on loan!
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I think we are arguing different points. As you said, I 'admitted' that Chelsea have rotated more; I am not trying to argue that they haven't.

All I am arguing is that our top players have not played more football than (in this case) Chelsea's top players this season. So I think it is wrong to say that our recent slump in form has been partly caused by physical tiredness as a result of a lack of rotation. Because despite our lack of rotation, our top players have not played more games than Chelsea's.

In response to other posters' suggestions that our players aren't as fit, I have absolutely no idea of whether or not this is the case.

I also think the bolded bit in your post is over the top. All our cover? He was talking about centre-backs specifically; we loaned out Caulker at the beginning of the season, which I think everyone would agree was a good move. Then we loaned out Bassong, and replaced him with Nelsen on a free. Nelsen, Dawson and Kaboul are currently injured; most teams would struggle a little bit with three centre-backs injured. Look at Arsenal at the begninning of the season. Jenas was loaned out, and we haven't needed him. Bentley was loaned out (to a Championship team no less) because he is useless. Pienaar is the one player who maybe shouldn't have been loaned out, but he wasn't performing well for us.
 
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chancer said:
There is absolutely nothing wrong with what Redknapp is saying here, I've heard managers talk about this a million times. People are now going out of their way to be offended.
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What!?

Sorry mate, but read it again. He is clearly trying to sidestep the ridiculous move to take Saha, which is highly visible, and tangible, and there is a cost. Its not something that can easily be diffused, disolved or trivialised, (like tactics can, for example) in defence by Redknapp. So deflect away from that by stating that you 'tried' to sign a real quality player, who would make a big difference. This tactic goes back to Hoddle with the nice refusal letter from Rivaldo.

Redknapp is currently in a huge personal damage limitation exercise, and doesn't want any public airing of dirty washing that will detract from his chances of getting the England managers job. Or, if he already has it, starting with a clean slate/conscience. Does he start to believe his own hype and lies?
 
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Agreed, this quote just smacks of self-preservation. So the players have just decided not to run about enough. Well isn't it your job Mr Redknapp to ensure that they do! Jesus Christ. Can't wait till he goes.
 
I am still amazed that there are fans who are surprised about what has happened with Redknapp, he has always been a self promoting manager with one trophy in 30 years. He always makes excuses for things that go wrong and has aways blamed others for his faults.

This was always going to end this way and as i say i am gobsmacked that so many could not see that.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Harry Redknapp has revealed Tottenham tried to sign Carlos Tevez in the January transfer window - but ended up with Louis Saha instead. "I said to the chairman 'can you get me Carlos Tevez?' That's what I said in January. 'Can we get Tevez?' It wasn't possible, but that was my dream," said Spurs boss Redknapp.
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Pathetic. What an utterly untenable target. City were really going to loan us a SECOND striker?!!!!
 
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