*** OMT Tottenham Hotspur FC v Aston Villa ***

[DubaiSpur]

Exactly. People must surely know this. Such is the nature of competitive sport. If they think price should guarantee them fun, win a minimum amount of goals - fudging hell, you're at the wrong place. Go watch some Wrestling or something.

Well, to be fair, the ticket prices also don't guarantee that the fans will sing. It's a two-way street, and the changing attitude of the fans in England parallels wider socioeconomic trends.

The prohibitive cost of Premier League football has made it an upper middle-class, middle-aged hobby, and priced out a lot of the fans who used to make up the vocal core of the matchday fanbase. Not just working-class fans, but generally youngsters too, who have less money to spend on football in general.

Either prices go down to let the more vocal fans back into stadiums, or England accepts 'ultra' culture more so a section of fans are constantly singing and banging drums, letting off flares, etc. to keep the atmosphere going.

Otherwise, you'll continue getting increasingly sterile atmospheres - no one's fault, just the way socioeconomic forces are going.

 

[DubSpur]

It's alright. Game of fine margins, and we lost to a couple of wonder strikes, though we're looking pretty blunt in front of goal ourselves. The movement and solidity is there - just lacking penetration.

Ultimately, it's a squad problem. Udogie being injured (and unfortunately, now entering 'injury-prone' territory) means we often have no 'natural' left back who can provide a threat down that side, and it makes us blunt. Spence has his strengths, but his left foot is not one of them - he will always, 100% of the time, cut in on his right, and that makes him predictable and essentially shuts the attack down.

The squad will be in a healthier place when we have two natural left backs, and Spence moved to be Porro's rotation on the right where he can be on his favored foot more.

Other than that, another striker would be welcome - someone better than Richy, less injury-prone than Solanke, less raw than Tel. And eventually, Frank will have to see that a Bentancur-Palhinha midfield isn't necessarily the best one to impose our game on the opponent - bit much of a muchness there.

But like I said, not too worried on the whole. Just lost to random chance, it happens.

Bentancur-Palinha should only be used against top teams. Only Palhina is needed against teams that we should be dominating. Someone that can pass the ball forward quickly is needed alongside him.

 

[metalgear]

If you think taking Tel off was deflating the game you really need to go rewatch it

we couldn't hold the ball up front or pressure villa once tel went off
tel wasn't great but at least he was fast to put pressure on the villa players whenever he had a chance

we started well in the second half and started to lose steam... then richy came on and it was villa's turn to attack and how they scored their winner

 

[DubaiSpur]

Bentancur-Palinha should only be used against top teams. Only Palhina is needed against teams that we should be dominating. Someone that can pass the ball forward quickly is needed alongside him.

Sure, but the question is if Villa are a top team or not. I think they're not, but they're within the category of 'comparable teams that pose a threat on the break'. So, it didn't surprise me that Frank went with a Palhinha-Benta pivot again.

It would start to become a concern if Frank stayed with this pivot against the Leeds and Burnleys of the world, but we're not there yet, so not an issue for me so far.

 

[DubSpur]

we couldn't hold the ball up front or pressure villa once tel went off
tel wasn't great but at least he was fast to put pressure on the villa players whenever he had a chance

we started well in the second half and started to lose steam... then richy came on and it was villa's turn to attack and how they scored their winner

We couldn't hold the ball up with Tel on (not that all the blame for that was on him) and Richy was putting himself about as usual.

 

[Stiff_Swede]

we couldn't hold the ball up front or pressure villa once tel went off
tel wasn't great but at least he was fast to put pressure on the villa players whenever he had a chance

we started well in the second half and started to lose steam... then richy came on and it was villa's turn to attack and how they scored their winner

Tel was not in the game, did not hold up the ball once, did nothing except missing the ball where he should have scored.

 

[DubSpur]

Sure, but the question is if Villa are a top team or not. I think they're not, but they're within the category of 'comparable teams that pose a threat on the break'. So, it didn't surprise me that Frank went with a Palhinha-Benta pivot again.

It would start to become a concern if Frank stayed with this pivot against the Leeds and Burnleys of the world, but we're not there yet, so not an issue for me so far.

No, Villa aren't, they're an upper midtable team. We should be looking to control the midfield against them and have a passer in there. We've lacked creativity so for me it is becoming a concern. Of course it's still early days and Frank might be looking at making us hard to beat first.

 

[Dicko]

I hope we wont have to wait until 31st January for a new LWF solution. Nothing we have tried there so far has really worked

 

[Daisuk]

Well, to be fair, the ticket prices also don't guarantee that the fans will sing. It's a two-way street, and the changing attitude of the fans in England parallels wider socioeconomic trends.

The prohibitive cost of Premier League football has made it an upper middle-class, middle-aged hobby, and priced out a lot of the fans who used to make up the vocal core of the matchday fanbase. Not just working-class fans, but generally youngsters too, who have less money to spend on football in general.

Either prices go down to let the more vocal fans back into stadiums, or England accepts 'ultra' culture more so a section of fans are constantly singing and banging drums, letting off flares, etc. to keep the atmosphere going.

Otherwise, you'll continue getting increasingly sterile atmospheres - no one's fault, just the way socioeconomic forces are going.

Spot on. Absolutely. Yet, even if we are seeing mostly middle class/upper class fans in the stadium, they're wearing the shirts supposedly supporting the team. You can't expect anyone to care to sing, but it seems incredibly disingenous to me to boo the team you're supporting when they're not performing exactly as you wish, regardless of the size of your wallet. But you know, maybe a more working class crowd wouldn't be so negative and demanding, whereas people who are generally more "successful" in their lives feel entitled to have things exactly as they wish all the time.

 

[Benny_Lad]

I’m torn between:

We’re not very good.

Or

We gave up 2 very low % chances which happened to go in. When Madders, Solanke and Deki are back we’ll improve and the younger players can then have time to blend in as back ups.

 

[Benny_Lad]

I hope we wont have to wait until 31st January for a new LWF solution. Nothing we have tried there so far has really worked

Agree. Wasted £60 mil there. We look way worse than when latter day Son played there.

Succession planning failure there for the recruitment team.

 

[glasgowspur]

Have we taken any points with this ref since that Liverpool game?

 

[Mikey10]

Watching from the South we look so pedestrian; a LOT of sideways passing.

As others have said, Xavi and Tel are not ready - Xavi could be, eventually, I’ve seen nothing to suggest Tel ever will be.

And as for the nigh on 10 minutes before those subs…ffs…it was 1-1 at that point. If they’re coming on get them ready before, don’t spend all that time in their ear as they bounce up and down on the sideline stripped and ready!

 

[El Dante]

We were too slow in possession. This allowed Villa to get back central and defensive. They blocked us through the middle and we were short in ideas. We need to have varying tempo plus have a front 4 that train together, work together and learn each other. Only then will we look dangerous in attack.

 

[Bishop]

When some of said our forward players weren't up to snuff we were told we were talking nonsense. Another game, another non performance from our attackers....

 

[metalgear]

Tel was not in the game, did not hold up the ball once, did nothing except missing the ball where he should have scored.

his forward press was good - preventing their back line from progressing up the pitch. richy also was not in the game, but did not offer any intensity in the forward press.

 

[fernadez]

I’m torn between:

We’re not very good.

Or

We gave up 2 very low % chances which happened to go in. When Madders, Solanke and Deki are back we’ll improve and the younger players can then have time to blend in as back ups.

I'm saying it's we're not very good going forward and when....

 

[Jurgen the German]

My takeaways from the game today:

Our forwards are nowhere near good enough. Odobert and Tel try hard but they’re just not up to standard. Same for Richarlison. Johnson is scared to drive forward or take a man on.

Our buildup play is painful to watch. We pass the ball from side to side for 10-20 passes until the other team gets bored and they allow us to enter their half. If Kudus and Xavi aren’t firing then that’s us nullified.

We don’t give up many chances but we also don’t create many.

Is Burnley our sole home victory in the league this season? We’ve not exactly faced stellar opponents besides Bournemouth. Thank GHod we’re away from home in the next game.

 

[DubSpur]

his forward press was good - preventing their back line from progressing up the pitch. richy also was not in the game, but did not offer any intensity in the forward press.

For a press to work everyone needs to go, that changed after the subs. Richy wasn't the prob, he was closing down.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Spot on. Absolutely. Yet, even if we are seeing mostly middle class/upper class fans in the stadium, they're wearing the shirts supposedly supporting the team. You can't expect anyone to care to sing, but it seems incredibly disingenous to me to boo the team you're supporting when they're not performing exactly as you wish, regardless of the size of your wallet. But you know, maybe a more working class crowd wouldn't be so negative and demanding, whereas people who are generally more "successful" in their lives feel entitled to have things exactly as they wish all the time.

Spot on. And don't get me wrong, I don't agree with the booing - my view is, you pays your money and you takes your chances, more or less.

But it's just inevitable given the changing composition of football crowds these days. There are Liverpool fans, at Anfield, who decided that three losses were enough to start booing - that, for a title-winning team.