Official - Defoe

[SubZero]

I thought it was Bale's fault, if Defoe had got the ball early he would have been nailed on to score, he was in typical Defoe territory, but Bale decided to beat his man and by then it was too late and there was nothing Defoe could do.

I see your point Pandy, but Bale always puts the ball in like that, it's (in my view) his main weapon. Run the fullback ragged and lay the pass across in front of the CB. Even Pav seems to know that, so it's clearly not rocket science. But for all it's ifs and buts, it was a terrible miss. I can't see no two ways about it.

 

[DHSF]

Sub Zero - it wasnt a terrible miss. It was a miss because of two reasons a) Defoe isnt the tallest b) Defoe HAD to stay on side and he was level or just behind both Bale and Savic.

Anyways we can talk about this all day long especially whose fault it was - was it Defoe's? was it Bale's?

 

[thfcsteff]

I see your point Pandy, but Bale always puts the ball in like that, it's (in my view) his main weapon. Run the fullback ragged and lay the pass across in front of the CB. Even Pav seems to know that, so it's clearly not rocket science. But for all it's ifs and buts, it was a terrible miss. I can't see no two ways about it.

I said at the time, and Harry confirmed with his observation, that JD started to run INSIDE for a few steps before checking back out; that half a yard or so was the difference there IMHO, between that and making sure he stayed onside, very very unlucky indeed...

 

[milo]

I don't really know why the Defoe arguments keeps on raging - we all know his deficiencies and his positive points. The bloke is a tireless worker and will always be in with a sniff at goal throughout the course of a game - keep him hungry and he's a fantastic asset to have. Playing up front on his own (not his best position by a long shot) today, he did well considering how little he saw of the ball. He scored one and was a toe-length away from grabbing another!

Spot on

 

[milo]

I see your point Pandy, but Bale always puts the ball in like that, it's (in my view) his main weapon. Run the fullback ragged and lay the pass across in front of the CB. Even Pav seems to know that, so it's clearly not rocket science. But for all it's ifs and buts, it was a terrible miss. I can't see no two ways about it.

It was a run from the half way line before the cross and if Defoe couldn't keep up then Pav would've stood no chance

 

[southstand1882]

Thought Defoe's finish today was top class.

 

[mick cooper]

I said at the time, and Harry confirmed with his observation, that JD started to run INSIDE for a few steps before checking back out; that half a yard or so was the difference there IMHO, between that and making sure he stayed onside, very very unlucky indeed...

Bale has started to believe a little too much in the media hype, I'm beginning to suspect. He was far too ****y for much of the game, and with the exception of his stunning goal, seemed to make a lot of mistakes, from his choice of action, failed attempts to beat people to that opportunity to feed Defoe, until the chance was missed.

It would be good if Bale went back to playing on the left wing for a while, when he did go past people it was in that position.

This repetitious B/S that people trot out on here about Defoes movement, being offside, being too short, his hold up play etc etc is mostly crap. He isn't the best in the world, granted, but he's a far better player than some on here credit him for - and his workrate is excellent.

Frankly gutterboy, I think you should put a sock in it, because I don't see you as being anything other than someone who is ignorant of how the game is played, and hopelessly lost when it comes to recognising ability. In my view, you do nothing but come on here to wind people up, and to be honest - the board could do well if you didn't come on and post again, certainly until you can restrict yourself to analysis from a position of understanding.
Your tireless criticisms of Defoe are just plain irritating, and you know it - and continue with them because you know its annoying.

Defoe isn't a worldbeater, but he's good enough for our team - and to put things in perspective, he was half an inch from putting us in the lead, and probably winning the game - VDV would have been 30 yards away, had he still been on the pitch.

 

[billyiddo]

the goal and the miss aside i thought he done nothing but give the ball away

but that was always going to be the case as he is not the type of player you play up front by himself, he worked hard and done his best, unfortunately he was the wrong man or the job today - but at least he tried hard - which is all i ask. im not not tinkled off that he didn't play well, that was always going to be the case when you play him upfront on his own against a side of Man Cities calibre

 

[SubZero]

Good calls the both of you, Steff and DHSF. No doubt it was unluckly, as is every miss unless done deliberately. But as I saw it, Defoe mistimed the run completely, started way too late, slowed down to stay onside even if Bale was running full speed two yards ahead of him. Bale had no chance of reaching him in his position, and had no other place to put the pass. If anything it was a fragment too hard, but it still had to beat Hart. I don't think Bale could have passed earlier either, as Defoe would have been caught out before the pass had reached him.

Sure it was unlucky, and at such a crucial time, but he should absolutely have gotten to it IMHO. But I won't hold it against him in any way, as said those things happen.

[video=youtube;mRDbkVYu5sY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRDbkVYu5sY[/video]

 

[milo]

Yes, but they mostly played in the 80s when you could get away with carrying a poacher who contributed so little. I guess Inzaghi was the last of that dying breed who was particularly successful.

So what you are effectively saying is that Defoe could be the best in the world in his position and you wouldn't want him because you think that there is not space for that type of player in top teams any more.

 

[billyiddo]

^from my position Bale had all the time in the word to play the ball earlier - he wanted to burst through and score himself and only passed when he knew that was a no goer.

 

[Pandy]

Fair enough, didn't see that at the time. It is fudging painful to watch considering what happened just minutes later.

 

[DHSF]

I NEVER want to see that again Sub Zero - its so agonising its untrue. Its horrible.

 

[AdamB]

No way I would start Defoe ahead of VdV. Rafa is better at every aspect of the game, including finishing which is meant to be Defoe's stregnth!! The only real upside which Defoe has over Rafa is pace, not because Defoe is that quick but just that Rafa is slooooooooow. Most teams would kill for a player of VdV quality and experience - we have 3 genuinely top class players in MOdric, Bale and Rafa and the team should be built around them.

That said, issues such as Defoe vs Rafa, Sandro vs Parker, who to start at CB etc should largely go away next year if we're back in the CL as we'll have big games regularly so Defoe will get enough games to keep him happy

 

[SubZero]

Billyiddo, he couldn't pass before he reached the ball. In that case it would have to be a first touch pass while running full speed covered by the FB, or he would have had to drag back and possibly ruined the momentum. I don't think Bale is to blame, although I agree that he has become a little bit too "hero" for his own good lately. But I suspect we are overcomplicating things a little bit here, it was a (I hereby retract "terrible") miss, and no blames passed on my behalf.

 

[thfcsteff]

Bale has started to believe a little too much in the media hype, I'm beginning to suspect. He was far too ****y for much of the game, and with the exception of his stunning goal, seemed to make a lot of mistakes, from his choice of action, failed attempts to beat people to that opportunity to feed Defoe, until the chance was missed.

It would be good if Bale went back to playing on the left wing for a while, when he did go past people it was in that position.

This repetitious B/S that people trot out on here about Defoes movement, being offside, being too short, his hold up play etc etc is mostly crap. He isn't the best in the world, granted, but he's a far better player than some on here credit him for - and his workrate is excellent.

Frankly gutterboy, I think you should put a sock in it, because I don't see you as being anything other than someone who is ignorant of how the game is played, and hopelessly lost when it comes to recognising ability. In my view, you do nothing but come on here to wind people up, and to be honest - the board could do well if you didn't come on and post again, certainly until you can restrict yourself to analysis from a position of understanding.
Your tireless criticisms of Defoe are just plain irritating, and you know it - and continue with them because you know its annoying.

Defoe isn't a worldbeater, but he's good enough for our team - and to put things in perspective, he was half an inch from putting us in the lead, and probably winning the game - VDV would have been 30 yards away, had he still been on the pitch.

Cannot disagree with that, well put Mick...

 

[billyiddo]

ive seen the replays mate, i think he could have passed earlier even after his first touch he could have curled a pass in to Defoe's run - it wasn't easy, the defender done well from the position he was in. the eventual pass was a yard or two in front of where it should have been - it's harsh to blame either and that's not what im trying to do - but of the two it was the pass more than the run which was to blame

and Mick - sorry fella, but i think you are letting your need to defend Defoe from GB cloud your judgment - Defoe was poor today -without the goal no one would be saying he played well he offered nothing up top over the 90 mins - he worked hard and done as much as i expected him too - it is not his fault that we played him as a lone striker which is not a position he can play well in, but that doesn't mean he gave a good performance. he gave the ball away countless times and rarely got in a position to stretch their defense - again im not trying to criticize him as a player - he was played in a role where he would never excel - he worked hard and im not faulting him for effort, but the quality wasn't there

 

[Pandy]

No way I would start Defoe ahead of VdV. Rafa is better at every aspect of the game, including finishing which is meant to be Defoe's stregnth!! The only real upside which Defoe has over Rafa is pace, not because Defoe is that quick but just that Rafa is slooooooooow. Most teams would kill for a player of VdV quality and experience - we have 3 genuinely top class players in MOdric, Bale and Rafa and the team should be built around them.

That said, issues such as Defoe vs Rafa, Sandro vs Parker, who to start at CB etc should largely go away next year if we're back in the CL as we'll have big games regularly so Defoe will get enough games to keep him happy

Sometimes it's about balance not overall quality, and against teams that are difficult to break down maybe we need that cutting edge higher up the pitch more than we need the creativity to find people in advanced positions. Not that it isn't important, but we have players such as Bale, Modric, Adebayor and Lennon to do that already and none of them are both good finishers and involved in the box regularly, something that Defoe is. While VDV does chip in and he is undoubtedly class, he doesn't score consistently enough to be the biggest goalscoring threat on the pitch. Perhaps as a result, at least in the short term, Defoe should be promoted to the first team and the remaining 2 slots divided between Bale, VDV and Lennon depending on who we're playing.

After all, it isn't like playing a 'luxury player' like Defoe was the problem last year, it was that we had no Adebayor figure to face opposition defences. With Adebayor I think Defoe becomes a much more viable option in the first team, something that he has proven consistently this season.

 

[SubZero]

ive seen the replays mate, i think he could have passed earlier even after his first touch he could have curled a pass in to Defoe's run - it wasn't easy, the defender done well from the position he was in. the eventual pass was a yard or two in front of where it should have been - it's harsh to blame either and that's not what im trying to do - but of the two it was the pass more than the run which was to blame

Fair play, mate.

 

[marcospur2]

That miss is so hard to watch.