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Joao Moutinho

Rossi22 said:
Ok well I think passing is all well and good, but it's pointless if there's no end product to it. Sandro, Moutinho, Dembele and Lennon might get you 10 a season combined. So that leaves Bale and and whoever's up front to get the rest, good luck with that.
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Agreed.

WE NEED A S.T.R.I.K.E.R.

N-O-W
 
BTW, I also agree with the gerneral sentiment of Rossi22's posts; whilst a Moutinho-type of midfielder is needed at some point, right now we need a reliable 20-plus goals a season striker who can play in out current system. The evolution to a possession-based system of attack sounds good, but that can wait;

Needs must; Striker now please, though if the Moutinho-type midfielder that we need could score 15 gals and make similar levels of assists, then get them in now!
 
glorygloryeze said:
This Moutinho talk is getting a bit embarrasing...

HE'S NOT COMING PEOPLE!!!
NOTHING TO SEE HERE!!!
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That's a pretty silly thing to say when he's clearly the one player our manager would absolutely kill for, and one we were just minutes away from signing at the end of the last window.
 
Gutter Boy said:
That's a pretty silly thing to say when he's clearly the one player our manager would absolutely kill for, and one we were just minutes away from signing at the end of the last window.
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Well, as i've said before Moutinho coming here this January for the kind of money he's likely to cost is pie in the sky - especially when Levy is concerned. 20M+ is A LOT of money for a midfielder in Levy's eyes imo.

He's still in the CL as well, and him performing well there in the spring might mean he has more suitors next summer anyway, despit his supposed love for AVB.

So that's why it's not going to happen imo.

If it does, I'll expose myself onscreen here...
 
Gutter Boy said:
The Porto version of GG reckon he'll be leaving after their game at Benfica on the 13th:

http://translate.google.co.uk/trans...a=X&ei=aMroUOn4C7CA0AXniIGwAg&ved=0CDcQ7gEwAA

"Today they told me after the game comes out in the darkness" (darkness being a play on Stadium of Light)
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Who is 'they'? looks like one poster said he heard he will leave after the Benfica game.....if one poster on here says something it doesn't mean the whole of GG reckon the same thing does it?
 
Kingdawson said:
Who is 'they'? looks like one poster said he heard he will leave after the Benfica game.....if one poster on here says something it doesn't mean the whole of GG reckon the same thing does it?
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I dunno.............that appeared to be akin to your MO in the AVB "acolytes" debate. ;)
 
If Moutinho does come in (unlikely), I think he'd be replacing and rotating with one of Sandro/Dembele in our starting XI (probably Dembele since Moutinho's not so much of a DM), with one of Sig/Ade/Dempsey in front of them for now, then Holtby + a new no. 9 next season. That's mainly because none of Moutinho, Sandro, or Dembele are capable goalscorers or operate as far as AM.

I'd be pleased with this, as much as I think Dembele is a good footballer. It's just that Dembele's strengths are not Moutinho's strengths, and I think Moutinho's particular qualities would suit our team more. While Dembele's a wonderful tackler, dribbler, and runner, he (and our other players) tend to hang on to the ball and run with it, or take an extra touch to control it/look for passes, which slows down our play and in particular our counters. He can certainly contribute to attack, but his passing vision is not really that of a playmaker.

Where Moutinho excels is playmaking on the counter. I admit that I've watched him in CL/Euros rather than the portuguese league, which would probably be a better guide to his consistency, but from what I've witnessed, he is superb at circulating the ball quickly, precisely, and with some intelligence and imagination (e.g., he has 3.5 key passes per game this season in the CL, higher than any Spurs player last season or this season). He does not need more than one touch. He has a vision of the whole field before receiving and immediately distributing the pass; in contrast, our players tend to sit on the ball as they look around for runners and teammates in good positions. We are blessed with good dribblers and one-on-oners, the problem is that they do not know when to solo-run with the ball and when to one-touch pass-and-move-it and *build* an attacking play.

The pass is always faster than the man. If we have Moutinho and then Holtby next season, I think we can begin to flow much more quickly, becoming even more lethal on the counter, with more creativity through the middle to alleviate the burden on Bale & Lennon and our reliance on crosses. We can still control the game methodically in midfield, but we'd now have the capacity to speed up the tempo and circulate the ball much more swiftly and intelligently. That would help us create a higher quantity and just as importantly quality of chances, especially against the better sides in the PL whom we cannot rely on individual prowess to beat. A team ethos is now beginning to show in the defensive sense, but we still need more fluency as a team in attack to consistently carve apart teams. Passing brilliance and vision is sine qua non in that regard.

***

Plus - keep in mind that under AVB, we want to challenge on all fronts, and both Sandro and Dembele have had fitness issues in the past. We need to rotate better than under Harry last season or we will struggle to maintain momentum in the second half of the season. I know that we may not have funds for both Moutinho and a striker/AM in Jan, but I am hoping we will aggressively sell off our fringe players and at least make some room wage-wise. A striker that AVB likes would not go amiss of course but tbh, the priority for me is in creativity - in creating more and better chances.
 
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We should have bought Moutinho in the previous transfer window. Just can't see us buying him now. If we do sign him, there is a risk of unsettling our team as we have to drop either Dembele or Sandro for him.
 
skyfarer said:
If Moutinho does come in (unlikely), I think he'd be replacing and rotating with one of Sandro/Dembele in our starting XI (probably Dembele since Moutinho's not so much of a DM), with one of Sig/Ade/Dempsey in front of them for now, then Holtby + a new no. 9 next season. That's mainly because none of Moutinho, Sandro, or Dembele are capable goalscorers or operate as far as AM.

I'd be pleased with this, as much as I think Dembele is a good footballer. It's just that Dembele's strengths are not Moutinho's strengths, and I think Moutinho's particular qualities would suit our team more. While Dembele's a wonderful tackler, dribbler, and runner, he (and our other players) tend to hang on to the ball and run with it, or take an extra touch to control it/look for passes, which slows down our play and in particular our counters. He can certainly contribute to attack, but his passing vision is not really that of a playmaker.

Where Moutinho excels is playmaking on the counter. I admit that I've watched him in CL/Euros rather than the portuguese league, which would probably be a better guide to his consistency, but from what I've witnessed, he is superb at circulating the ball quickly, precisely, and with some intelligence and imagination (e.g., he has 3.5 key passes per game this season in the CL, higher than any Spurs player last season or this season). He does not need more than one touch. He has a vision of the whole field before receiving and immediately distributing the pass; in contrast, our players tend to sit on the ball as they look around for runners and teammates in good positions. We are blessed with good dribblers and one-on-oners, the problem is that they do not know when to solo-run with the ball and when to one-touch pass-and-move-it and *build* an attacking play.

The pass is always faster than the man. If we have Moutinho and then Holtby next season, I think we can begin to flow much more quickly, becoming even more lethal on the counter, with more creativity through the middle to alleviate the burden on Bale & Lennon and our reliance on crosses. We can still control the game methodically in midfield, but we'd now have the capacity to speed up the tempo and circulate the ball much more swiftly and intelligently. That would help us create a higher quantity and just as importantly quality of chances, especially against the better sides in the PL whom we cannot rely on individual prowess to beat. A team ethos is now beginning to show in the defensive sense, but we still need more fluency as a team in attack to consistently carve apart teams. Passing brilliance and vision is sine qua non in that regard.

***

Plus - keep in mind that under AVB, we want to challenge on all fronts, and both Sandro and Dembele have had fitness issues in the past. We need to rotate better than under Harry last season or we will struggle to maintain momentum in the second half of the season. I know that we may not have funds for both Moutinho and a striker/AM in Jan, but I am hoping we will aggressively sell off our fringe players and at least make some room wage-wise. A striker that AVB likes would not go amiss of course but tbh, the priority for me is in creativity - in creating more and better chances.
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Excellent, informative post. I am sure I am not the only one on this board who knows next to nothing about JM.
Interesting point about Dembele. He has been great for us but, as you say no key passes I can recall. The Sigg has made a few.
 
Spurs7891 said:
We should have bought Moutinho in the previous transfer window. Just can't see us buying him now. If we do sign him, there is a risk of unsettling our team as we have to drop either Dembele or Sandro for him.
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We wouldve done if it hadnt had been for 3 greedy agents all fighting over money that probably they werent even entitled to
 
skyfarer said:
If Moutinho does come in (unlikely), I think he'd be replacing and rotating with one of Sandro/Dembele in our starting XI (probably Dembele since Moutinho's not so much of a DM), with one of Sig/Ade/Dempsey in front of them for now, then Holtby + a new no. 9 next season. That's mainly because none of Moutinho, Sandro, or Dembele are capable goalscorers or operate as far as AM.

I'd be pleased with this, as much as I think Dembele is a good footballer. It's just that Dembele's strengths are not Moutinho's strengths, and I think Moutinho's particular qualities would suit our team more. While Dembele's a wonderful tackler, dribbler, and runner, he (and our other players) tend to hang on to the ball and run with it, or take an extra touch to control it/look for passes, which slows down our play and in particular our counters. He can certainly contribute to attack, but his passing vision is not really that of a playmaker.

Where Moutinho excels is playmaking on the counter. I admit that I've watched him in CL/Euros rather than the portuguese league, which would probably be a better guide to his consistency, but from what I've witnessed, he is superb at circulating the ball quickly, precisely, and with some intelligence and imagination (e.g., he has 3.5 key passes per game this season in the CL, higher than any Spurs player last season or this season). He does not need more than one touch. He has a vision of the whole field before receiving and immediately distributing the pass; in contrast, our players tend to sit on the ball as they look around for runners and teammates in good positions. We are blessed with good dribblers and one-on-oners, the problem is that they do not know when to solo-run with the ball and when to one-touch pass-and-move-it and *build* an attacking play.

The pass is always faster than the man. If we have Moutinho and then Holtby next season, I think we can begin to flow much more quickly, becoming even more lethal on the counter, with more creativity through the middle to alleviate the burden on Bale & Lennon and our reliance on crosses. We can still control the game methodically in midfield, but we'd now have the capacity to speed up the tempo and circulate the ball much more swiftly and intelligently. That would help us create a higher quantity and just as importantly quality of chances, especially against the better sides in the PL whom we cannot rely on individual prowess to beat. A team ethos is now beginning to show in the defensive sense, but we still need more fluency as a team in attack to consistently carve apart teams. Passing brilliance and vision is sine qua non in that regard.

***

Plus - keep in mind that under AVB, we want to challenge on all fronts, and both Sandro and Dembele have had fitness issues in the past. We need to rotate better than under Harry last season or we will struggle to maintain momentum in the second half of the season. I know that we may not have funds for both Moutinho and a striker/AM in Jan, but I am hoping we will aggressively sell off our fringe players and at least make some room wage-wise. A striker that AVB likes would not go amiss of course but tbh, the priority for me is in creativity - in creating more and better chances.
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Sandro-Dembele-Moutinho would make the best midfield in the league. We would boss all comers.

It would be a fluid 3 (especially Dembele and Moutinho), but Dembele will be freed up more to play further forward.

Also, Barca's equivalent of this trio Busquests-Iniesta-Xavi only average about 9 a season between them. They just provide the foundation for the front 3 to run wild.
 
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