I liked Erik Lamela before it was cool

[Robspur12]

Apart from one in the 95th minute which failed to be the first man. Drives me mad when they we consistently fail to deliver decent balls from corners.

The much feted luka modric was awful at delivering set pieces. It used to annoy me how a player with his talent could fail to deliver decent balls from corners. Lamela seems to be pretty handy with his set piece delivery. As well as corners he popped a free kick right on the head of paulinho. Like Har 84 I believe this lad will come good. He has bags of talent which often comes with inconsistency.

 

[Robspur12]

I

I'd love for him to succeed at Spurs. He has shown glimpses of genuine quality and has undeniable determination and a great work-rate. He really wants to do better and tries his hardest. On top of all that, he's still very young, so he could yet find another level. But at the same time... we're coming to the end of his second season at the club now, and he's just not demonstrated the consistent quality we need from a creative attacking player. Going into next season with Lamela in the first eleven is a big risk; based on what we've seen of him this season. He's not yet good enough for where we want to be in my view.

His saving grace, in my eyes, is that there is a whole host of players ahead of him in the queue for the exit door. I'd be very surprised if any of the following players are still at the club next year... Adebayor, Capoue, Kaboul, Paulinho, Chiriches. And I also suspect Dembele, Townsend and Stambouli might not be in Poch's plans.

So keeping Lamela as a squad / bench player would make perfect sense. If he finally fulfils his potential and it happens at Spurs, then everyone's happy and he can step up into the first team squad and rip premiership defences apart like we all hoped he would. In the meantime, he's certainly good enough to play our group matches in the Europa League and the early rounds of the cups - so he will get game time and the opportunity to progress.

For now though, if we continue to play 4-2-3-1, and if Eriksen and Chadli remain two of that "3", then we need a new player ahead of Lamela as the third (and no, I don't think it should be Townsend). Assuming this season wasn't a one-off from Kane, he's too good a striker not to provide with top class support.

If you want him to develop he needs to play. Sitting him on the bench will do nothing for him. A short term loan may help but imo we are not blessed with creative players so we need to play him. Imo Lamela is not the problem anyway it's getting the defensive shape right and as you say support for Kane

 

[braineclipse]

Honestly I would be stunned if he managed to turn it around at this point.

Lamela/Paulinho have managed to start to turn in "less than awful" performances with some regularity, I just can't think of players in any club/league that have had 2 dire seasons, then turned it around and became a key/influential part of their team.

Happy to see them play out season, but really couldn't see the club not actively looking at offers for them +several others

You really think it's a fair description to say that he's had 2 dire seasons with us so far?

To go from truly dire in two seasons to a key or influential part of a team is a very high bar to set up. Others have mentioned Lucas and Henderson at Liverpool. If you change the bar to disappointing or fans wanting to see an upgrade brought in and then developed into a good or very good player for the team I think a lot more names would come to peoples minds.

 

[Raziel]

You really think it's a fair description to say that he's had 2 dire seasons with us so far?

To go from truly dire in two seasons to a key or influential part of a team is a very high bar to set up. Others have mentioned Lucas and Henderson at Liverpool. If you change the bar to disappointing or fans wanting to see an upgrade brought in and then developed into a good or very good player for the team I think a lot more names would come to peoples minds.

Actually yes, I guess some people would say he's been average/mediocre, but the truth is for quite a spell (even recently) he's been unable to keep his spot in the side during a single game (he's been subbed a lot when he gets a start), and that's without considering the role he was bought for.

A lot of the 7 players that we bought and people criticize had team roles to play, Lamela was bought to be a match winner for us, take away the price tag conversation, just the role he was expected to fill, he's failed badly (in two years how many matches has he won or even saved for us?)

I don't dislike Lamela, its obvious the effort, its also obvious pre Spurs that he has talent, I'm just not sure what the goal is anymore with him. If Poch believes he can still step up into someone that regularly wins matches for us, ok. If its a hard working winger with occasional flash of brilliance, bring back Lennon and sell Lamela. I've also mentioned it before, but believe the club has to consider the future career of players like Lamela/Soldado (who are good players, just seemingly not suited for PL), it may be the last chance for both of them to truly get back to decent level in their career if they move on this summer.

 

[braineclipse]

Actually yes, I guess some people would say he's been average/mediocre, but the truth is for quite a spell (even recently) he's been unable to keep his spot in the side during a single game (he's been subbed a lot when he gets a start), and that's without considering the role he was bought for.

A lot of the 7 players that we bought and people criticize had team roles to play, Lamela was bought to be a match winner for us, take away the price tag conversation, just the role he was expected to fill, he's failed badly (in two years how many matches has he won or even saved for us?)

I don't dislike Lamela, its obvious the effort, its also obvious pre Spurs that he has talent, I'm just not sure what the goal is anymore with him. If Poch believes he can still step up into someone that regularly wins matches for us, ok. If its a hard working winger with occasional flash of brilliance, bring back Lennon and sell Lamela. I've also mentioned it before, but believe the club has to consider the future career of players like Lamela/Soldado (who are good players, just seemingly not suited for PL), it may be the last chance for both of them to truly get back to decent level in their career if they move on this summer.

What would you quantify as getting subbed "a lot" when he gets a start? Quickly looking at his minutes per game (http://www.whoscored.com/Players/75830/Fixtures/Erik-Lamela) that's not how I would describe it.

The difference between Lamela and Soldado, primarily in age, is obvious. I don't think they can accurately be lumped in to a common description like that. Lamela turned 23 in March! He's the same age as Mason and Townsend. He's a year younger than Rose. Getting a move this summer could be his last chance to get back to a "decent level in his career"? Having just turned 23? That seems like a shocking statement to me.

I don't think it's accurate to describe his spell for us so far as dire, I don't think considering the role he was bought for changes that.

He's now reached 25 league starts for us. He has experienced significant changes during his stay here, 3 head coaches, half a season out with injury etc. 2 years is technically accurate, but 25 league starts is also technically accurate and at least as informative.

If that is all we have. If 25 league starts is all the time we give to a clearly talented, very hard working young player signed for a lot of money when he himself states that he wants to stay and keep trying whilst showing every game that he is trying hard then I suppose that's all the time we give... I really hope that's not the case.

 

[Raziel]

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What would you quantify as getting subbed "a lot" when he gets a start? Quickly looking at his minutes per game (http://www.whoscored.com/Players/75830/Fixtures/Erik-Lamela) that's not how I would describe it.

The difference between Lamela and Soldado, primarily in age, is obvious. I don't think they can accurately be lumped in to a common description like that. Lamela turned 23 in March! He's the same age as Mason and Townsend. He's a year younger than Rose. Getting a move this summer could be his last chance to get back to a "decent level in his career"? Having just turned 23? That seems like a shocking statement to me.

I don't think it's accurate to describe his spell for us so far as dire, I don't think considering the role he was bought for changes that.

He's now reached 25 league starts for us. He has experienced significant changes during his stay here, 3 head coaches, half a season out with injury etc. 2 years is technically accurate, but 25 league starts is also technically accurate and at least as informative.

If that is all we have. If 25 league starts is all the time we give to a clearly talented, very hard working young player signed for a lot of money when he himself states that he wants to stay and keep trying whilst showing every game that he is trying hard then I suppose that's all the time we give... I really hope that's not the case.

Mate, to be clear, I see your view, just feel there are other considerations

By decent level, my opinion is Lamela could still be sold to a top tier Italian club this summer (Inter/Roma/etc.), another season with the same stats as this one, probably not. So would mean him moving to a second tier Italian/Spanish club and having to excel there (where team quality would be less) to get back to the place he was a couple of years ago. Something he should consider (btw, one of his attributes seems to be that he will fight to prove people wrong)

I also understand Spurs in the last 2-3 years hasn't been a great place for a player adapting/growing into a role (Bentaleb/Kane/Eriksen being the exceptions, but I wonder how much better those three would be with a more stable setup).

It's not about do we have more time than 25 starts, it comes down to these things for me with Lamela
- Do we still believe there is a match winner in him (if not = sell, not even a discussion)
- To bring that match winner out, do we need to expect another 10, 20 games of next season of "adapting"
- What is our risk re buying players to cover the right side issue while we give Lamela chance?

The other issue is Poch, my solution if you wanted to give Lamela chance =
- sell Townsend (another thread/conversation)
- play Lamela
- bring back Lennon as cover/competition for Lamela (you know what you get with Lennon)

functionally you would actually make money with that approach, and give Lamela one more season, also might have a revitalized Lennon. Poch seems to rigid too see that play unfortunately and I suspect we will buy some raw inverted RW who we will end up swapping in/out with one of Lamela/Townsend with very little effect.

 

[braineclipse]

o

Mate, to be clear, I see your view, just feel there are other considerations

By decent level, my opinion is Lamela could still be sold to a top tier Italian club this summer (Inter/Roma/etc.), another season with the same stats as this one, probably not. So would mean him moving to a second tier Italian/Spanish club and having to excel there (where team quality would be less) to get back to the place he was a couple of years ago. Something he should consider (btw, one of his attributes seems to be that he will fight to prove people wrong)

I also understand Spurs in the last 2-3 years hasn't been a great place for a player adapting/growing into a role (Bentaleb/Kane/Eriksen being the exceptions, but I wonder how much better those three would be with a more stable setup).

It's not about do we have more time than 25 starts, it comes down to these things for me with Lamela
- Do we still believe there is a match winner in him (if not = sell, not even a discussion)
- To bring that match winner out, do we need to expect another 10, 20 games of next season of "adapting"
- What is our risk re buying players to cover the right side issue while we give Lamela chance?

The other issue is Poch, my solution if you wanted to give Lamela chance =
- sell Townsend (another thread/conversation)
- play Lamela
- bring back Lennon as cover/competition for Lamela (you know what you get with Lennon)

functionally you would actually make money with that approach, and give Lamela one more season, also might have a revitalized Lennon. Poch seems to rigid too see that play unfortunately and I suspect we will buy some raw inverted RW who we will end up swapping in/out with one of Lamela/Townsend with very little effect.

Disagree on Roma. Disagree massively on Inter...

Can you define what you mean by match winner?

Lamela is capable of playing both on the right and centrally in the attacking midfield 3 of our 4-2-3-1 (imo). We have a good deal of flexibility with Eriksen also functioning centrally and on the left along with Chadli etc. We can most definitely bring in another right sided player, create competition for places, and still give a player like Lamela a good deal of time on the pitch.

Currently Lamela has won his starting place back from Townsend and if we go into the first game of next season with an unchanged squad (hypothetical obviously) I would expect him to start. We have a severe shortage of competition for places and options on the bench in that attacking midfield trio (and in the front 6 positions in general). Yet the only two options you see is either to sell Lamela and bring in someone "first choice" or make Lamela "first choice" and have a backup/cover/competition player clearly behind him at the start of the season? For the "sell him and buy a first choice player" option the problems with our recent transfer record are worth mentioning.

The to me rather obvious alternative is to bring in 1 more attacking midfielder capable of playing on the right, preferably someone a bit versatile, but not an absolute necessity as we have versatility in those already in the squad. To add to this we have Pritchard, if we want one of Lennon/Townsend and potentially a youngster like Alli (as an option for the #10 role). That would give us (1) real competition for places, (2) actual quality on the bench and (3) options for different constellations of attacking players. It would also give us the time to integrate a new signing more slowly if we wanted to.

Long story short. Lamela is currently first choice. We don't need to sell any first choice players, we need to bring in players to compete with our first choice players and sell the players currently operating as squad players/fillers.

 

[Raziel]

Match winner = Kane, Eriksen, Chadli, VDV, Bale, guys that will win you a game when the team & them are not at the best, struggling, etc.

No issue with Pritchard/Alli/Lennon being involved in the squad.

Completely disagree that Lamela is first choice, and that is my problem. He has had what 4 games since last Townsend start? the whole season has been one or the other, given a run to prove/make the position theirs, neither has claimed it.

I cannot see the sense of entering a new season with no one who owns that RW position, in my personal opinion the difference between 4th/5th and where we end this season lies with our LW and lack of a DM alternative to Mason.

 

[braineclipse]

Match winner = Kane, Eriksen, Chadli, VDV, Bale, guys that will win you a game when the team & them are not at the best, struggling, etc.

No issue with Pritchard/Alli/Lennon being involved in the squad.

Completely disagree that Lamela is first choice, and that is my problem. He has had what 4 games since last Townsend start? the whole season has been one or the other, given a run to prove/make the position theirs, neither has claimed it.

I cannot see the sense of entering a new season with no one who owns that RW position, in my personal opinion the difference between 4th/5th and where we end this season lies with our LW and lack of a DM alternative to Mason.

I think Lamela stepping it up and contributing a similar number of goals to Chadli is a fair goal and at least somewhat likely. At this point to expect him to contribute like Kane, VdV or Bale next season doesn't seem reasonable.

Lamela has 22 league starts. Townsend has 10. You mentioned subs earlier, go have a look at Townsend's subs and compare them to Lamela's since you thought it was worth looking at.

It hasn't been a whole season of one or the other. Townsend didn't get his first league start until December 28th. His league starts mainly came in his fairly consistent run starting around the time of the LC final until losing his place again 3-4 weeks back. The rest of his appearances came around the packed Christmas and new year schedule.

 

[billyiddo]

Long story short. Lamela is currently first choice. We don't need to sell any first choice players, we need to bring in players to compete with our first choice players and sell the players currently operating as squad players/fillers.

this for my definitely - id like to see real competition brought in for both left and right wing forward positions and Pritchard brought in to understudy Eriksen. with Chadli and Lamela competing with the new arrivals for a starting position.

to add in some more criteria i think an older more established player to compete on the right and a younger player with a high ceiling potential wise for the left would give us a good blend of youth/potential and established ability across the three positions.

 

[The egyptian]

IMO, if some one come with an offer more than 20M pound, we should consider sell him, at last playing 25 games plus cup games for 6M is not very bad. But if all offers are less than this figure we should take the risk and keep him for another season, his price will not be less than 15M pound at any case.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

IMO, if some one come with an offer more than 20M pound, we should consider sell him, at last playing 25 games plus cup games for 6M is not very bad. But if all offers are less than this figure we should take the risk and keep him for another season, his price will not be less than 15M pound at any case.

I'd be stunned if anyone offers more than £10m. He does not look like the player we signed and looks worse than a lot cheaper players out there

It's exactly why we won't sell him IMO and hopefully he will show us why we signed him

 

[The egyptian]

I'd be stunned if anyone offers more than £10m. He does not look like the player we signed and looks worse than a lot cheaper players out there

It's exactly why we won't sell him IMO and hopefully he will show us why we signed him

If we sit a relase clause for 15M pound for him, 4 italan teams at least will make bids tomorrow.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

If we sit a relase clause for 15M pound for him, 4 italan teams at least will make bids tomorrow.

I seriously doubt any italian would spend £15m on anyone who hasn't played well for 2 seasons. We're not talking clubs with mega money over there

 

[Jurgen the German]

Match winner = Kane, Eriksen, Chadli, VDV, Bale, guys that will win you a game when the team & them are not at the best, struggling, etc.

No issue with Pritchard/Alli/Lennon being involved in the squad.

Completely disagree that Lamela is first choice, and that is my problem. He has had what 4 games since last Townsend start? the whole season has been one or the other, given a run to prove/make the position theirs, neither has claimed it.

I cannot see the sense of entering a new season with no one who owns that RW position, in my personal opinion the difference between 4th/5th and where we end this season lies with our LW and lack of a DM alternative to Mason.

Yep. Match winner = goals

I think it would be asking a lot for all 3 attacking midfielders to get 10+ league goals a season, but I we should expect him to get closer to 10 than the 2 he has now (one of them he know nothing about).

I would consider selling Lennon and Townsend and replacing them with a first choice right winger in Lamela's place.

 

[Mumorn]

id look to get a replacement for chadli in. Ayew preferably.

 

[braineclipse]

Yep. Match winner = goals

I think it would be asking a lot for all 3 attacking midfielders to get 10+ league goals a season, but I we should expect him to get closer to 10 than the 2 he has now (one of them he know nothing about).

I would consider selling Lennon and Townsend and replacing them with a first choice right winger in Lamela's place.

I agree.

But I also think that becoming a match winner is not the only way Lamela can succeed with us. He could for example develop more like Di Maria at Real into a top class attacking box-to-box type players contributing a lot to buildup play and with movement without scoring a ton of goals. Or to a more attacking playmaker type like Mata or Silva.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Match winner = Kane, Eriksen, Chadli, VDV, Bale, guys that will win you a game when the team & them are not at the best, struggling, etc.

No issue with Pritchard/Alli/Lennon being involved in the squad.

Completely disagree that Lamela is first choice, and that is my problem. He has had what 4 games since last Townsend start? the whole season has been one or the other, given a run to prove/make the position theirs, neither has claimed it.

I cannot see the sense of entering a new season with no one who owns that RW position, in my personal opinion the difference between 4th/5th and where we end this season lies with our LW and lack of a DM alternative to Mason.

the RW has to be a position to upgrade on

We can't have another season where the endearing factor of our right winger is his defensive contribution... We may as well play two right backs!!! This season though as you say no one has stepped up to aye either the left or right side. Chardli has the left by default due to his goals and no one has taken the right side which really isn't great

I fully expect Pritchard to come in on the right personally s he has the flexibility and intelligence along with a GHod work rate

 

[Mumorn]

 

[Rorschach]

How did we not score in that match?

Great performance from him and a real shame that goal at the end didn't go in. The bar is set.