• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

Ebay, scam or go for it ?

But that's different, because you didn't buy something.

This guy I know, he was selling counterfeit Beats by Dr Dre on eBay, but he was under the impression they were real. What he did is whenever he'd receive an order on eBay, he'd quickly go and buy some Beats by Dr Dre off TradeTang (a Chinese wholesale website that specialises in counterfeit goods), and he thought he'd get away with waiting for them to come from China, before quickly despatching them to customers. Now these people didn't know anything. All they saw were Beats by Dr Dre that were meant to cost ?ú280 or something like that, but they were buying them for about half the price. He got a lot of messages asking if they were real, and he said they were, because he thought that.

But the problem was this guy was getting about 10 orders a day, and he was too young to have a bank account or anything. Within about a week he reached his ?ú2100 limit and got mega fudged. This meant he wasn't able to spend his PayPal money, but he was still receiving orders, so he could no longer buy any more headphones when people ordered them.

Then the disputes started rolling in, and his PayPal account got banned so now he could no longer receive money, which I suppose was a good thing. But now he couldn't give these people their money back. PayPal wanted proof he actually had the items in stock, and they wanted proof of ID as well as a bank account linked to his PayPal. Obviously he couldn't provide any of this.

In the end, PayPal just gave these innocent people back their money and no harm was done.

I am afraid your friend is a taco, not only is he selling knock offs as the real thing (I dont buy the fact he thought they were real) he was also trading illegally as you are not allowed to fund the purchase of a sale with the money from that sale. Companies that do this are the reason why people get left out of pocket.
 
My friend, there's no difference at all.

PayPal are merely conduits, but conduits whose 'security' comprises of just a username and a password - yet there is an open door, direct into your bank account. If that 'security' (I seriously laugh) is compromised, then it's an open chequebook to defraud anyone of any single sum of money you so wish.

The problem, is about conduct and behaviour. Prior to this episode, I'd been a user of both PayPal and eBay - respectable sums of money passing through both, over a lengthy period of time. If one of your customers tells you that you're the victim of fraud, then it pays to sit up and listen to them. What you DON'T do, is ignore them, treat them like a criminal and then call them liars.

I now advise people to stay WELL CLEAR of PayPal. PayPal is marketed as being an easy way to transfer money. Yeah, it is - too easy, and too easy to be scammed on, and very hard to get your money back. The problem is though, you just don't think about it, do you? Yet, look at how much banks spend on online security; pin codes, tokens, pensentry, etc... And yet, if you're on PayPal, all of that security can be compromised with a mere email and password. Bang - direct account into your bank account.

A lot of internet sites use PayPal these days, but I'm happy to ignore using it. It isn't safe, it isn't secure and - worst of all - they treat you like brick if something goes wrong. That just aint good enough.

I take it your account was hacked and somebody took money. For all they know, you may have given money to someone, and you were just asking for it back. I agree their behaviour was very ****ish, but still.

In the case of when you shop on eBay, they can see you bought something and have everything they need to know. I may as well point out that PayPal is owned by eBay.
 
I am afraid your friend is a taco, not only is he selling knock offs as the real thing (I dont buy the fact he thought they were real) he was also trading illegally as you are not allowed to fund the purchase of a sale with the money from that sale. Companies that do this are the reason why people get left out of pocket.

I know, I told him
 
My opinion only and not that of the board or it's owners, mods or admins is that eBay (and in turn PayPal) turns a blind eye to such a massive amount of fraud, law breaking and abuse of consumer rights that it's complicit by default. I've reported blatant law breaking and touting of tickets on there and not had so much as an acknowledgement of my email let alone the offending items taken down, but when eBay get a percentage of a massively inflated ticket price (1000% mark up) and Paypal get a cut of the payment in handling fees then they're going to turn a blind eye aren't they?
 
My opinion only and not that of the board or it's owners, mods or admins is that eBay (and in turn PayPal) turns a blind eye to such a massive amount of fraud, law breaking and abuse of consumer rights that it's complicit by default. I've reported blatant law breaking and touting of tickets on there and not had so much as an acknowledgement of my email let alone the offending items taken down, but when eBay get a percentage of a massively inflated ticket price (1000% mark up) and Paypal get a cut of the payment in handling fees then they're going to turn a blind eye aren't they?

Their main priority is to fish out scammers.

I'd certainly buy this iPad.
 
i think im correct in sasying that PayPal arnt actually covered by things like the banking code, and lets be honest - you wouldnt bank with someone that wasnt prepared as a company to adhere to that

That would now be the FSA, however I believe Paypal are 'situated' in Luxemborg. Due to EU agreements, whatever Luxemborg's financial regulation happens to be like, it can freely operate in that way here under its home regulation
 
I take it your account was hacked and somebody took money. For all they know, you may have given money to someone, and you were just asking for it back. I agree their behaviour was very ****ish, but still.

In the case of when you shop on eBay, they can see you bought something and have everything they need to know. I may as well point out that PayPal is owned by eBay.

Try reading the details.

I've told you, PayPal KNEW about the ?ú100k scam, that the transaction on my account was one of them and was talking to the company who'd been scammed, indeed sending them lists of 43 transaction numbers and email addresses. The guy came into work on the morning, found his company was -?ú100k, just as I found I was down -?ú5.5k - and we both contacted PayPal immediately. PayPal then, for some fudging reason, decided that there was "insufficient evidence".

Everyone knows PayPal is owned by eBay. But you seem to be of the misunderstanding, that all that can go through PayPal, are eBay transactions. PayPal can be used for absolutely anything, and the 'purchase' here was some sort of fee associated with an English School, based in West London. As PayPal is a conduit for transferring money, the audit trails are there. So, why lie to a customer when they could easily see from their audit trail that ?ú100k had mysteriously disappeared out of this companies account in the middle of the night?

What sort of operation are they running? Where's the checks and balances? There are none - absolutely none at all.
 
Try reading the details.

I've told you, PayPal KNEW about the ?ú100k scam, that the transaction on my account was one of them and was talking to the company who'd been scammed, indeed sending them lists of 43 transaction numbers and email addresses. The guy came into work on the morning, found his company was -?ú100k, just as I found I was down -?ú5.5k - and we both contacted PayPal immediately. PayPal then, for some fudging reason, decided that there was "insufficient evidence".

Everyone knows PayPal is owned by eBay. But you seem to be of the misunderstanding, that all that can go through PayPal, are eBay transactions. PayPal can be used for absolutely anything, and the 'purchase' here was some sort of fee associated with an English School, based in West London. As PayPal is a conduit for transferring money, the audit trails are there. So, why lie to a customer when they could easily see from their audit trail that ?ú100k had mysteriously disappeared out of this companies account in the middle of the night?

What sort of operation are they running? Where's the checks and balances? There are none - absolutely none at all.

What you're saying doesn't prove that their eBay customer protection programme doesn't work. My mate's been through their customer protection programme. It really does protect you.
 
What you're saying doesn't prove that their eBay customer protection programme doesn't work. My mate's been through their customer protection programme. It really does protect you.

It proves that PayPal are a bunch of c??nts.

By the way, you DO realise that PayPal's much-vaunted 'protection programme' is wholly reliant on the other account actually having money in it? If someone scams you, but empties their PayPal account - then, sorry, but you're gonna be fudged - read the Terms & Conditions. PayPal can't debit any UK bank account to recover funds without authorisation; they'd be breaking the law otherwise.

It's very easy - too easy - to set-up an eBay account, and sell whatever the fudge you want. Likewise, piece of tinkle to set a PayPal address up and associate as many bank accounts with it as you want. Combine the two and WHOOSH, scam-ahoy!
 
It proves that PayPal are a bunch of c??nts.

By the way, you DO realise that PayPal's much-vaunted 'protection programme' is wholly reliant on the other account actually having money in it? If someone scams you, but empties their PayPal account - then, sorry, but you're gonna be fudged - read the Terms & Conditions. PayPal can't debit any UK bank account to recover funds without authorisation; they'd be breaking the law otherwise.

It's very easy - too easy - to set-up an eBay account, and sell whatever the fudge you want. Likewise, piece of tinkle to set a PayPal address up and associate as many bank accounts with it as you want. Combine the two and WHOOSH, scam-ahoy!

Yes but PayPal takes the legal route to recover the funds
 
It was a scam, now removed:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221004028869?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I've spent money on tons of fairly dodgy looking brick on ebay and only once ever been scammed. PayPal refunded me within about 10 days, BUT they seem to have a particular process that you have to follow to the letter for it to go through without problems.

IMO using PayPal for a physical object from eBay is safe, but as Sheikh says PayPal has inherent risks due to only being protected by an email / password (Though I think in time they would have refunded you, but how long can most people be without 5k!! Generally not weeks / months).
 
I don't know, but it seems to work for everyone else!

It doesn't.

The only 'legal' way PayPal can "recover the funds", is if misappropriated funds remain within PayPal's accounting system; it's merely a simple case of reassignment. However, if funds have been withdrawn and out of PayPal's accounting system, then PayPal cannot debit any UK bank account without prior consent.

The whole premise of their guarantee rests on whether the misappropriated funds are still there or not, hence their 'we will attempt to recover funds' wording. I also trust that you're aware that PayPal maintains a third-party clause which indemnifies them against responsibility?
 
It doesn't.

The only 'legal' way PayPal can "recover the funds", is if misappropriated funds remain within PayPal's accounting system; it's merely a simple case of reassignment. However, if funds have been withdrawn and out of PayPal's accounting system, then PayPal cannot debit any UK bank account without prior consent.

The whole premise of their guarantee rests on whether the misappropriated funds are still there or not, hence their 'we will attempt to recover funds' wording. I also trust that you're aware that PayPal maintains a third-party clause which indemnifies them against responsibility?

Yes, but there's a limit that once reached doesn't let you withdraw any more money, by which time a scammer becomes fudged.
 
My opinion only and not that of the board or it's owners, mods or admins is that eBay (and in turn PayPal) turns a blind eye to such a massive amount of fraud, law breaking and abuse of consumer rights that it's complicit by default. I've reported blatant law breaking and touting of tickets on there and not had so much as an acknowledgement of my email let alone the offending items taken down, but when eBay get a percentage of a massively inflated ticket price (1000% mark up) and Paypal get a cut of the payment in handling fees then they're going to turn a blind eye aren't they?
They won't do anything until the rights holders themselves complain, so if someone was selling knockoff Spurs kits, they wouldn't do a thing til Puma got on the phone. Seems bizarre to me that that's legal, considering they make money on each transaction as you say, but there you go.
 
They won't do anything until the rights holders themselves complain, so if someone was selling knockoff Spurs kits, they wouldn't do a thing til Puma got on the phone. Seems bizarre to me that that's legal, considering they make money on each transaction as you say, but there you go.

I've seen match tickets on there at ten times face value alerted ebay and they ignored my email and allowed the match tickets to sell, I don't know what their commission on a ?ú1000 transaction is plus paypal fees but I cannot see how they can knowingly break the law, make profit from it and say the rights holders didn't complain, it's against the law of the land rather than copyright theft to tout tickets. I even checked their own T&Cs forbidding the transaction at the time to ensure I wasn't wasting my time, the sale went ahead regardless. In short, I never spend more than the price of a round of drinks (about the amount of money I'm willing to write off) on ebay being as they're willing to turn a blind eye to criminal activity.
 
It was a scam, now removed:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221004028869?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I've spent money on tons of fairly dodgy looking brick on ebay and only once ever been scammed. PayPal refunded me within about 10 days, BUT they seem to have a particular process that you have to follow to the letter for it to go through without problems.

IMO using PayPal for a physical object from eBay is safe, but as Sheikh says PayPal has inherent risks due to only being protected by an email / password (Though I think in time they would have refunded you, but how long can most people be without 5k!! Generally not weeks / months).

No harm done
 
Back