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Daniel Levy - Former Chairman

SissokoWasGood (BoL) said:
I mean from the starting point that Levy took over, I would not have imagined us in the CL, let alone running to the final. I think it’s exceptional that we managed it while building the infrastructure at the same time.
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I get it, but I guess my point was that some of us have had to re-program our thoughts on UEFA comps more times than just ENIC and Levy joining Spurs. The changes to the UEFA comps have been astounding over time. I wouldn't have imagined us in the CL because there wasn't one. It was the European Cup and only league winners were in it. Our club loved and won the cup winners cup and always had a chance to be in the UEFA cup. You could always dream of winning them even if you doubted that you could win the league and go into the European Cup. It wasn't possible to do what Pool did and win the CL as a platform to go onto winning the PL the season after. It had to be the other way round.

My memory fades but I think you're only actually talking about a point in time where Utd, Pool, Arse and Chelsea were locked in to the CL. Once you were in the CL monies kept you in. That's when it was hard to believe any other team could break into that closed shop. Neutral fans hate City but in some ways it was the Sheikh's money, not us, that broke the traditional top 4. Pool went into free fall for a few years and we finished above them for about 5 years running. Arsenal dropped out eventually and Chelsea lost their stability under Abramovic especially when Jose was abusing club doctors publicly. Nowadays, Saudi Sportswashing Machine are joining the big 6 to make it a big 7 and of course we now get the 5th league place.

All through this time, Levy just kept his head and followed his plan of record. He was buying up land, developing the training ground and getting ready for the stadium build. That's why I mostly believed to be fair. I still pinch myself that we ended up in a CL final in 2019, when we had such a great team in 2016/17.
 
Muttley said:
I get it, but I guess my point was that some of us have had to re-program our thoughts on UEFA comps more times than just ENIC and Levy joining Spurs. The changes to the UEFA comps have been astounding over time. I wouldn't have imagined us in the CL because there wasn't one. It was the European Cup and only league winners were in it. Our club loved and won the cup winners cup and always had a chance to be in the UEFA cup. You could always dream of winning them even if you doubted that you could win the league and go into the European Cup. It wasn't possible to do what Pool did and win the CL as a platform to go onto winning the PL the season after. It had to be the other way round.

My memory fades but I think you're only actually talking about a point in time where Utd, Pool, Arse and Chelsea were locked in to the CL. Once you were in the CL monies kept you in. That's when it was hard to believe any other team could break into that closed shop. Neutral fans hate City but in some ways it was the Sheikh's money, not us, that broke the traditional top 4. Pool went into free fall for a few years and we finished above them for about 5 years running. Arsenal dropped out eventually and Chelsea lost their stability under Abramovic especially when Jose was abusing club doctors publicly. Nowadays, Saudi Sportswashing Machine are joining the big 6 to make it a big 7 and of course we now get the 5th league place.

All through this time, Levy just kept his head and followed his plan of record. He was buying up land, developing the training ground and getting ready for the stadium build. That's why I mostly believed to be fair. I still pinch myself that we ended up in a CL final in 2019, when we had such a great team in 2016/17.
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Think the lads on the pod were spot on when they say we're the only team to break into that "top 4" with any consistency without huge outside investment in the team or nearly bankrupting ourselves in the process.

The "top 4" isn't as locked in as it once looked, it's more in flux and there's more teams closer to that level. But getting consistent CL is no easier now than it was then. And to me at least if we want to maximise our chances of trophies that's the level we need to be aiming at first.
 
braineclipse said:
So that nuance, looking at other things in addition to trophies is valid for players, coaches and managers, but not chairmen in your opinion?
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I wasn't talking about the chairman. I was talking about the club as an institution.

The chairman is NOT the club. It was here before Levy and it's still here after Levy.
 
Bishop said:
I wasn't talking about the chairman. I was talking about the club as an institution.

The chairman is NOT the club. It was here before Levy and it's still here after Levy.
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OK. I thought when you quoted what I said about Levy in the Levy thread the point you were making was related to the conversation about Levy.
 
braineclipse said:
OK. I thought when you quoted what I said about Levy in the Levy thread the point you were making was related to the conversation about Levy.
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I did specifically say the club, and not the chairman. I was responding generically to the talk of what success for a football team actually is.

If we are talking about the chairman and success or not, I'd place it similarly to the coaches or managers. Some good moments and progression with limited success. For me success would be tangible results on the pitch, competitions won first, achievements next and progression curves after that. We've done alright under him, recovered our position after the horrible 90s. There was progression until there wasn't, but my issues with Levy have always been to do with decision making and strategy. Too often we've not pushed on team wise when the opportunities presented themselves. Too often with jumped from one football identity to another and those are the things I have issue with. Even financial strategy itself doesn't bother me as such, I'm happy going for young and unproven players, but there's a way to do it and we have rarely followed cogently.
 
braineclipse said:
Think the lads on the pod were spot on when they say we're the only team to break into that "top 4" with any consistency without huge outside investment in the team or nearly bankrupting ourselves in the process.

The "top 4" isn't as locked in as it once looked, it's more in flux and there's more teams closer to that level. But getting consistent CL is no easier now than it was then. And to me at least if we want to maximise our chances of trophies that's the level we need to be aiming at first.
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Agree, I've always encouraged Spurs fans to look at what happened at other clubs when we've been fortunate enough to get into the CL. Most of the time, something about the other top 5 clubs has been very sub-optimal.

Great example is in 09/10 when Crouchy's goal against City got us 4th place. City with their new owners were on the up-and-up and won the league within 2 seasons. That season Pool were 7th, their lowest finish in 11 years and the end of the Rafa years. So out of a new top 6, 2 of the teams left the door open. We took advantage.

Another great example is Jose losing the changing room with the club doctor business. They finished on 50 points that season. They won it with 93 points the following season under Conte.

I think it is even more competitive now. There are no guarantees but what I would encourage us to get the defence tight and achieve 70 points or more. If you don't do that, you're not even in the race.
 
Grays_1890 said:
We had success but it wasn't dynasty

My old man said to me when I was old enough to listen and get the game "Spurs is about great players at the wrong times and sometimes its the right time, we won't ever win league titles but we might when the odd cup, prepare to be disappointed more than ecstatic" you know when he said that early 1986, you know the first season I watched and understood..........1986/197 and never were his words truer and was he right for the next 40 odd years??? You bethca he was. But I fell in love with that side, Waddle, Gough, Allen, I never looked at then as great failures. The side that had Gazza take us to a final (us underdogs BTW, see it can happen if players take us over the line) get crocked and then us win anyway. Fell in love with the style and the flair, being the underdogs versus Chelsea and winning the LC, wouldn't swap it for anything.

Yes its about striving to win things BUT lets not pretend we are a dynasty and lets not pretend we are players, managers or owners, we are fans, and for some of us our support is not a contract based of success, for many its much much much more than that.

This clubs owes me nothing, thats why I don't stamp my feet when we are not successful, jealousy also isn't something I do in football, I don't covert to be Arsenal or Chelsea........thats their journey not mine. I wouldn't swap seeing our fans and our players in our badge lift last years trophy and swap it with Romans Chelsea haul..........people can say what they like about that, but its 100% true. No more than I would change the 80s and change it with Liverpool, Forest of Evertons..........so why would I now

The reason I dislike CFT more than the hypocrisy, the 12 year old scribed PR is being a fan should come with a level of siege mentality, we seemingly have lost that and to go out 3 months after winning a major trophy with banners of "profit over glory". When a new manager has come in with new players, when we should be all in and united. That's more embarrassing that anything the clubs done in the last 25 years. As fans we should be ferociously trying to suck the ball into the net and get behind the team. Instead we spend half our time giving other clubs and fans and now the media ammunition through the sheer embarrassment of a section of our fan base and moaning "I can't possibly sing and get behind the club in this new stadium"

If you are deluded enough to think you have the influence to remove a Chairman, MAYBE just Maybe that influence is best used on the team..............No?
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I tip my hat to you, that is a GREAT post. 👏
 
Muttley said:
I get it, but I guess my point was that some of us have had to re-program our thoughts on UEFA comps more times than just ENIC and Levy joining Spurs. The changes to the UEFA comps have been astounding over time. I wouldn't have imagined us in the CL because there wasn't one. It was the European Cup and only league winners were in it. Our club loved and won the cup winners cup and always had a chance to be in the UEFA cup. You could always dream of winning them even if you doubted that you could win the league and go into the European Cup. It wasn't possible to do what Pool did and win the CL as a platform to go onto winning the PL the season after. It had to be the other way round.

My memory fades but I think you're only actually talking about a point in time where Utd, Pool, Arse and Chelsea were locked in to the CL. Once you were in the CL monies kept you in. That's when it was hard to believe any other team could break into that closed shop. Neutral fans hate City but in some ways it was the Sheikh's money, not us, that broke the traditional top 4. Pool went into free fall for a few years and we finished above them for about 5 years running. Arsenal dropped out eventually and Chelsea lost their stability under Abramovic especially when Jose was abusing club doctors publicly. Nowadays, Saudi Sportswashing Machine are joining the big 6 to make it a big 7 and of course we now get the 5th league place.

All through this time, Levy just kept his head and followed his plan of record. He was buying up land, developing the training ground and getting ready for the stadium build. That's why I mostly believed to be fair. I still pinch myself that we ended up in a CL final in 2019, when we had such a great team in 2016/17.
Click to expand...

Sure, I think I’m agreeing with everything you say. I think my Spurs fandom started in 1995, so I just missed the 80s, and my experience was just that we didn’t have nice things. From that base, getting us into a CL final while building the infrastructure, I would say is a crazily good achievement from DL.
 
SissokoWasGood (BoL) said:
Sure, I think I’m agreeing with everything you say. I think my Spurs fandom started in 1995, so I just missed the 80s, and my experience was just that we didn’t have nice things. From that base, getting us into a CL final while building the infrastructure, I would say is a crazily good achievement from DL.
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I hope you're right. There is a big part of me that thinks that despite the 2 cup runs in 2019 and 2025, they never saw Levy create a consistent football club. If you're sitting back in the Bahamas and tracking all our league finishes and managerial changes in these past 5 or 6 years then you're probably building a non-favourable picture in your head of Levy. They would never be as intimately familiar with every left or right turn the club made on and off the pitch as even we are. They wouldn't be able to see the reasons why Levy's leadership may not have been the root cause. Business people can be really tough.
 
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