For the umptenth time I did not call you an idiot. Sheesh.
Perhaps conspiracy nut is the best thing to call you
LOL I'm not insulted anyway dude!
It's just an emotional response your brain makes when you don't want to hear someone elses beliefs.
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A Funny Thing Happened On The Way To The Moon
- Thread starter Gifter
- Start date
LOL I'm not insulted anyway dude!
It's just an emotional response your brain makes when you don't want to hear someone elses beliefs.
No idea, but playing devils advocate, they could have launched a secondary at the same time from another, remote, launch site.
Going to have a look at the clip you posted later.
Or, perhaps the honest people, who are made to go along with it, purposely let things slip into the public domain.
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
Missing the point yet again. Clearly you were insulted hence your little hissy fit.
I have no issue with your beliefs, the ones I might agree with or the ones I think are fantasy. Unsurprisingly that brings no emotional response from me at all.
braineclipse
Willie Hall
And that would again mean an additional ground crew...
braineclipse
Willie Hall
That would still require the conspirators to let evidence that they had under their control and knew could contain evidence of the conspiracy get away from them...
milo
Jack L. Jones
Exactly
Quite right, point acceded.
braineclipse
Willie Hall
Low earth orbit - considered to be 200-2000km.
Here is a picture of earth from Suomi NPP at 500Miles
At the risk of sounding like an arrogant bastard - thanks. That was very helpful, saved me attempting that pesky math I talked about earlier.
From what I can see that is the exact same image found here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/gsfc/6760135001
Quote: A 'Blue Marble' image of the Earth taken from the VIIRS instrument aboard NASA's most recently launched Earth-observing satellite - Suomi NPP. This composite image uses a number of swaths of the Earth's surface taken on January 4, 2012.
There is a link to an explanation of the process here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/gsfc/6803619953/
Quote: The Suomi NPP satellite is in a polar orbit around Earth at an altitude of 512 miles (about 824 kilometers), but the perspective of the new Eastern hemisphere 'Blue Marble' is from 7,918 miles (about 12,743 kilometers). NASA scientist Norman Kuring managed to 'step back' from Earth to get the big picture by combining data from six different orbits of the Suomi NPP satellite. Or putting it a different way, the satellite flew above this area of Earth six times over an eight hour time period. Norman took those six sets of data and combined them into one image.
A bit further down that page the maths-saving helpful comparison comes up:
Using a basketball you can get a good idea of how far away the Suomi NPP satellite is from Earth. Take a basketball that has a diameter of 10 inches (about 25 centimeters) and say that's 'Earth.' (For the record, Earth has a diameter of about 7,926 miles (about 12,756 kilometers)).
So to get the same view of Earth as the VIIRS instrument aboard the Suomi NPP satellite, hold the basketball five-eighth of an inch (about one-and-a-half centimeters) away from your face.
I would think that makes the entire point in the video a moot one (that is me being polite). That clearly wasn't filmed from low earth orbit. Especially not while meters back from a rather small window!
To say that their mistake was a basic one would in my opinion be an understatement. Imagine the reaction from the conspiracy side if someone from NASA had made a mistake like that, how much would it hurt their reputation? How long would a documentary maker (again, polite) rant about something like that?
These are the people you're getting your information from. It might surprise you that they get stuff spectacularly wrong like this, to me it seems more like par for the course.
braineclipse
Willie Hall
Please, explain to me how you think they could have taken any image of the entire earth from low earth orbit without a massive wide angle lens. Then explain to me how they would use a massive wide angle lens through a small window while several meters away.
If not then I think it raises more than just "a good counter".
Again, what would the reaction be towards NASA if they made a mistake like that and then had to make a retraction? "Sorry, we didn't mean low earth orbit." Although I would have accepted a statement like that from these guys, it would be progress. It would indicate at least a smidgeon of intellectual honesty.
This to me goes a bit further than just "shouldn't have said low earth orbit".
One of the things they seem to go on about is the Van Allen radiation belts. Now, if Wikipedia is trustworthy then: The inner electron Van Allen Belt extends typically from an altitude of 1.2 to 3 Earth radii (L values of 1 to 3). Another source would be The Britannica, that says: The inner region is centred approximately 3,000 km (1,860 miles) above the terrestrial surface. We have already learned that the diameter of the earth is "about 12,756 kilometers" of course.
Seeing as the perspective from the image above is said to be from about 12,743 kilometers I would claim that to get the kind of footage they showed from the space craft it wouldn't be enough to be above low earth orbit, you would probably also have to be going into the Van Allen belt at the very least. I say "probably" because I once again can't be bothered to do any actual math myself.
Once again, these are the people you're getting your information from. And since the motivation of The US and NASA came up earlier, what is the motivation for these conspiracy theorists? Well, getting to make documentaries for Fox (wasn't it Fox you said?) would be one I suppose, a quick search on Amazon for Moon landing hoax books would reveal another, I'm guessing they do seminars, talks and so on as well. I have no problems with people making money off their ideas of course, but when they are making money off it, and their ideas have gaping holes in them like these ones I struggle to take them seriously. This was even the part of this film you thought were interesting while you accepted that there were other parts that were far from as convincing as this one (that I think is putting it mildly).
Well I'm struggling with it, so maybe the documentary got that wrong (on how they were faking it), and instead they were inserting an image of the earth into the window and it was this that they were staging, I know (to my mind) that staging was happening though, whatever it was that was going on. When they removed whatever it was in the window it sure glared the window up though, showing without doubt to my mind that they were in low earth orbit.
I've just been watching another documentary on it, sorry it is going to annoy you that this goes off on another tangent!
Did you know that ALL the telemetry records have been 'mislaid'. This is NASA, so the scientific recordings of mankinds greatest scientific feat have been mislaid?!
Also most of the key scientific staff were brought to the US from Germany after WWII in project paperclip;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wernher_von_Braun These were a set of scientists whose moral compass is way below questionable, who, should have been imprisoned on war crimes in alot of cases, so they had direct vested interest in achieving the goals of the mission by any means possible.
Von Braun was the head of the Apollo Missions, he went to Antartica two years before, where there just so happens to be meteorites which are proven to be from the moon (which are easiest to find there against white backgrounds). Why did he go to antartica whilst he should have been overseeing the preparation for mankinds greatest feat?
Of course, none of this proves they didn't go, but the oddities just stack up and up.
Aron Ranen's - Did We Go?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gM3Mt1Vym3g
Ranen claims he believed we went and set out to prove it, but I'm not sure that is the case, either way he just meets blank after blank when looking for proof.
yiddo2786
Steed Malbranque
This is a fantastic quote for conspiracy theorists.
Actually, I just studied the video again and again, please pause it at 7:43 (you may have to pause and unpause quickly)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P--LtfuzX8M&feature=player_embedded#!
You can see just the edge of earth IMO;
View attachment 672
Now I'm glad you pushed for this, as I am sure you could see it from memory (as said, when I watched it first it was on a DVD quality download on my TV).
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Gifter said:
Why? rounded enough to not claim circumstancial evidence as proof, yes I agree.
spursman17
Stephen Kelly
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Laser_Ranging_experiment
This was what the Russians used to confirm whether they did actually land or not, and of course would have monitored their every move during the trip anyways to rule out foul play, being a space race and all...
braineclipse
Willie Hall
How do you know? Do you have a time link to the happening in the video that proved to you that they were in low earth orbit?
Wasn't that the best part of the documentary? And maybe they got it wrong? Do you have some other evidence? Again, what is the (in your opinion) best available evidence?
I'm not interested in a long list of evidence where we go from one point to another or a long list of circumstantial evidence and speculation. Bring the best evidence and look at things one part at the time. Otherwise you just end up believing anything that anyone can list up a lot of half arsed evidence for. This is not a way to truth.
All? Source please?
From what I can see only tapes from Apollo 11 were missing? That would still leave the tapes from the other moon landings. I agree that the misplacing, and likely erasing of those tapes was a terrible mistake. Really shouldn't have happened.
I really struggle to get from "Scientists should have been put in prison, were given jobs instead" to "Moon landing was a hoax". Scientists in many fields were taken from Germany to many countries including the US after that war. I did know that. Classic "greater good" scenario imo, completely unsurprising that governments would do just that to me at least. I also struggle to see how scientists in areas such as rocket science would deserve punishment for war crimes? Mengele? Sure! But war crimes aren't based on if you're on the winning or losing side, if German scientists that developed weapons should have been tried for war crimes so should American and British scientists. Read the passage about him in Germany from the Wiki link. Impossible to know of course, but his side of the story seems reasonable to me. If you think those scientists were the ones directly responsible for the slave labor camps then fair enough, but for better or worse scientists are not normally put in charge of running the factories.
The article also seems to explain why he would go to Antarctica, seems completely reasonable and valid to me. Again the conspiracy theorists act like nothing more than anomaly hunters, had the story panned out otherwise we might have seen the argument:
1. The best rocket engineers in the world were available in Germany after the war. Why didn't The US government get these people to The US if they were serious about going to the moon? Clearly they didn't actually plan on going there.
2. Some of the most important research on habitation, research and logistics happened in Antarctica at the time, yet the director of the Apollo program never went there. Maybe because none of this was needed since no one was going to the moon? *cue dramatic music*
Anyone can make up stories like these about just about anything on just about any topic. I don't see how it's relevant for either position.
Of course there are oddities. Thousands of people watching hundreds, if not thousands of hours of video footage, thousands of interviews and thousands of pictures. Add some below average physics knowledge and a feeling that something is wrong and you get oddities. Anomaly hunting it's called. This is the expected result, it's seen time and time again.
Again, your best piece of evidence? Anything that hasn't been countered? Any argument that actually stands on it's own two feet?
Wasn't that the best part of the documentary? And maybe they got it wrong? Do you have some other evidence? Again, what is the (in your opinion) best available evidence?
I'm not interested in a long list of evidence where we go from one point to another or a long list of circumstantial evidence and speculation. Bring the best evidence and look at things one part at the time. Otherwise you just end up believing anything that anyone can list up a lot of half arsed evidence for. This is not a way to truth.
All? Source please?
From what I can see only tapes from Apollo 11 were missing? That would still leave the tapes from the other moon landings. I agree that the misplacing, and likely erasing of those tapes was a terrible mistake. Really shouldn't have happened.
I really struggle to get from "Scientists should have been put in prison, were given jobs instead" to "Moon landing was a hoax". Scientists in many fields were taken from Germany to many countries including the US after that war. I did know that. Classic "greater good" scenario imo, completely unsurprising that governments would do just that to me at least. I also struggle to see how scientists in areas such as rocket science would deserve punishment for war crimes? Mengele? Sure! But war crimes aren't based on if you're on the winning or losing side, if German scientists that developed weapons should have been tried for war crimes so should American and British scientists. Read the passage about him in Germany from the Wiki link. Impossible to know of course, but his side of the story seems reasonable to me. If you think those scientists were the ones directly responsible for the slave labor camps then fair enough, but for better or worse scientists are not normally put in charge of running the factories.
The article also seems to explain why he would go to Antarctica, seems completely reasonable and valid to me. Again the conspiracy theorists act like nothing more than anomaly hunters, had the story panned out otherwise we might have seen the argument:
1. The best rocket engineers in the world were available in Germany after the war. Why didn't The US government get these people to The US if they were serious about going to the moon? Clearly they didn't actually plan on going there.
2. Some of the most important research on habitation, research and logistics happened in Antarctica at the time, yet the director of the Apollo program never went there. Maybe because none of this was needed since no one was going to the moon? *cue dramatic music*
Anyone can make up stories like these about just about anything on just about any topic. I don't see how it's relevant for either position.
Of course there are oddities. Thousands of people watching hundreds, if not thousands of hours of video footage, thousands of interviews and thousands of pictures. Add some below average physics knowledge and a feeling that something is wrong and you get oddities. Anomaly hunting it's called. This is the expected result, it's seen time and time again.
Again, your best piece of evidence? Anything that hasn't been countered? Any argument that actually stands on it's own two feet?