Kyle Walker

[DubaiSpur]

I'm not sure what the issue is then if you agree that he should have been sold to City in those circumstances - it's just something we have to deal with when it happens

I agree he should have been sold to City - but I can't pretend that it doesn't set a precedent that will be used against us in future transfer moves by our domestic rivals. Which is why I can empathize with JJ's point. I also think we can mitigate that by winning things - cups, pots and pans of all kinds.

 

[Robspur12]

This ...

I don't want to play the doom card, was plenty of that every time we lost particular players/managers in the last 7-10 years and we have managed and progressed.

But .. there is a growing pressure to validate that progress by winning something, and the argument to keep players would be significantly easier if we did.

That task is harder each time we sell key players though....

 

[SpurMeUp]

Regarding the best player thing, it's all relative. He may not score as many goals as Kane and Alli, pass as well as Eriksen or defend as well as Alderweireld but he is a better full back than any of them, and probably better than we can find now with our financial constraints on the market.

Put it this way, would have preferred we'd have sold any of them over Walker?

Walker developed and will go on to be very decent under Pep. But his success is founded on his athleticism, rather than technical ability. I think there is more to come from him, but not much more. He's not THAT effective in an attacking sense, but of course we will miss him. I get your point it weakens us. But it doesn't weaken us as in days gone by when we sold Modric and Bale imo.

Remember the goal Walker scored in the Fabrice Maumamber game? It never counted, but was a sweet strike. He is capable of scoring more and maybe will at city. Yes we're weaker now, but it was an okay move for all parties, especially if we take on 2 quality additions. The Port u Geezer and another attacking midfield player.


Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app

 

[billyiddo]

I agree he should have been sold to City - but I can't pretend that it doesn't set a precedent that will be used against us in future transfer moves by our domestic rivals. Which is why I can empathize with JJ's point. I also think we can mitigate that by winning things - cups, pots and pans of all kinds.

We'll only keep players happy by winning leagues and being able to pay them the money our rivals can - which is what we're trying to do, but right now we're not in that position so there's not a lot we can do about it.

 

[Robspur12]

We'll only keep players happy by winning leagues and being able to pay them the money our rivals can - which is what we're trying to do, but right now we're not in that position so there's not a lot we can do about it.

He signed a new contract at Spurs only a few months ago. He really can't have been that "unhappy" at Spurs.

 

[DubaiSpur]

We'll only keep players happy by winning leagues and being able to pay them the money our rivals can - which is what we're trying to do, but right now we're not in that position so there's not a lot we can do about it

I disagree. If we pursue league titles, fall flat on our bottoms and end up empty-handed with naught but 3rd/4th places and runners-up finishes to show for it, it will have been the greatest waste of potential in this club's history. Winning cups will mitigate that possibility, and show players that we can give them medals too - for many players, that will be a step up from *no medals*, which is our present state. The league title can come later. Winning things *now* to forestall being pressed for moves by players using the 'I want to win things' excuse (as Walker has just done in his first City interview) is, imo, more important.

 

[Robspur12]

I disagree. If we pursue league titles, fall flat on our bottoms and end up empty-handed with naught but 3rd/4th places and runners-up finishes to show for it, it will have been the greatest waste of potential in this club's history. Winning cups will mitigate that possibility, and show players that we can give them medals too - for many players, that will be a step up from *no medals*, which is our present state. The league title can come later. Winning things *now* to forestall being pressed for moves by players using the 'I want to win things' excuse (as Walker has just done in his first City interview) is, imo, more important.

He's not going there to win the League Cup though. Simply they have the resources to win the big titles; namely the Pl and Champs league.

 

[DubaiSpur]

He's not going there to win the League Cup though. Simply they have the resources to win the big titles; namely the Pl and Champs league.

Doesn't really matter. A sold player saying "I've moved on to win *bigger* things" (i.e, the PL and CL) would actually represent a better position for the club in that it acknowledges that we at least win things, even if they're not as prestigious. It is a step up from "I've moved on to win *things*", which is indicative of our general lack of success at winning anything whatsoever over ENIC's tenure, 2008 aside. And that step up might be the difference that keeps some players here.

 

[milo]

I agree he should have been sold to City - but I can't pretend that it doesn't set a precedent that will be used against us in future transfer moves by our domestic rivals. Which is why I can empathize with JJ's point. I also think we can mitigate that by winning things - cups, pots and pans of all kinds.

I don't see how it can be used against us. Walker was sold because the manager wanted him gone. All of our players are on long contracts. It is difficult to force our hand and even if a player's head is turned, I cannot think of many occasions where we have not sold on our terms.

 

[billyiddo]

I disagree. If we pursue league titles, fall flat on our bottoms and end up empty-handed with naught but 3rd/4th places and runners-up finishes to show for it, it will have been the greatest waste of potential in this club's history. Winning cups will mitigate that possibility, and show players that we can give them medals too - for many players, that will be a step up from *no medals*, which is our present state. The league title can come later. Winning things *now* to forestall being pressed for moves by players using the 'I want to win things' excuse (as Walker has just done in his first City interview) is, imo, more important.

I'm not interested in getting in to that side of the debate again tbh mate my point was more that you seem to agree in this situation we should be selling Walker to City but at the same time you are complaining about it as well - it doesn't make sense to me is all

 

[milo]

Doesn't really matter. A sold player saying "I've moved on to win *bigger* things" (i.e, the PL and CL) would actually represent a better position for the club in that it acknowledges that we at least win things, even if they're not as prestigious. It is a step up from "I've moved on to win *things*", which is indicative of our general lack of success at winning anything whatsoever over ENIC's tenure, 2008 aside. And that step up might be the difference that keeps some players here.

Players are always going to talk up their new club. City certainly have the money to build a league winning side but they looked well short of it last season and Pep has never had to do a job like this before.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I'm not interested in getting in to that side of the debate again tbh mate my point was more that you seem to agree in this situation we should be selling Walker to City but you'really also are complaining about it as well - it doesn't make sense to me is all

Well, I'm not. I empathize with JJ's point, is all - other than that, not much to complain about. I did have a brewing funk going over City's assertion that they'd bought him for 45m + 5m in addons, but apparently Walker's agents have come out and said that it's 54m (45 + 5 next year + 4m in add-ons), so it's still a world-record fee.

I don't see how it can be used against us. Walker was sold because the manager wanted him gone. All of our players are on long contracts. It is difficult to force our hand and even if a player's head is turned, I cannot think of many occasions where we have not sold on our terms.

Doesn't matter. If a player's head is turned by a domestic rival, and we refuse that player a move to said domestic rival, they will point to Walker and say 'you let him go to a domestic rival - I want the same'. Difficult to argue against that, even if Poch did want him sold.

 

[Rorschach]

Try saying that after a few drinks

I never back down from a challenge. Let me get ready.

 

[billyiddo]

Well, I'm not. I empathize with JJ's point, is all - other than that, not much to complain about. I did have a brewing funk going over City's assertion that they'd sold for 45m + 5m in addons, but apparently Walker's agents have come out and said that it's 54m (45 + 5 next year + 4m in add-ons), so it's still a world-record fee.



Doesn't matter. If a player's head is turned by a domestic rival, and we refuse that player a move to said domestic rival, they will point to Walker and say 'you let him go to a domestic rival - I want the same'. Difficult to argue against that, even if Poch did want him sold.

Afaic I know and accept our position in the food chain and know that until we can pay the money our rivals do there's not much we can do about having players getting their heads turned - we could win cups and titles every season but as long as our players can get paid two/three times as much elsewhere, some of them will still want to leave - that's just how it is. Dortmund lose players to Munich even when they pip them to the title and if PSG wanted players from Monaco they could take them with ease, the only clubs which don't lose players to rivals are ones that can match them financially...

 

[parklane1]

This ...

I don't want to play the doom card, was plenty of that every time we lost particular players/managers in the last 7-10 years and we have managed and progressed.

But .. there is a growing pressure to validate that progress by winning something, and the argument to keep players would be significantly easier if we did.

I really believe its something we have to do this season, its all right saying we are progressing ( and without a doubt we are) but unless we do win a trophy this year i fear it will lead to others leaving next season. Now i have said this before a couple of times and got stick for it but finishing in the top four but winning nothing is not likely to keep our players for ever.

 

[Baleforce]

Yes but that would be life changing most likely. I can't believe that anyone who earns over £80,000 per week really has their life changed by earning £180,000. Not in the same way at least. After all Walker can likely afford all the things that he would want.

the number is irrelevant

 

[milo]

Doesn't matter. If a player's head is turned by a domestic rival, and we refuse that player a move to said domestic rival, they will point to Walker and say 'you let him go to a domestic rival - I want the same'. Difficult to argue against that, even if Poch did want him sold.

But that doesn't force us to sell. We can just say that "we wanted to sell Walker and were offered a world record fee for a defender. Now about that four years remaining on your contract..."

 

[parklane1]

the number is irrelevant

It really is, i have not met many folks over the years who do not want to make/earn more money ( regardless of how much they are earning)

 

[Spur of the moment]

I really believe its something we have to do this season, its all right saying we are progressing ( and without a doubt we are) but unless we do win a trophy this year i fear it will lead to others leaving next season. Now i have said this before a couple of times and got stick for it but finishing in the top four but winning nothing is not likely to keep our players for ever.

In the recent past it was okay to finish top four without landing silverware but that has now changed dramatically imv. The landscape has changed, it's now imperative that we win at least one big trophy this coming season. But as I have said before I very much doubt a mere domestic cup would be enough to do the trick.

 

[DubaiSpur]

But that doesn't force us to sell. We can just say that "we wanted to sell Walker and were offered a world record fee for a defender. Now about that four years remaining on your contract..."

"Fine, you wanted a world record transfer fee to consider a domestic deal. United are offering 120m pounds for me, Dele Alli - a world record. Now let me go - Kyle had four(?) years on his contract and you let *him* go."