Tottenham vs Scum COC OMT

[Huddy]

Having spent 48 hours to digest the defeat I feel on balance of play we should have won the game, unfortunately individual mistakes cost us.

I have two points I question from Poch, firstly his choice of Vorm in goal, the guy had one good season at Swansea before his form dropped or most likely returned to its natural level, at which point he then sat on the bench until he joined us. I just don't rate the guys shot stopping ability.

Secondly our lack of clear chances / shots on goal. This season we seem to be playing a defensive version of the 4-2-3-1 and its isolating Kane too much, evident with the Arsenal game. This might be a choice by Poch to prevent us from being to open at the back like last season, but it seems to be hindering our attacking play.

The team that went out the other night were clearly up for the game, but I don't think tactically we have the right balance yet.

 

[90291Spur]

Still find it annoying that Pochettino rested so many players against Ar5ena1. Would have preferred us to play our best 11 against Ar5ena1 and rest players against ManCity instead. Frankly, just can't see us beating ManCity even with our best 11. They are in great form this season despite losing to West Ham last week.

I think it is a real disgrace for us to disregard any Cup despite only winning 2 trophies in 16 years.

I think it reflects the priorities of the Club, which in modern football seldom mesh with the priorities of the fans. MOST fans would prefer to beat The Scum and have the chance of a cup final, while the team selection for the Goon game suggested a different priority.

 

[thfcsteff]

I have no problem with finishing 6th this season, however I do believe we could win a trophy but we will not do so if we field a team with 6 reserves in the remaining trophys.

For me, if this is the case but the return is we get a squad where everyone can step up and play their part thus hopefully getting more silverware in the coming season(s) I will take it. But it does come down to whether people feel we are on the right track or not.

 

[thfcsteff]

I've come to the conclusion that the same people that don't give a **** about the NLD are the ones that expect us to get 4th.
Emirates Marketing Project on Saturday is just another league game no different than Stoke or Saudi Sportswashing Machine.
If we take points off them its no different than taking points off Stoke or Saudi Sportswashing Machine. City will be the usual 15 points ahead of us at the end of the season.

That is the wrong conclusion in my case. I will speak only for myself here, but my desire long-term, is to have a squad that can dominate cups like this whatever members in the 25 are out there, that can regularly play in the CL and that sees our long-term health in great shape. Oh, and can I make a general request for people to dignify themselves and not throw out the 'don't give a fudge about the NLD'? Just because I didn't feel cheated/slighted/that Poch is a clam who doesn't understand the club/go incandescent with rage on the internet, it does not equate to that (frankly) insulting and myopic phrase. Not just you mate, there have been a few throwing it around. as I always say in these situations, we should never say things on the web we wouldn't say to each other...

 

[thfcsteff]

I think it reflects the priorities of the Club, which in modern football seldom mesh with the priorities of the fans. MOST fans would prefer to beat The Scum and have the chance of a cup final, while the team selection for the Goon game suggested a different priority.

But what part of 'developing a squad which can all play at the same level' doesn't click for people mate? And would this discussion be happening if Kane's superb shot had gone in? Funnily enough, for all the tacticians out there, I am amazed no-one has picked up on Poch's biggest mistake of the night in-game, which was replacing Townsend when he had 'found' the match and was an influence. Would also have been helpful with Sanchez.

 

[Modric THFC]

That is the wrong conclusion in my case. I will speak only for myself here, but my desire long-term, is to have a squad that can dominate cups like this whatever members in the 25 are out there, that can regularly play in the CL and that sees our long-term health in great shape. Oh, and can I make a general request for people to dignify themselves and not throw out the 'don't give a fudge about the NLD'? Just because I didn't feel cheated/slighted/that Poch is a clam who doesn't understand the club/go incandescent with rage on the internet, it does not equate to that (frankly) insulting and myopic phrase. Not just you mate, there have been a few throwing it around. as I always say in these situations, we should never say things on the web we wouldn't say to each other...

Fair enough "'don't give a fudge about the NLD" might have been a bit insulting.
I'd be interested to see the results of a poll of which game people think was more important.

 

[90291Spur]

But what part of 'developing a squad which can all play at the same level' doesn't click for people mate? And would this discussion be happening if Kane's superb shot had gone in? Funnily enough, for all the tacticians out there, I am amazed no-one has picked up on Poch's biggest mistake of the night in-game, which was replacing Townsend when he had 'found' the match and was an influence. Would also have been helpful with Sanchez.

I can only guess the part of wanting to beat The Scum more than anything else. The Guardian article about the situation Poch is in has been posted in other threads - http://www.theguardian.com/football...o-tottenham-spurs-daniel-levy-manchester-city - and I think that's what we saw on Wednesday. Develop the younger players and give fringe players competitive minutes so they can improve.

 

[thfcsteff]

Fair enough "'don't give a fudge about the NLD" might have been a bit insulting.
I'd be interested to see the results of a poll of which game people think was more important.

You're not the only onto have said what you said mate, and I appreciate the emotion...again, and I can only speak for myself, I took the view in August that this season was about building and had already given over to the concept of not winning a pot/top 6-7 finish as long as there was overall progress in the shape of the squad and club. It has been a massive job to get to where we are. I don't think people get it. All those fat wages previous 'short-termer' stuck us with slowed progress down for a while. Shifting the dead0weight this season has been an immense achievement. Getting Kaboul, Crapoue, Ade out of the club is massive. Lennon is sad, because he would've fitted this system but off the field it wasn't happening despite repeated efforts. There is an attempt to shift our culture from the youth system up, and if we can get the likes of Winks and Pritchard in-flow this season, I will be delighted. Any game against those tossers is big, but what I don't understand mate, is that we played very very well and were unlucky! Yes, Vorm is not up to it, but we haven't played our first-choice keeper in this tournament for years. Ditto Europa. Countless others did the rotation, yet Poch gets the savaging despite the good performance. It is, for me, short-sighted. For me. It doesn't mean I 'don't give a fudge' and if some posters find this viewpoint 'disgusting' as was suggested in another thread, then fantastic, enjoy that absurd comment and sentiment.

It's been a shame here this week. A few 'GG friendships' have taken a large knock. Hopefully it will all get back on track. I suppose this is the internet though right, and sometimes, people throw brick out there that would be unacceptable in person.

COYS.

 

[thfcsteff]

I can only guess the part of wanting to beat The Scum more than anything else. The Guardian article about the situation Poch is in has been posted in other threads - http://www.theguardian.com/football...o-tottenham-spurs-daniel-levy-manchester-city - and I think that's what we saw on Wednesday. Develop the younger players and give fringe players competitive minutes so they can improve.

Right. I've been saying this. And getting battered for it by a couple of people. Because one day, I want 25 players who can come in and beat them regularly, not 11. We are close. We were unlucky on Wednesday, something which appears to have been forgotten in the rush to explain to the universe why this manager doesn't get the club.

 

[90291Spur]

Right. I've been saying this. And getting battered for it by a couple of people. Because one day, I want 25 players who can come in and beat them regularly, not 11. We are close. We were unlucky on Wednesday, something which appears to have been forgotten in the rush to explain to the universe why this manager doesn't get the club.

Steff, you and I seem to share a similar history with this glorious club (I just re-watched the highlights of our '84 UEFA cup win and got a chill) and it is very frustrating to be in yet another re-grouping period. We are in an age where so many people seek instant gratification and we also have to react to agendas hidden by the Club. Of course Levy/Poch are not going to publicly state what the Club has planned for the next 1/3/5 years. Of course Poch isn't going to field a 'weakened' team for the CoC against the Goons and say that this is not a targeted competition. And there will always be a split between those of us who want to see silverware and those of us who want to finish, a solidify, a top 4 finish.

COYS!

 

[Papercut]

You're not the only onto have said what you said mate, and I appreciate the emotion...again, and I can only speak for myself, I took the view in August that this season was about building and had already given over to the concept of not winning a pot/top 6-7 finish as long as there was overall progress in the shape of the squad and club. It has been a massive job to get to where we are. I don't think people get it. All those fat wages previous 'short-termer' stuck us with slowed progress down for a while. Shifting the dead0weight this season has been an immense achievement. Getting Kaboul, Crapoue, Ade out of the club is massive. Lennon is sad, because he would've fitted this system but off the field it wasn't happening despite repeated efforts. There is an attempt to shift our culture from the youth system up, and if we can get the likes of Winks and Pritchard in-flow this season, I will be delighted. Any game against those tossers is big, but what I don't understand mate, is that we played very very well and were unlucky! Yes, Vorm is not up to it, but we haven't played our first-choice keeper in this tournament for years. Ditto Europa. Countless others did the rotation, yet Poch gets the savaging despite the good performance. It is, for me, short-sighted. For me. It doesn't mean I 'don't give a fudge' and if some posters find this viewpoint 'disgusting' as was suggested in another thread, then fantastic, enjoy that absurd comment and sentiment.

It's been a shame here this week. A few 'GG friendships' have taken a large knock. Hopefully it will all get back on track. I suppose this is the internet though right, and sometimes, people throw **** out there that would be unacceptable in person.

COYS.

I've said I'd give Poch two seasons to build (including this one) as I think he and his team are the right ones and we need to just hold on for a sec and stop changing managers. Yes, fair play to those who didn't think he was the right choice from the off but we need to have consistency at some point don't we? I really have a good feeling of where we are and of our foundations and the midweek game isn't going to change it.

He's an ex-footballer, media savvy, giving the younguns a go, seems to have the trust of the chairman, has a very good team, the whole handling of the captaincy (Ade, Kaboul) and then the weeding out of the so-called bad eggs (genius) rather than just isolating full-stop.

The best training facility - potentially the best stadium... and all that without oil or blood money.

Rock-on-Tommeh! (that's for you Steff old boy haha)

 

[thfcsteff]

I've said I'd give Poch two seasons to build (including this one) as I think he and his team are the right ones and we need to just hold on for a sec and stop changing managers. Yes, fair play to those who didn't think he was the right choice from the off but we need to have consistency at some point don't we? I really have a good feeling of where we are and of our foundations and the midweek game isn't going to change it.

He's an ex-footballer, media savvy, giving the younguns a go, seems to have the trust of the chairman, has a very good team, the whole handling of the captaincy (Ade, Kaboul) and then the weeding out of the so-called bad eggs (genius) rather than just isolating full-stop.

The best training facility - potentially the best stadium... and all that without oil or blood money.

Rock-on-Tommeh! (that's for you Steff old boy haha)

Agree with every word, but ESPECIALLY the bold-faced stuff. I tell you, if/when that happens, a piece of this will die away for me.

 

[Pirate55]

That's where the money is, so that is the criteria managers are judged against.

Serious question - does anyone on here expect us to get top four this season?

Thought not. Given that, there is simply no excuse for not fielding our best available team against the Arsnl at home in a cup. Dubai and the two Rs are spot on in that respect.

 

[afsoc4life]

Any time I think of this match - I shudder. It is been a while I watched a Spurs match that I felt hopeless in.

 

[Jordinho]

Serious question - does anyone on here expect us to get top four this season?

Thought not. Given that, there is simply no excuse for not fielding our best available team against the Arsnl at home in a cup. Dubai and the two Rs are spot on in that respect.

Expect? No

Possibility of? Yes

I can think of only two reasons for fielding a full strength side. Go all out for a cup and let other competitions suffer and to simply beat Arsenal.

As a manager you can't more or less throw a league game as that is the primary measure of how well you're doing, unless you've actually reached the final or at least a semi final. Then there's at least som tangible reward to aim for.

Third round simply because it's Arsenal? Sorry, that's just small time.

City played a full strength side against Sunderland, who couldn't give a toss, but they've had an extra day's rest before their last league game and another one compared to us before we meet. At some point they'll have to start resting players as well or they'll burn out before the season is over.

 

[Pirate55]

Expect? No

Possibility of? Yes

I can think of only two reasons for fielding a full strength side. Go all out for a cup and let other competitions suffer and to simply beat Ar5ena1.

As a manager you can't more or less throw a league game as that is the primary measure of how well you're doing, unless you've actually reached the final or at least a semi final. Then there's at least som tangible reward to aim for.

Third round simply because it's Ar5ena1? Sorry, that's just small time.

City played a full strength side against Sunderland, who couldn't give a toss, but they've had an extra day's rest before their last league game and another one compared to us before we meet. At some point they'll have to start resting players as well or they'll burn out before the season is over.

Even the possibility of top four is so remote this season as to be in the realms of fantasy. We all ( I think ) believe that any half decent manager will get us top 6 with this squad of players. So we are realisically talking about either 5th or 6th.

Beating Arsnl at home in a cup is NEVER small time. The knock on benefits of such a result should not be underestimated. The feel good factor for players and supporters alike would have given us all tremendous momentum.

 

[alekaras]

Even the possibility of top four is so remote this season as to be in the realms of fantasy. We all ( I think ) believe that any half decent manager will get us top 6 with this squad of players. So we are realisically talking about either 5th or 6th.

Beating Arsnl at home in a cup is NEVER small time. The knock on benefits of such a result should not be underestimated. The feel good factor for players and supporters alike would have given us all tremendous momentum.

At the start of the season I didn't believe top 4 was attainable for at least another season or two. But seeing how we have outplayed all our opponents this season and made them look pedestrian, I just don't know. Maybe it's not so fantastical after all. City tomorrow will be the acid test. And not the result, but how we play them. If we play them like we did Yoonited at OT, I would think we would have to be considered a top 4 contender.

 

[milo]

Even the possibility of top four is so remote this season as to be in the realms of fantasy. We all ( I think ) believe that any half decent manager will get us top 6 with this squad of players. So we are realisically talking about either 5th or 6th.

Beating Arsnl at home in a cup is NEVER small time. The knock on benefits of such a result should not be underestimated. The feel good factor for players and supporters alike would have given us all tremendous momentum.

I think that fifth is very achievable this season. If we stay on track for that then we need one of the top four to slip up and we finish fourth. As @Jordinho says, I don't expect us to finish top four but it does not need a huge amount to go in our favour for it to happen. As I have previously said in this thread and others, I think that a top four finish is more likely than winning a cup.

 

[Jordinho]

I think that fifth is very achievable this season. If we stay on track for that then we need one of the top four to slip up and we finish fourth. As @Jordinho says, I don't expect us to finish top four but it does not need a huge amount to go in our favour for it to happen. As I have previously said in this thread and others, I think that a top four finish is more likely than winning a cup.

I seem to remember a time not long ago, when the season was just starting, and apparently even a single point dropped was the difference in making top 4 and not.

 

[milo]

I was thinking earlier about this. If you gave me the choice between losing all our games against them this season but we finsh 4th and they finish 5th. Opposed to us winning every game but finishing 5th and them getting 4th. I would take the former every time.