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Barack Obama good president or not?

I liked and admired his healthcare reforms, but something happens to intelligent Americans when they become President because there foreign policy has not been good in many ways worse then Bush who got so much criticism yet Obama gets away with so much less.
 
I think every premier is thought to be indept whilst in office but when history normally remembers them favourably. You have to do something pretty big and stupid to have a bad legacy with the majority.

John Major was much derided when in office but ten years later when he was appointed as some sort of advocate for princes Harry and William he felt like a trusted old uncle.
 
I liked and admired his healthcare reforms, but something happens to intelligent Americans when they become President because there foreign policy has not been good in many ways worse then Bush who got so much criticism yet Obama gets away with so much less.

You mean gets away with less from the media in our country or in the USA. Without having lived in the US it's hard for me to tell but I'd say he gets quite a lot of criticism in the USA. Not so much for his foreign policy but more for being a 'communist' 'illegal immigrant' or jihadist muslim. :lol:
 
He was too ambitious with his healthcare reforms. Used all his political capital to push through a bill that the majority of Americans didn't want to begin with, which will get repealed as soon as the Republicans get back in to power. Once it's gone, his only legacy will be the complete lack of a foreign policy.
 
American's I work with say he talks a good game but doesnt actually do anything or make any decisions
 
He was too ambitious with his healthcare reforms. Used all his political capital to push through a bill that the majority of Americans didn't want to begin with, which will get repealed as soon as the Republicans get back in to power. Once it's gone, his only legacy will be the complete lack of a foreign policy.

I think he wasn't ambitious enough and was too keen on consensus.* He wasted his first year trying to reach agreement with the Republicans when they had sworn not to allow him any policy success. His initial health reforms were rebuffed, not just by Republicans, and he ended up with a monstrous health plan with all sorts of sweeteners for special interests. But this was not the plan he put forward, it was just the best he could get through. It is telling that it was still an improvement on the existing system.

Despite the scare stories and anecdotal stories, a lot of people who had poor or no health insurance have benefited from the plan and many of the poor are southern Republicans (think one huge Clacton). It will be almost impossible to reverse the health plans and if they succeed the Republicans will alienate yet another group of supporters.

* The wasted first year defined his presidency. He should have done what Gingrich did with the Contract with America and pushed as much as possible in the first 100 days. That was when he could have made his mark. Instead his only domestic legacy is the healthcare hodge-podge and his only international legacy is ... well, we are still waiting on that. His main claim to fame is that he is not George W Bush or someone like him. This he achieved and that won him the Nobel prize.

American's I work with say he talks a good game but doesnt actually do anything or make any decisions

He often does make decisions, but in his own time. This makes him look like he is dithering. Then when he has evaluated the situation and made a decision he is rather lost in making it happen, partly because of Republican obstruction and partly because he just leaves policy implementation to others. He makes the decision, makes a nice speech, and then disconnects from the process.

The end result is a poor presidency with little achievement, but it is not a disastrous presidency like that of Bush.
 
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I think he wasn't ambitious enough and was too keen on consensus.* He wasted his first year trying to reach agreement with the Republicans when they had sworn not to allow him any policy success. His initial health reforms were rebuffed, not just by Republicans, and he ended up with a monstrous health plan with all sorts of sweeteners for special interests. But this was not the plan he put forward, it was just the best he could get through. It is telling that it was still an improvement on the existing system.

Despite the scare stories and anecdotal stories, a lot of people who had poor or no health insurance have benefited from the plan and many of the poor are southern Republicans (think one huge Clacton). It will be almost impossible to reverse the health plans and if they succeed the Republicans will alienate yet another group of supporters.

* The wasted first year defined his presidency. He should have done what Gingrich did with the Contract with America and pushed as much as possible in the first 100 days. That was when he could have made his mark. Instead his only domestic legacy is the healthcare hodge-podge and his only international legacy is ... well, we are still waiting on that. His main claim to fame is that he is not George W Bush or someone like him. This he achieved and that won him the Nobel prize.



He often does make decisions, but in his own time. This makes him look like he is dithering. Then when he has evaluated the situation and made a decision he is rather lost in making it happen, partly because of Republican obstruction and partly because he just leaves policy implementation to others. He makes the decision, makes a nice speech, and then disconnects from the process.

The end result is a poor presidency with little achievement, but it is not a disastrous presidency like that of Bush.

Excellent post (including the bit about Clacton - multiple ross).

He has had much adversity to contend with compared to other Presidents in this generation. Plus, being open in his stance on gay marriage, abortion and immigration alienates him from the religious and less-educated (to put it nicely) citizens in the country. Bush had the backing of the biggest hitters in the corporate sector (with many even in his team such as Cheney/Rumsfeld etc). So even though he was a ****wit, due to his family ties and the fact he was happy to be a puppeteer for and was part of the 1%, he somehow managed two terms.

Obama made the 'mistake' of making it clear he would not pander to or be controlled by Wall Street, and although a brave move, he was always going to find it tough to battle with the immovable capitalist juggernaut that wields so much political power. Obama has all the big ideas but with such a lack of support, he is probably going to remembered as a president that promised much but delivered little. It will be interesting to see how his minimum-wage reform pans out. It seems so far that companies that have followed his vision are benefitting from it. And we are now seeing open debate and protests such as the recent fast-food labour marches in multiple cities.
 
I would still like to see him stand up to the gun lobbies. Whenever there's a shooting, he just peddles the same crap as every other president i.e refuses to be critical of guns. It's not like he can run again after this term. I know he can't do that all by himself, but he can at least try to stand up to them.
 
Hasn't done enough in the way of Wall Street reform (like putting Glass-Steagall act back into play, although some effort was made). The Dodd-Frank Act doesn't (in the eyes of plenty more knowledagble people than me) do enough to prevent Wall Street firms doing what they did to bring the world economy to it's knees in 2008.

Obamacare is a step in the right direction, but still a bit of a bodge. His hands are tied somewhat by a rubbish congress, where the Republicans look to obstruct anything and everything 'just cuz it's Obama.'

Not so keen on the 'Disposition Matrix' and the ever growing kill list via drone strikes (with the definition of threat/terrorist/enemy widening along the way). A lot of targets in a lot of countries and the growrh of it is quite scary.

The war machine rolls on, Wall St still do as they please...even healthcare reform was modelled on what Romney did as govenor of Massachusetts. Overall, the world would be pretty much the same had Romney been elected, imo. It will likely be the same when the 2nd Clinton presient comes into office too.

To use an Americanism..."meh."
 
He has a lot of blood on his hands like alot of American leaders of the past. Failed to close Guantanamo which is an embarrassment to civil liberties.
But he has had to deal with the tea party nut jobs and they have made life tough for him.

A bit meh really.
 
Meh is about the right description.

He'll end up in the history books, but only because of who he is rather than what he's done. A significant and positive thing in iteself but not part of his actions as president.

He'll mostly be remembered (if at all) for not doing much of anything. 8 years is a long time to get stuff done (although there's a tree stump in my garden I'm supposed to have removed for longer than that...) and he really should have done more. He'll probably be mentioned for bringing in a healthcare system that has all of the ruinous costs to society of a fully-fledged one, without doing most of what it was supposed to do.
 
he's had his hands tied as republicans control congress and tried to veto everything he wanted to do, obamacare has been a success and was a major policy initiative, clinton wasnt able to push this thru in his time. His foreign policy is a joke, he's got syria, libya, ISIS all wrong but ironically he will go down as the commander in chief that got rid of Bin Laden.
 
let's not forget, he's the done the world a massive service by merely being president, had he lost that election we'd all be dead by now as crazy Alaskan lady would have nuked the middle East on day 1
 
American's I work with say he talks a good game but doesnt actually do anything or make any decisions

Isn't the problem that the democrats didn't have enough seats in the Senate and the republicans tried to block every single initiative he tried to introduce? Eg the US government shutting down when they could not agree a budget. Could he realistically achieve anything whilst practically having to achieve a compromise with the macaronic tea party?
 
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