"Blade runner" shoots girlfriend

[Millsy_Yiddo]

In your version Millsy, they'd both, at the same time more or less, have to have heard two different intruders - she being the "intruder" he heard of course - so she'd have had to heard something somewhere else in the house. You really think if that had happened, she wouldn't have said something to him? If you heard something in your house, would you really not say anything to your wife/partner? Would that not be the first thing you'd do?

Looking at the BBC image of the layout, which differs from Daisuk's above:

If he's shouting the odds as he claims, and she's in that small cubicle in the bathroom, you really think she wouldn't have responded? Why would an intruder lock themselves in there?

He also never turned on a light? Seems a bizarre notion to me. He goes from the balcony to the bathroom, it's so dark he can't see her not there, but he can find his gun of course, and navigate to the bathroom, and doesn't feel the need to be able to see what he's stumbling into?

He may well get away with the murder charge, but personally I don't think he's innocent, and I don't think it's on the prosecution to disprove everything that could possibly have happened, just to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that their version is correct, in all trials like this there's only truly one person who knows for sure what happened, and he isn't going to incriminate himself, but from what I've heard I'm not reasonably doubtful. But I'm not the judge either.

What I meant was she hears OP shouting and wrongly assumes that someone is in the house because of it. She then locks herself in there for safety. She doesn't need to hear a 2nd intruder.

He didn't know the bathroom door was locked, and I'd say it's fairly plausible for an intruder breaking into a house they don't know to open the first door they see (in this case the bathroom) then close it behind them when they here a guy shouting 'get out of my house, I'm armed'. I don't think at the stage where you are pointing a gun at someone and shouting at them to get out you are in a state if mind to think, hold on? That's the bathroom, why would they go in there?

She may not have responded because he's not shouting Reeva, is that you, he's shouting GET THE **** OUT OF MY HOUSE etc etc and he may not have turned the light on for the same reason he whispered to her to phone the police. So the intruder with a gun didn't know that he was in the next room.

It's just as possible that he did shoot her in cold blood, I just don't think it's as clear cut as people are making out I.e he's guilty.

 

[johnola]

Maybe he was paranoid about something? Perhaps he was in trouble with the wrong people? who knows.

Not so paranoid that he could not sleep next to a balcony with an open door and the blinds/curtains open. And what is with the fan?

But its the screaming that haunts this trial. The defence was that it was Pistorius shouting and it's derisory!

 

[markysimmo]

The trial of Oscar Pistorius is to be delayed to allow for the Olympic athlete to undergo psychiatric tests.

The court was adjourned until next Tuesday when the specific order will be given by the judge for the evaluation to take place, including where and by whom.

Pistorius will not have to stay in a psychiatric unit, but will be treated as an "out patient."

No details of how long the evaluation will take were given, though it is understood it could take as long as 30 days.

The decision by Judge Thokozile Masipa followed a request for a psychiatric evaluation by the chief prosecutor, Gerrie Nel, on Tuesday.

The prosecutor had said he had no option but to ask for it after an expert witness for the defence testified that Pistorius had an anxiety disorder that may have played a role when he fatally shot his girlfriend, Reeva Steenkamp.

Masipa said: "The accused may not have raised the issue that he was not criminally responsible at the time of the incident in so many words, but evidence led on his behalf clearly raises the issue and cannot be ignored.

"Mental illness or mental defect are morbid disorders ... not capable of being diagnosed by a lay court."

Pistorius says he killed Steenkamp on February 14 last week by mistake, thinking there was an intruder in his home.

The prosecution says he killed her after an argument.

 

[Dicko]

I've been meaning to post about this since this morning.. Normally it's the Defence that tries to say the accused has mental issues etc. but in this case it was the Prosecution that asked for the psychiatric tests?

Can someone explain their thought process.. He says it was an accident but if they can prove he had an anxiety problem and was more likely to do something like this then how does that help them? Doesn't proving he had a problem help shift the guilt away from him and onto this condition?

 

[johnola]

I've been meaning to post about this since this morning.. Normally it's the Defence that tries to say the accused has mental issues etc. but in this case it was the Prosecution that asked for the psychiatric tests?

Can someone explain their thought process.. He says it was an accident but if they can prove he had an anxiety problem and was more likely to do something like this then how does that help them? Doesn't proving he had a problem help shift the guilt away from him and onto this condition?

Yes his defence suggested his actions were partly the result of an anxiety disorder. The prosecution basically said prove it, and the judge concurred.

 

[Millsy_Yiddo]

Verdict today. From what I've read so far judge is on the side of the defense, which means culpable homicide may be more likely than murder.

 

[monkeybarry]

Murder has been judged as not guilty as the evidence was circumstantial

 

[markysimmo]

Walob

 

[Dicko]

So it's either culpable homicide or an acquittal..

I think I read somewhere that both sides would almost definitely appeal the verdict and that Pistorius was already trying to raise funds knowing it wasn't over yet.

 

[tommysvr]

Not sure there was ever really a chance he would be found guilty of murder, even though I have no doubt he meant to kill.

 

[Seedy Ron]

Not sure there was ever really a chance he would be found guilty of murder, even though I have no doubt he meant to kill.

No, even though I think he knew exactly what he was doing and will always be a murderer to me, I can see how it was difficult to prove intent for premeditated murder, when it's basically his word against nobody. But the charge below that, common-law murder, which the BBC describes as:

Unlawfully intended to kill in the heat of the moment but without "malice aforethought". Either: Shot door intending to kill, or knew someone might be killed and still fired gun

How is he not guilty of that? Why else would you put 4 bullets through a bog door into an enclosed space?

Agree with Marky, walob.

 

[Bonsaiboy]

There was never any real evidence of things not being right in their relationship or that they'd argued. My take on it is that he had a desire to kill someone, just to experience it, and he was always on the lookout for an opportunity such as burglary, and when he heard a noise in the bathroom, he spotted his chance and, almost unconsciously, set off intending to kill who was in the bathroom, though he didn't know it was Reeva.

2nd degree murder for me, and I'll be amazed if he doesn't get 15 years for culpable homicide at least.

 

[Baleforce]

white man found not guilty in south africa, stop the presses

 

[Jurgen the German]

white man found not guilty in south africa, stop the presses

Famous person gets off, stop the presses.

 

[Dicko]

There was never any real evidence of things not being right in their relationship or that they'd argued. My take on it is that he had a desire to kill someone, just to experience it, and he was always on the lookout for an opportunity such as burglary, and when he heard a noise in the bathroom, he spotted his chance and, almost unconsciously, set off intending to kill who was in the bathroom, though he didn't know it was Reeva.

2nd degree murder for me, and I'll be amazed if he doesn't get 15 years for culpable homicide at least.

I bet whatever he gets it will be appealed and reduced to virtually nothing

 

[Millsy_Yiddo]

No, even though I think he knew exactly what he was doing and will always be a murderer to me, I can see how it was difficult to prove intent for premeditated murder, when it's basically his word against nobody.

When it is his word against nobody it works both ways. It's equally difficult for his barrister to prove that there was no intent, and he didn't have the benefit of witnesses claiming to have heard women scream etc.

But the charge below that, common-law murder, which the BBC describes as:



How is he not guilty of that? Why else would you put 4 bullets through a bog door into an enclosed space?

Agree with Marky, walob.

I am struggling a little with this one though. The judge seems to think that he could not have subjectively foreseen that the person behind the door would be killed. I'm guessing that means that since he could not see the person it's not possible to prove that he fired with the intent to kill.

 

[Jordinho]

Seems the judge held a bit of a speech on how what he did was reckless and over the top. He made a choice to spend the time it took to crawl into the bathroom and then, knowing there was a person on the other side of the door, fired, what, four shots? The balcony was right next to him. Having a gun and being a trained shooter he could easily have waited to see who came out or made more of an attempt to find out who was in there.

Also, his testimony was basically stripped of any credibility.

 

[Seedy Ron]

Looks likely he'll get the manslaughter charge, but that's maximum 15 years, he'll probably start blubbing again and get about 2.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Ok so people are split about whether he murdered her (personally I think he did), but surely there is no way he can escape the manslaughter charge? I mean, he shot her which he doesn't deny and now a person no longer has her life. You can't just unload about 5 rounds of ammo because you think someone may be in your house.

 

[Jordinho]

If I just randomly fired a gun at a wall and accidentally hit someone I'd get done. He fired it with the intention of hitting someone AFAIC.