Luka Vuskovic

[thfcsteff]

Brighton are a much better side than us. We're literally the worst team in the league, possibly bar the newly promoted ones. Why is he going to get more regular football at much better teams than us - I don't understand that logic?

I disagree that we're the worst team in the league.
I think with several key buys we will be competitive under this manager.
We have less games this season. We just signed Senesi. We have yet to sell Romero. We have Van De Ven and Danso. Vuskovic is untested in the Prem with regards to speed, which sadly is a very important part of the current league (I wish there were more finesse but is like a speed/strength test these days). It is clear that for whatever reason, the manager would rather Van Hecke in for Romero than Vuskovic at this point. Maybe in a season that changes, in which case SuperKev moves on next season and with us (hopefully) being back in Europe Vuskovic can compete with the experience behind him. There will be NO winning for the club here. The Vuskovic hype train is bullet-speed roaring past Mt Fuji as we speak, equally, if we don't back the manager and buy a player he apparently really wants, the whole 'net zero spend this club hasn't changed' will be thrown by some quarters.
It's already become an enormous banter point among our fans, this with little concrete information on what is really going on. Finally, I have to say, I think his agent has behaved poorly if it was him who leaked this info.

 

[Muttley]

I note that one of the two teams you were referring to above was Barcelona. While I agree they probably wouldn't spend £70m to buy Vuskovic, they have repeatedly shown that if he were already at Barca, they would almost certainly have played him.

I suppose it helps when you have a tried-and-tested pathway for young talent to break into the first team. Those of us of a certain vintage remember the likes of Xavi, Iniesta, Valdes, Puyol, Pique, Busquets and the Little Magician himself graduating into the senior side.

In the current setup, Pau Cubarsi, a central defender, made his debut at 16, established himself at 17 and now, at 19, already has two league titles and starts for Spain in a back four.

At left-back they have Balde, who established himself as a teenager. In midfield there's Pedri, who was a regular starter at 17, with Gavi not far behind. And, of course, there's the 18-year-old Boy Wonder on the right wing who was voted Player of the year in Spain, last season.

Barcelona's philosophy isn't perfect, but when they believe a young player is good enough, age and lack of experience rarely seems to be a barrier.

I think we have to appreciate the massive impact of the B teams in the Spanish setup and the way they've organised their football pyramid. It is way smarter than our own. 2 of the players you mention came through that route and briefly played for Barca B in the Segunda B. That is 90 teams in 5 groups, some B teams based on kids and some proper mens team. It's quite a grounding for these young guys. They get to play the Barca way but also have some 29 year old opposition player giving them the physical treatment. They soon learn to deal with that by skill and crisp passing. Those older plodders are often made to look ordinary by these kids and then they find themselves in the first team setup.

England took the selfish route and just sold themselves to Sky. Only one division gets the spoils and the entire pyramid isn't designed for these best local academy players to progress. The pressure is too high to fall out of the PL and lose their income so older players rule. It's rare you would ever see a squad composition of about 18 seniors and 7 U21s. It is exactly what Pep did when he won the treble. Nobody even mentioned it over here as Kalvin Phillips sat getting splinters whilst Rico Lewis and Cole Palmer were on the pitch. Lewis was even playing Phillips role in the quarter final of the CL at 18/19.

Not a chance that Barca would be looking at Senesi and Robbo. They would find a Cubarsi. The big question is whether Vuskovic is that player. Whether rational or irrational, I still think Vuskovic and Phillips would cope better than Dragusin and Davies in the PL. They've been outstanding at that level just slightly below.

 

[thfcsteff]

I think we have to appreciate the massive impact of the B teams in the Spanish setup and the way they've organised their football pyramid. It is way smarter than our own. 2 of the players you mention came through that route and briefly played for Barca B in the Segunda B. That is 90 teams in 5 groups, some B teams based on kids and some proper mens team. It's quite a grounding for these young guys. They get to play the Barca way but also have some 29 year old opposition player giving them the physical treatment. They soon learn to deal with that by skill and crisp passing. Those older plodders are often made to look ordinary by these kids and then they find themselves in the first team setup.

England took the selfish route and just sold themselves to Sky. Only one division gets the spoils and the entire pyramid isn't designed for these best local academy players to progress. The pressure is too high to fall out of the PL and lose their income so older players rule. It's rare you would ever see a squad composition of about 18 seniors and 7 U21s. It is exactly what Pep did when he won the treble. Nobody even mentioned it over here as Kalvin Phillips sat getting splinters whilst Rico Lewis and Cole Palmer were on the pitch. Lewis was even playing Phillips role in the quarter final of the CL at 18/19.

Not a chance that Barca would be looking at Senesi and Robbo. They would find a Cubarsi. The big question is whether Vuskovic is that player. Whether rational or irrational, I still think Vuskovic and Phillips would cope better than Dragusin and Davies in the PL. They've been outstanding at that level just slightly below.

Enjoyable post this one with a great point re: Sky and soul selling

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

What journos? I saw that piece that was posted on here yesterday and I thought it was appalling! Basically saying because Vuskovic played in Germany and because Hurzeler is German then they trust each other.

Think it’s simply that we want Van Hecke and said you can have Vuskovic on loan as part of the deal, Brighton, like any team worth their salt, will have then said well no we’ll just buy him for half his valuation… it’s basic negotiating. None of which is Vuskovic wanting to leave or asking to leave. He’s probably been sounded out of he’s open to the loan and said ok. It’s 2+2 = whatever you want it to be at this stage.

My scenario above could be completely wrong as well, but I’m not going convince myself of it and make any assumptions about what the player wants and criticize him for a hypothetical.

I may be wrong but I think I saw Ornstein backing up that Vuskovic had openness to the move and had agreed terms. The Plettigoal guy I don’t care about, but Ornstein is credible, I may have been getting people mixed up though.

My point remains, LV should be perfectly happy taking a prem loan this season, to then come back to us. If his point is that he just wants to play. *if* there is any feeling that he’d rather a perm move out of Spurs at this point, I’d class that as just weird, frankly.

 

[metalgear]

its a very very sad day when young talents choose brighton instead of spurs.

all those who think levy has done a great job need to reflect on the position of the club now.

how are we going to attract good talent now?

 

[BigChiv9]

I may be wrong but I think I saw Ornstein backing up that Vuskovic had openness to the move and had agreed terms. The Plettigoal guy I don’t care about, but Ornstein is credible, I may have been getting people mixed up though.

My point remains, LV should be perfectly happy taking a prem loan this season, to then come back to us. If his point is that he just wants to play. *if* there is any feeling that he’d rather a perm move out of Spurs at this point, I’d class that as just weird, frankly.

Some of the reports about Vuskovic agreeing to move to Brighton quote Ornstein as a source. It's not weird if as I believe Vuskovic and his management are already aiming at a move to a 'top' club; a Barcelona, Bayern etc. Why would he want to come back to Spurs after a successful loan at Brighton? It wouldn't move his career forward sufficiently. We're looking at this as if he has some connection with Tottenham but I don't think he does. I think we or Brighton or Hamburg or any other 'middling' team are just a stepping stone in the development of his career and he will choose the one that gives him what he wants in the shortest possible time.

 

[harr1984]

I may be wrong but I think I saw Ornstein backing up that Vuskovic had openness to the move and had agreed terms. The Plettigoal guy I don’t care about, but Ornstein is credible, I may have been getting people mixed up though.

My point remains, LV should be perfectly happy taking a prem loan this season, to then come back to us. If his point is that he just wants to play. *if* there is any feeling that he’d rather a perm move out of Spurs at this point, I’d class that as just weird, frankly.

No you are right it was Ornstein and that too is a concern for me as he is reliable (yes I'm sure you could list some things that haven't ended up happening that's he's said, but that's football). I can only hope that it was more talk of a loan, you sometimes get when these things break out it being a transfer but ends up being a loan deal so hopefully that would be the case if there is real progression in this.

I hesitate to put any blame on Vuskovic, so more so his agent who since he has signed here it feels like there has been constant noise about him wanting to be elsewhere - I appreciate him being ambitious and him being a very talented guy but at least some of the noise is coming from his end.

What I will say is no doubt the board will get the criticism if he was sold, but this would very much be a RDZ decision - the board are backing him so whatever he wants will happen, and if he is happy to sell such a talent even if he doesn't think he has the ball skills of other CBs he wants that will be a real concern to me....

 

[Finney Is Back]

No you are right it was Ornstein and that too is a concern for me as he is reliable (yes I'm sure you could list some things that haven't ended up happening that's he's said, but that's football). I can only hope that it was more talk of a loan, you sometimes get when these things break out it being a transfer but ends up being a loan deal so hopefully that would be the case if there is real progression in this.

I hesitate to put any blame on Vuskovic, so more so his agent who since he has signed here it feels like there has been constant noise about him wanting to be elsewhere - I appreciate him being ambitious and him being a very talented guy but at least some of the noise is coming from his end.

What I will say is no doubt the board will get the criticism if he was sold, but this would very much be a RDZ decision - the board are backing him so whatever he wants will happen, and if he is happy to sell such a talent even if he doesn't think he has the ball skills of other CBs he wants that will be a real concern to me....

His agent is doing a superb job. He works for the player, not Spurs.

 

[harr1984]

His agent is doing a superb job. He works for the player, not Spurs.

Cant argue with that, if Vuskovic wants to leave already he is certainly getting to work ...

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

His agent is doing a superb job. He works for the player, not Spurs.

Yeah, no doubt. Which then leads me to question - is the Brighton thing legit? Or is this just something to kick up enough of a fuss to get him out and straight to Bayern or something?

From LV’s point of view, both from wanting to play now and wanting to end up at the elite most possible club…I don’t understand why pushing for a permanent move to Brighton gets him there quicker than performing well for Spurs after a PL loan.

 

[glasgowspur]

His agent is doing a superb job. He works for the player, not Spurs.

If Brighton is the best move he can get one of the most sought-after young players in Europe then I think his agent is doing a terrible job.