Xavi Simons

[DeanoAustin]

I agree that there is always a good degree of subjectivity to it which is why for me I was fine with the refs just making a decision on the pitch and we keep it moving. If it went your way then great, if it didn't then so be it.

I'm happy for technology to be used in matters of fact, so offsides, goal line, corners etc, but what constitutes a foul or the severity of the punishment required for a foul will always be subjective and VAR can't change that.

It will always leave some people unsatisfied with any given decision on the day.

I agree 100%. I'd have been happy for us to have continued without VAR but the constant moaning about refs by media, players & managers and the money involved in football meant that VAR was inevitable IMO.

You're right in your second paragraph but what VAR does for the subjective decisions is it gives the officials time to see the incident again and time and space to consider their decision.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

VAR isn't corrupt. In fact, IMO, it removes the possibility of corruption because a ref now isn't the sole one making the decisions and ridiculous decisions are scrutinised and corrected. In days gone by, corrupt referees could get away with it much easier ("ah sorry, I just missed it").

Just unfortunate that ref and VAR make the same errors or it's just like any other self monitoring authority and ignore faults (I'm being generous there)

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

You're expecting perfection when it's impossible. Some decisions are subjective so it's not a case of reviewing it until you get it right or wrong - there isn't a definitive answer in many cases, just an opinion. See Liverpool's second goal on Saturday. See Bentancur v Saudi Sportswashing Machine.

If we start using VAR for corners, it'll be ridiculous IMO. The game will be slowed down for corners because you'll no longer be able to take a quick corner in some instanes and some of them aren't clear cut and will need multiple views so will take longer than 5 seconds. How about a team just accept the decision and defend the corner.

The officials' job is to uphold the laws of the game and my strong belief is that is what they endeavour to do to the best of their ability. However, the majority of people err on the side of caution when there is uncertainty. Referees are no different because they're people too believe it or not.

Perfection may be impossible but is it unreasonable to expect consistency?

 

[DeanoAustin]

Perfection may be impossible but is it unreasonable to expect consistency?

Yes

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Was VAR in place for that? I could be wrong but I think that was the League Cup game last year and I have some sort of feeling that there was no VAR involved? (though I could well be wrong).

Semi finals so it was

 

[Bishop]

Perfection may be impossible but is it unreasonable to expect consistency?

The inconsistency is because of the subjectivity and the differing people making these judgements. No two people ever really see things exactly the same, so it will be the same with a referee no matter how well they are trained. Then add the fan bias to it all and you will just never see what we would call consistency in decisions across games.

Where I think you can be critical is if a particular referee isn't treating the same infractions equally, but that's a hard thing to track and truly remember from one game to the next.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

The inconsistency is because of the subjectivity and the differing people making these judgements. No two people ever really see things exactly the same, so it will be the same with a referee no matter how well they are trained. Then add the fan bias to it all and you will just never see what we would call consistency in decisions across games.

Where I think you can be critical is if a particular referee isn't treating the same infractions equally, but that's a hard thing to track and truly remember from one game to the next.

The only consistency appears the same teams seem to benefit from the inconsistency and rarely have a VAR call to review something the ref missed.

 

[Gilzeantoscore]

Has a ref ever sticked with their original decision after viewing the screen?

 

[SteveAWOL]

Has a ref ever sticked with their original decision after viewing the screen?

Seems to be less than 2% of the time that a referee won’t concur with VAR after being called over to the pitch-side monitor.

Do Premier League referees ever overrule the VAR? The data show it's rare - but it does happen

Sean Dyche questioned the purpose of referees being called to the monitor after Dominic Calvert-Lewins controversial red card in the FA Cup; but the Everton striker actually benefitted from one of the few examples of VAR being overruled in the Premier League...

www.skysports.com

 

[Muttley]

You're expecting perfection when it's impossible. Some decisions are subjective so it's not a case of reviewing it until you get it right or wrong - there isn't a definitive answer in many cases, just an opinion. See Liverpool's second goal on Saturday. See Bentancur v Saudi Sportswashing Machine.

If we start using VAR for corners, it'll be ridiculous IMO. The game will be slowed down for corners because you'll no longer be able to take a quick corner in some instanes and some of them aren't clear cut and will need multiple views so will take longer than 5 seconds. How about a team just accept the decision and defend the corner.

The officials' job is to uphold the laws of the game and my strong belief is that is what they endeavour to do to the best of their ability. However, the majority of people err on the side of caution when there is uncertainty. Referees are no different because they're people too believe it or not.

Nah, I'm not expecting perfection. I'm expecting higher standards and they come from a couple of things. The first is to admit there is an issue with the quality of the officiating and putting a get well plan in place. That is something PGMOL have not done in a 5-10 year period which smacks of compete arrogance in my opinion. So many footballer stakeholders across many different football personas have been raising the agenda. The second is follow the laws of the game to make 1 possible.

I never said we use VAR on every corner. What I said was that if we used it on the tight calls then the cheating barsteward players will stop trying to con the ref because they know they can't prosper. It will become like goal line tech. It's in these areas that I am trying to support the refs. If a player is trying to con the ref, just book him. They'll soon stop doing it.

I do get what you say about erring on the side of caution with some areas of officiating. That is not the case with yellow cards not given. The entire world knows the ref should be brandishing a yellow based on the laws. Only the referee's agenda (probably coming from above) can explain why the laws were completely ignored. You see it game after game and it changes results.

 

[Baleforce]

Seems to be less than 2% of the time that a referee won’t concur with VAR after being called over to the pitch-side monitor.

Do Premier League referees ever overrule the VAR? The data show it's rare - but it does happen

Sean Dyche questioned the purpose of referees being called to the monitor after Dominic Calvert-Lewins controversial red card in the FA Cup; but the Everton striker actually benefitted from one of the few examples of VAR being overruled in the Premier League...

www.skysports.com

They wouldn’t be asked to check the monitor if there wasn’t a strong indication they had made a mistake.

It’s a bit like saying “how often does the doctor stick with their first diagnosis when the blood tests contradict it?”

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

They wouldn’t be asked to check the monitor if there wasn’t a strong indication they had made a mistake.

It’s a bit like saying “how often does the doctor stick with their first diagnosis when the blood tests contradict it?”

I would say that's a poor analogy in my experience, I've recently had 2 family members in hospital for 10 days getting various diagnosis before being treated and recently had a pacemaker fitted only a month after receiving a letter informing me there were no problems with my heart and I'm discharged.

 

[Baleforce]

I would say that's a poor analogy in my experience, I've recently had 2 family members in hospital for 10 days getting various diagnosis before being treated and recently had a pacemaker fitted only a month after receiving a letter informing me there were no problems with my heart and I'm discharged.

I hope you recover quickly and your family members are ok.

 

[K.D.D.D.D.Soc]

I hope you recover quickly and your family members are ok.

Thanks I feel ok got check up in February, my son in law was diagnosed with meningitis then septicaemia before find it was a dental infection, all very worrying as he has no spleen, daughter in law had severe cellulitis which they eventually believe it was caused by screws in her foot from previous operation, both home and back at work.

 

[SteveAWOL]

They wouldn’t be asked to check the monitor if there wasn’t a strong indication they had made a mistake.

It’s a bit like saying “how often does the doctor stick with their first diagnosis when the blood tests contradict it?”

Unfortunately VAR has been so poorly implemented by bungling incompetents that the test results will no doubt be contaminated and therefore should be disregarded.

I would say that's a poor analogy in my experience, I've recently had 2 family members in hospital for 10 days getting various diagnosis before being treated and recently had a pacemaker fitted only a month after receiving a letter informing me there were no problems with my heart and I'm discharged.

My elderly auntie has had multiple vials of blood taken 3 times in as many months as the laboratory which her GP uses misplaced her samples the first 2 times and we’re now hoping that following the Christmas break she might finally be able to begin a new course of medication which should’ve commenced at the start of autumn.

The interminable wait is rather a good analogy for current implementation of VAR, which I was originally in favour of in principle to avoid farcical on-field decisions like Vertonghen’s offside but sadly the “clear and obvious” bit no longer seems to be its remit.