Tim Sherwood…gone \o/

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

The bottom line relevant stats are -

AVB - 27 points in 16 games. 15 goals for, 21 against.
Tim - 26 points in 13 games. 22 goals for, 16 against.

That's cherry picking. You can't just take one competition and ignore the ones Timmeh's failed miserably in. The facts are pretty clear in the screenshot posted above.

 

[AdamB]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

The bottom line relevant stats are -

AVB - 27 points in 16 games. 15 goals for, 21 against.
Tim - 26 points in 13 games. 22 goals for, 16 against.

The key part of which is:

AVB - 27 points in 16 games
Tim - 26 points in 13 games

Hard to see him surviving in the summer is a credible, experienced manager is available (thankfully)

 

[AdamB]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

That's cherry picking. You can't just take one competition and ignore the ones Timmeh's failed miserably in. The facts are pretty clear in the screenshot posted above.

You cant include EL group games in teh analysis. You may as well include friendlies if you do

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

You cant include EL group games in teh analysis. You may as well include friendlies if you do

But we can include a matches against an equally dog**** Dnipro? Or a match where the opposition keeper gifts us our goals?

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

He's just doing exactly what Redknapp would have done - every time Sherwood mouths off in teh press, its as if Redknapp was making the comments and they'r ebeing mid-reported. The big difference is that, whilst I dont like Harry, he did keep us up and achieve something in his first 2 years at Spurs, whereas Deadwood has never managed - as such Harry could 'go to war with Spurs' as you put it and believe that he had a chance of winning (realistically not a chance vs Levy!). Whereas Sherwood has no previous capital....he's copying harry's fighting talk and almost goading Levy into firing him

As someone else said, he's never managed before and therefore to say that he could never be a number 2 and learn from someone even as experienced as Van Gaal is sheer arrogance

If you see the tone of the stories coming from the club though, they seem to be almost deferential to Sherwood and understand where he is coming from with what he said.

To be it's a symptom of having too much change in the squad, people aren't comfortable enough with each other yet to ball each other out when that's aren't going well. It's part of the settling in process to be comfortable in a new group, and we took it to an extreme. That's why we hear that players have just wanted to be too nice with each other. I don't blame them really, I can understand it, but it probably takes something like the barney that was supposedly had to make people realise it simply won't be stood for anymore.

 

[AdamB]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

But we can include a matches against an equally dog**** Dnipro? Or a match where the opposition keeper gifts us our goals?

Dnipro at least qualified from their group so had some modicumof ability. Regarding the league games, both will have managed for approx half a season against similar standard of opposition so their league records are able to be compared

 

[AdamB]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

If you see the tone of the stories coming from the club though, they seem to be almost deferential to Sherwood and understand where he is coming from with what he said.

To be it's a symptom of having too much change in the squad, people aren't comfortable enough with each other yet to ball each other out when that's aren't going well. It's part of the settling in process to be comfortable in a new group, and we took it to an extreme. That's why we hear that players have just wanted to be too nice with each other. I don't blame them really, I can understand it, but it probably takes something like the barney that was supposedly had to make people realise it simply won't be stood for anymore.

A manager needs credibility with his players though - experienced guys have that. Harry could have got away with it; people like Mourinho obviously can. I'm not sure TS does so shooting his mouth off risks alienating the players. I hope he goes in teh summer and we bring in a new guy with some experience and restore some sanity to the club

 

[Rossi22]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Dnipro at least qualified from their group so had some modicumof ability. Regarding the league games, both will have managed for approx half a season against similar standard of opposition so their league records are able to be compared

No, no. Playing Dnipro, Arsenal and Benfica can be directly compared to playing a side bottom of the Russian league, a team bottom of the Norwegian league and teams top of the mighty Georgian and Moldovan leagues.

 

[tm1210]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I personally think the "Timmeh" things getting a bit old and f**kin childish if I'm being honest. I don't like the fella too much my self and hope for someone better but show a bit of respect ffs. He's the manager of THFC.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Dnipro at least qualified from their group so had some modicumof ability. Regarding the league games, both will have managed for approx half a season against similar standard of opposition so their league records are able to be compared

Their qualification means nothing - they're still a terrible team. If you ranked them on expected results they'd be a few levels below us at least.

 

[Rossi22]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Dnipro would win 8 out of 8 against the sides AVB faced too, they're only a few points off Shakhtar in their league so making them out to be some tin pot side is either agenda or ignorance driven. Probably a smidge of both.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

I personally think the "Timmeh" things getting a bit old and f**kin childish if I'm being honest. I don't like the fella too much my self and hope for someone better but show a bit of respect ffs. He's the temporary manager of THFC.

Fixed. If you'd prefer we can call him YTS Tim? Or maybe just Tim "All the players are ****s" Sherwood? Maybe, considering how he acted at Blackburn and Spurs as a player, we could make something up related to Necrotizing fasciitis?

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Dnipro would win 8 out of 8 against the sides AVB faced too, they're only a few points off Shakhtar in their league so making them out to be some tin pot side is either agenda or ignorance driven. Probably a smidge of both.

That's one way of describing it. You could also say that they're 4th in a 3 team league. That's a bit like Celtic finishing 3rd this season.

 

[Rossi22]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Are City 4th in a three team league then as well? Dnipro have a game in hand, they can go 2nd. No matter what they do they're still leagues above the sides AVB had the benefit of stat-padding against. Only relative comparison is the league. AVB 1.69 points per game, Sherwood 2 per game. AVB -6 GD, Sherwood +5. You can get back to me when Sherwood falls below AVB's numbers.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

A manager needs credibility with his players though - experienced guys have that. Harry could have got away with it; people like Mourinho obviously can. I'm not sure TS does so shooting his mouth off risks alienating the players. I hope he goes in teh summer and we bring in a new guy with some experience and restore some sanity to the club

My guess is he was just saying what a number of the players thought. Out of the ones that Sherwood was referring to, the ones he said he can't count on, a few of them will buck their ideas up, and a few of them will decide they don't want to be here anymore. And those players, we probably wouldn't have wanted anyway.

 

[scaramanga]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Are City 4th in a three team league then as well? Dnipro have a game in hand, they can go 2nd. No matter what they do they're still leagues above the sides AVB had the benefit of stat-padding against. Only relative comparison is the league. AVB 1.69 points per game, Sherwood 2 per game. AVB -6 GD, Sherwood +5. You can get back to me when Sherwood falls below AVB's numbers.

I really, really hope he isn't given the chance to. He'll be out before then.

 

[milo]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

He's just doing exactly what Redknapp would have done - every time Sherwood mouths off in teh press, its as if Redknapp was making the comments and they'r ebeing mid-reported. The big difference is that, whilst I dont like Harry, he did keep us up and achieve something in his first 2 years at Spurs, whereas Deadwood has never managed - as such Harry could 'go to war with Spurs' as you put it and believe that he had a chance of winning (realistically not a chance vs Levy!). Whereas Sherwood has no previous capital....he's copying harry's fighting talk and almost goading Levy into firing him

As someone else said, he's never managed before and therefore to say that he could never be a number 2 and learn from someone even as experienced as Van Gaal is sheer arrogance

I think that he'd be eaten alive by the press if he said that he would take the number 2 job during the season. Whether it is a charade or not, the players need to think that he will be around and in charge for a while. Without that his authority is diminished.

It is possible that in private he is saying something different.

 

[Bullet]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

Reports earlier in the week were saying that Sherwood rates Eriksen. I think that it is too easy to say English manager will want to sign English cloggers but we've got no idea whether that is what he wants.

Yes we have, he said he wants midfielders that can do a bit of everything, he doesn't want some that can only tackle and others that can only go forward.

Therefore he does not want "English cloggers" - he wants people that can tackle and pass and move and mark and dribble and do a bit of everything.

That is why he brought Bentaleb in ahead of Capoue, clearly.

 

[Bullet]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

First I've heard of this player meeting

http://www.theguardian.com/football...ood-warns-tottenham-players-sales-daniel-levy

"Sandro, meanwhile, believes that all Tottenham's players are ready to roll up their sleeves after the heated meeting in the aftermath of the defeat by Chelsea. "We spent more than two hours in a meeting among the players and we said what we had to say. Everyone was [shouting]. Sometimes when you lose games in that way everyone gets cross and we all scream and shout," said Sandro.

"It was after the manager's conference with the press. We had a meeting with the players. Sometimes one player got a bit more stressed out and we tried to calm him down. Every player had their fair share to say, let's put it that way.

"From now on if someone is not doing their work properly, then I think now we – especially the older players – can say something. In the past we probably didn't say anything because we didn't want anyone to take it the wrong way. From now on we will pull our sleeves up and tell whoever is not doing their job."

I'm confused with this board. This is a really big deal and nobody has discussed it. Maybe it is in some other thread somewhere? It is very, very encouraging to me.

If Sherwood had said what he said and left it, it could fester. But he said what he said and then had a big meeting to thrash it out with everyone, which is far better IMO.

Encouraging for tonight.

Note we could still get tonked tonight so I am not looking just at the result, but it will be interesting to see who plays and how they fare.

For instance Steff and others keep saying how Vertonghen is a bad influence and his heart isn't in it. I say he is a winner that captained Ajax to victories and he is RIGHTLY ****ed off at how we are playing at times and when we concede, just as any leader (e.g. Rio or Terry or Lampard) would be.

He needs to channel that frustration into doing something about it and leading others.

 

[NWND]

Re: Tim Sherwood - Head Coach

That's cherry picking. You can't just take one competition and ignore the ones Timmeh's failed miserably in. The facts are pretty clear in the screenshot posted above.

Sometimes it is right to cherry pick. Overall performance this season is pretty irrelevant as the teams we faced in the Europa league group were so poor.

It's fair to say that Sherwood's Premiership performance has been better than AVB's.
It's also fair to say AVB's cup performance has been better than Sherwood's.
It's also fair to say that in Sherwood's defence (re: cups), the West Ham defeat was his first game in charge with hardly any time to prepare. The FA cup defeat was away to Arsenal so defeat was always a high possibility and his defeat to Dnipro was away to a decent opponent on a horrendous pitch.

That's not to say that I think Sherwood is doing massively better than AVB, he's just done the bare minimum in re-instating Adebayor and making us play the ball earlier, thus actually creating chances from open play.

We're still far from being a cohesive side.