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Thomas Frank - Head Coach

Well, the players are still fighting for him

Xavi and Romero stupidity and we still were unlucky to lose with 9
What I really like about Thomas Frank, apart from how well he has rotated his squad and managed injuries, is over his time at Brentford he improved so many players. Watkins, Mbeumo, Wissa, Raya. These were all Brentford players, 3 of them offensive. And that's before you consider Toney, Damsgaard and Norgaard. It is what the top managers do. It's what Poch did and what Iraola is doing at Bournemouth. But he needs time.
 
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If people keep bringing up the Archie Gray moment last week, protect him. It's done, he said his piece at the time, why not just say 'guys it's been discussed within the dressing room with everyone, mistakes are a team thing
So after the (mainly negative) comments on his pre match presser I listened again expecting to be annoyed.

TF was asked "how was Archie this week?" I have given a precis of what his response below:-

"He's been good; when I watched the game back he was the one who wanted the ball instantly after the mistake and I like the mentality. Anyone who makes a mistake in football or life needs to go back on it and go again"

I'm not sure he's said anything wrong there or anything if I put myself in the shoes of Archie Gray he would be angry at. And Gray was back in the team today.

And how about protecting whatever process he's in by not hammering how 'long' this is all going to take 'to fix'?
Again I couldn't see anything wrong with his answer which again I'll précis:-

"I am comfortable and confident to fix it. But it won't just be me, there'll be a lot of good people working together and aligned to get that right. I am 1000% sure that no club has done well if the key people are not aligned. I back myself to be one of those key people. I wasn't here so I don't know why the other coaches were sacked I just know everyone has to be aligned. And we are now"

He also said "10% of fans will always question the head coach no matter which club you are at but there is also a large group who will see the big picture and be loyal. However I want to say to fans that it is a privilege to be part of this fantastic club. And it has a fantastic potential which needs to be fulfilled and to do that there are a lot of stages to go through but I have never worked so hard to do that.."

He was asked about Vic and gave an honest answer:- Great shot stopper but his distribution needs work and development.

Look you are one of the fairest posters I know Steff and I rarely disagree with you (except maybe over Ange :grinning:). But I think you are being unfair to TF with the tone of that post. But fair enough if that's how you feel. What I see is a decent guy who sees himself here for the long term and wants to change the culture at the club to make it fulfil the potential. Isn't that what every manager would say?
 
What I really like about Thomas Frank, apart from how well he has rotated his squad and managed injuries, is over his time at Brentford he improved so many players. Watkins, Mbeumo, Wissa, Raya. These were all Brentford players, 3 of them offensive. And that's before you consider Toney, Damsgaard and Norgaard. It is what the top managers do. It's what Poch did and what Iraola is doing at Bournemouth. But he needs time.
Time to turn us into Brentford? Great, I can’t wait.
 
Time to turn us into Brentford? Great, I can’t wait.
I'm not sure what you want me to say mate? That could be levelled at any manager who comes from a smaller club to us. While managers who have been elite elsewhere cannot adapt to the situation they find themselves in here. So who's left? We need to see how this one plays out. I think we will finish in the top 10 this season. Not great but he needs time.
 
I'm not sure what you want me to say mate? That could be levelled at any manager who comes from a smaller club to us. While managers who have been elite elsewhere cannot adapt to the situation they find themselves in here. So who's left? We need to see how this one plays out. I think we will finish in the top 10 this season. Not great but he needs time.

I find the approach of some of our fanbase staggering at the moment tbh. Talk about delusions of grandeur…
 
I'm not sure what you want me to say mate? That could be levelled at any manager who comes from a smaller club to us. While managers who have been elite elsewhere cannot adapt to the situation they find themselves in here. So who's left? We need to see how this one plays out. I think we will finish in the top 10 this season. Not great but he needs time.
TBF, thats such a great post.
 
I'm not sure what you want me to say mate? That could be levelled at any manager who comes from a smaller club to us. While managers who have been elite elsewhere cannot adapt to the situation they find themselves in here. So who's left? We need to see how this one plays out. I think we will finish in the top 10 this season. Not great but he needs time.
No worries @Robspur12 , just the usual post-match blues here. We’re at a pretty low ebb both on and off the field and it’s hard to be positive. I fear things will get worse.
 
No worries @Robspur12 , just the usual post-match blues here. We’re at a pretty low ebb both on and off the field and it’s hard to be positive. I fear things will get worse.
No worries I know exactly how you feel mate. I can feel the irritation creeping in with those around me as it always has done when we lose (not violently I hasten to add). I feel ashamed about that and really trying to be better. It's only football in the end.
 
What I really like about Thomas Frank, apart from how well he has rotated his squad and managed injuries, is over his time at Brentford he improved so many players. Watkins, Mbeumo, Wissa, Raya. These were all Brentford players, 3 of them offensive. And that's before you consider Toney, Damsgaard and Norgaard. It is what the top managers do. It's what Poch did and what Iraola is doing at Bournemouth. But he needs time.
Not a dig at Iraola/Glasner as they are both doing excellent jobs, but they are the next manager for some, they are both currently going through awful form and 2 more poor results today.

Who ever comes in, will be in the same situation
 
Not a dig at Iraola/Glasner as they are both doing excellent jobs, but they are the next manager for some, they are both currently going through awful form and 2 more poor results today.

Who ever comes in, will be in the same situation
Both would get me backing personally as Frank has, its not agenda or bias. I think like yiu, we can acknowledge its not a magic wand fix
 
Not a dig at Iraola/Glasner as they are both doing excellent jobs, but they are the next manager for some, they are both currently going through awful form and 2 more poor results today.

Who ever comes in, will be in the same situation
I never wanted Iraola, his team got a lot of injuries even without European football - that's the last thing we need.

Glasner is the one I wanted, there is not one metric he hasn't bettered Frank in - football style, trophies, having actually managed in Europe (and won a big European trophy) and to his credit he has done it at clubs with constraints. And I don't get why people (not talking about you) come on here and post about anytime he loses a game of football - he's managing Crystal Palace, it's quite obviously going to happen a fair few times no matter how good a job he is doing. We are 17th in the form table let's not forget.

But for now it's stupid for anyone to be talking about getting rid of Frank, unfortunately that's what the media like to do and certainly a portion of the fans that get suckered into this way of thinking. Need to get to the end of the season, take stock and asses then - things don't look great right now but football has a habit of changing quickly, so not going to write Frank off. But do need to see some improvements on the footballing side for sure....
 
So after the (mainly negative) comments on his pre match presser I listened again expecting to be annoyed.

TF was asked "how was Archie this week?" I have given a precis of what his response below:-

"He's been good; when I watched the game back he was the one who wanted the ball instantly after the mistake and I like the mentality. Anyone who makes a mistake in football or life needs to go back on it and go again"

I'm not sure he's said anything wrong there or anything if I put myself in the shoes of Archie Gray he would be angry at. And Gray was back in the team today.


Again I couldn't see anything wrong with his answer which again I'll précis:-

"I am comfortable and confident to fix it. But it won't just be me, there'll be a lot of good people working together and aligned to get that right. I am 1000% sure that no club has done well if the key people are not aligned. I back myself to be one of those key people. I wasn't here so I don't know why the other coaches were sacked I just know everyone has to be aligned. And we are now"

He also said "10% of fans will always question the head coach no matter which club you are at but there is also a large group who will see the big picture and be loyal. However I want to say to fans that it is a privilege to be part of this fantastic club. And it has a fantastic potential which needs to be fulfilled and to do that there are a lot of stages to go through but I have never worked so hard to do that.."

He was asked about Vic and gave an honest answer:- Great shot stopper but his distribution needs work and development.

Look you are one of the fairest posters I know Steff and I rarely disagree with you (except maybe over Ange :grinning:). But I think you are being unfair to TF with the tone of that post. But fair enough if that's how you feel. What I see is a decent guy who sees himself here for the long term and wants to change the culture at the club to make it fulfil the potential. Isn't that what every manager would say?


I understand my friend, your kind words are appreciated and I echo them in return.
I think the truth here is that we have differing views on the manager (all good) and as such, we are choosing to see different things from his presser on Friday.
You did, indeed, supply some accurate quotes, however I'm sure you'd agree you've left some out too. I'll share a few of those, for greater context (using the same method).

***
Reflecting on Forest, tough result, what have you learnt about your team from the game?

I think it was a bad performance, no two ways about it. I think there were a couple of things in it, it seems like we lacked energy to produce again. That was one element. And I think it was not a particularly good football game for any of the teams until our mistake [opening goal].

How has Archie been this week, he was in the spotlight after Forest?

He's been good. Also, when I watched the game back, I think actually he was the one that wanted the ball instant after the mistake. So I like that mentality, wanting to get on the ball. It's part of it. Everyone who played football at this level or any level made a mistake. You make a mistake in life, you need to go back on it and go again. The beautiful thing about football, especially at this level, and in Tottenham, if you make a mistake, you can be pretty sure there will be a few questions about it. But you, of course, need to be able to manage it and he will do that.

What's your message to the fans, they were key to your success at Brentford?

No, I think there will always be, no matter where you are, I think definitely 10% of the fans will always question the head coach, no matter where they are. And then there will be a big group that are the loyal ones or the ones that can see a little bit bigger perspective.

How much reward do you get from playing out from the back? Vicario has made two mistakes in past few months?

I think it's two completely different situations. I think one is a missed clearance. So that happens. And the other one is a situation where I think it's, you know, for me, that's more on Archie. I've spoken to him. He knows next time it's a one-touch bounce. And there's no situation there. And it's a situation that we have seen a thousand times in this league and across Europe. And we see a thousand times after this game where you play that bounce and you get out. So it's like the same thing. My big philosophy is that you can't play long and direct all the time or can't play short all the time. You need to find a good balance. So it's all about that.

***

Bear in mind he had already been over the Archie moment last week post-match and made the decision to protect Vicario from any responsibility for it (noble in a sense as Vic has been getting pelters). IMV, he could easily have shut down the phishing line of questioning. Instead, he re-explained what he said post-Forest, and then when presented with a question about Vic and passing from the back, went for it again with regards to Archie. My personal take was that he should'v e quickly got out of there and not mentioned the actual mistake again. Especially as in his first quote, he essentially blames that mistake for the ensuing game state.

As for his fan message, well, what can I say?
I actually think it is an issue in general. At the risk of repeating myself, I'll go again...
I think every decent human being believes that in the ideal world, people should be given time to either do a job they've just started, grow into a role, or even both :). That's a principle I think most agree on. Sometimes there are moments when a hire is possibly the wrong fit. That can present itself immediately, or within a few months. Perhaps the hire seemed right and an excellent fit for the position yet once in place, the actual 'fit' doesn't practically work. Perhaps the people who initially made the hire did so with one set of ideas as to what the hire would bring to the situation. Maybe it's like hiring Pepsi's Head of Creative to for Coca-Cola (excuse the shaky analogy). And perhaps however good the Pepsi hire was, their idea of what makes a great beverage is simply culturally counter to Coca-Cola?

I found it quite trite to assert that anyone who is not prepared to essentially sack off two years or so giving him time based on a style that some of us don't like is 'not loyal' or are unable to see a 'bigger perspective'.

Regardless of what I believe, I feel certain he will get this season unless a true disaster strikes. Which is principally fair (even though I feel I know -based on the current evidence- what sort of football we will see.
 
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I find the approach of some of our fanbase staggering at the moment tbh. Talk about delusions of grandeur…

What does that mean mate?
I am not chained to raw win/loss results.
I am chained to a style of play that I want to see us aim for.
If Frank can deliver that, fantastic.
As of now, I am not seeing evidence he wants to produce that style of play.
That's it.
If that is a delusion of grandeur my friend, then yes, I suppose I am guilty...but I love this club not because it's the 'winningest' club in football, but because it was always one of the most beautiful, one which has historically produced artists, geniuses, the odd cult-hero comedian, and entertainment, with some genuine glory along the way. Cue Danny's quote...;)🩵🩵🩵
 
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