The General Transfer Rumours and Speculation Thread

[ricky2tricky4city]

Bakambu is someone we should look at . He's had a very effective season (ironically very much helped by Soldado).
Showing good quality in a top European league.

 

[quo]

The way I look at the squad Carroll and Mason fill a different role than Bentaleb. You build up and contain play with them, they are creative players not imposing defensive units. In my mind they are equally useful, Carroll has slightly neater passing and Mason is a little better "box to boxing".

The biggest concern with Mason are his injuries, with Bentaleb his mentality (speculation), and Carroll I can't find any issue with atm. They are our players though, and they are good enough.

These guys are our foundation and what we build from, the ones who should not be sold unless they request so. They can show the way for our future prospects, Kane is becoming a superstar but Mason and Carroll embodies what building a team means when younger prospects might have a rough patch and start doubting themselves.

Hopefully they will all rise to another level next season. Having all these guys from our own academy playing in lilywhite is just awesome, and I doubt any of them have Adebayor-inflated wages.

People seem to forget how important Fletcher and Park where for ManU, or better yet take a quick look att the treble winning side in 99 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1998–99_Manchester_United_F.C._season under squad statistics. Blomquist 29(9), Brown 16(5), Butt 34(14) apps etc, that's how we can compete on several fronts.

 

[rosenthal]

It comes a point where they have to be good enough or sold so that they don't block the path of the next generation.
Far more exciting Harry Winks already held back due to lack of game time. Ball, Winks, Onomah, Pritchard.
Getting money back on an academy product is also a success - Caulker, Livermore, Townsend, they are all sunshine stories for our academy

 

[quo]

Indeed sunshine stories, all England internationals at one point. According to transfermarkt we recieved 9 + 7 + 15 million € for them. Makes me wonder how big chunk of our revenue the academy actually brings to the table, every time one of our graduates are sold we recieve 5% of that transaction fee to boot if I'm not mistaken.

 

[Gutter Boy]

It comes a point where they have to be good enough or sold so that they don't block the path of the next generation.
Far more exciting Harry Winks already held back due to lack of game time. Ball, Winks, Onomah, Pritchard.
Getting money back on an academy product is also a success - Caulker, Livermore, Townsend, they are all sunshine stories for our academy

This is the approach I'm keen on

I'd definitely support:
- Carroll being released and Winks being promoted to 5th CM
- 2CV being promoted to 4th CB (i.e. Fazio not being replaced)
- Chadli being sold and not replaced to give more time to Onomah and Pritchard

It's more the unnecessary churn of basically the 4 players who were injured last season, and therefore didn't contribute as much as they normally would - Bentaleb, Njie, Mason and Son - that I'm resistant about.

Personally I'm not convinced by either Ball and Ward (who is our other academy player who becomes overage this summer), and can see them being this summer's Hall/Fredericks/McEvoy/Coulthirst

 

[mudshark]

This is the approach I'm keen on

I'd definitely support:
- Carroll being released and Winks being promoted to 5th CM
- 2CV being promoted to 4th CB (i.e. Fazio not being replaced)
- Chadli being sold and not replaced to give more time to Onomah and Pritchard

It's more the unnecessary churn of basically the 4 players who were injured last season, and therefore didn't contribute as much as they normally would - Bentaleb, Njie, Mason and Son - that I'm resistant about.

Personally I'm not convinced by either Ball and Ward (who is our other academy player who becomes overage this summer), and can see them being this summer's Hall/Fredericks/McEvoy/Coulthirst

Don't you think he'd benefit more from a loan spell or two, rather than cooling his heels as a 4th-choice reserve?

 

[Gutter Boy]

Don't you think he'd benefit more from a loan spell or two, rather than cooling his heels as a 4th-choice reserve?

I'd rather he was trained by Poch and integrated into the squad. Got to learn from Alder, Verts and Wimmer, rather than some championship cloggers.

He should get sufficient time in early round LC, FAC and CL rounds.

I'm still not convinced Poch values loans as anything other than a shop window for players he doesn't see having a future (Pritchard and Oduwa will perhaps be a test of this).

 

[Finney Is Back]

This is the approach I'm keen on

I'd definitely support:
- Carroll being released and Winks being promoted to 5th CM
- 2CV being promoted to 4th CB (i.e. Fazio not being replaced)
- Chadli being sold and not replaced to give more time to Onomah and Pritchard

It's more the unnecessary churn of basically the 4 players who were injured last season, and therefore didn't contribute as much as they normally would - Bentaleb, Njie, Mason and Son - that I'm resistant about.

Personally I'm not convinced by either Ball and Ward (who is our other academy player who becomes overage this summer), and can see them being this summer's Hall/Fredericks/McEvoy/Coulthirst

Can I ask what has convinced you about Winks and Carter Vickers compared to Ball and Ward who you are unconvinced by?

 

[Gutter Boy]

Can I ask what has convinced you about Winks and Carter Vickers compared to Ball and Ward who you are unconvinced by?

In a word - cultured

Winks looks a beautiful and thoughtful passer of the ball. Like Carroll but with spunk. In contrast the Rotherham fan I play with says Ward is a good athletic high-energy player, but plays with his head down and lacks awareness. More a Jenas than an Alli.

In terms of the CBs again, Ball is apparently more of a traditional meat and 2 veg Caulker type, whereas everyone says 2CV has a touch of King about.

And also - Poch still hasn't yet loaned out a player who has still been here after the next window. He made a point of naming Winks, Onomah and McGee in the first team squad (and took 2CV on EL trips once Fazio had left), whereas Ball and Ward have always seemed at arm's length (considering they are a couple of years older too)

All second hand info, as Winks is the only one I've seen play in the flesh.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

I find this talk quite interesting so will add my two pence!

Given Dembele's, Lamela's, Dier's, Walker's and Rose's improvement this season, not to mention the whole team ethic that has occurred, I just don't get how anyone can say with any true level of confidence that Mason, Carrol, N'Jie and any other player should or should not be sold/traded/upgraded. People were saying that we should sell Dembele, because although he had potential, he would never fulfil it. I am a Mason fan, and no doubt he has a job on his hands to win back his place but I'm not convinced that this is beyond him.

I also don't subscribe to the theory that getting in 5 players will be too much and will mess up the harmony in the squad. What this season has shown is that we have avery strong first XI but we don't have as strong a squad to compete fully in the cup competitions and Europe, meaning that Poch did have to prioritise some competitions over others. With increased money from TV and hopefully CL, we should be able to do that and 5 extra squad players could be just what we need. However, Poch knows best, and I am sure that we will back him in the market and get the right players. To have someone like N'Jie could be like having a new player given the limited time that he has played.

I think we would benefit from a striker, some competition for Dier, a backup goalkeeper (as I agree with Dubai that from a financial perspective, now may be the right time to cash in) and another midfielder. Some of those positions can be filled by the academy, but I do think that we could benefit from a real leader. Someone that our youngsters will be in awe of and will learn from.

The most important point though, is that I think every single player in this team has the capacity to play better. Learning how to grind out a 1-0, having players that make a difference when coming off the bench and also having the ability to play with two strikers will mix things up and mean that we can get the extra points that will mean a league title. Ultimately Poch will decide, but in my mind the most important signing that we can make this summer is Poch himself. He is instrumental for our team and it is obvious that a lot of these players have a great loyalty to the man.

 

[Glenda's Legs]

but in my mind the most important signing that we can make this summer is Poch himself. He is instrumental for our team and it is obvious that a lot of these players have a great loyalty to the man.

Agree with the whole post, but especially the extract above. I can't see any reason why we would not be able to agree a new attractive and rewarding deal for Poch. It's vital that we do. It could also be that what happens with Poch is a factor in players like Eriksen and Jan putting pen to paper.

 

[Cochise]

Personally, I like the idea of having a fairly streamlined squad to allow for youth development. Having around 20 senior players on the books would probably be optimal in that respect.

The examples would be having Vertonghen, Alderweireld and Wimmer backed up by CCV and Dier. Buying another CM to compete with Dembele and Dier with Ball and Winks being the backups after that (not to mention that Alli could also fall back into the CM if required). I'm not sure about the attacking quartet, as I think we are probably quite heavy there atm, though I like the idea of us signing another striker and another attacking midfielder (somone that could change games for us).

 

[Finney Is Back]

In a word - cultured

Winks looks a beautiful and thoughtful passer of the ball. Like Carroll but with spunk. In contrast the Rotherham fan I play with says Ward is a good athletic high-energy player, but plays with his head down and lacks awareness. More a Jenas than an Alli.

In terms of the CBs again, Ball is apparently more of a traditional meat and 2 veg Caulker type, whereas everyone says 2CV has a touch of King about.

And also - Poch still hasn't yet loaned out a player who has still been here after the next window. He made a point of naming Winks, Onomah and McGee in the first team squad (and took 2CV on EL trips once Fazio had left), whereas Ball and Ward have always seemed at arm's length (considering they are a couple of years older too)

All second hand info, as Winks is the only one I've seen play in the flesh.

Fair enough, thanks for the clarification. Firstly I would be hesitant in judging players when comparing player performances between under 21 level and proper first team football. There is a massive disparity. It is easy to look good playing nice passes when given lots of time, but extremely difficult to do so when afforded no space in a very physical game with the tackles flying in. I would be even more hesitant in using second hand info to judge a player (unless of course that person was a scout who's opinion I respected). Having seen Ward a few times I don't think he will end up making it at Spurs. However to describe him as head down type of player is completely wrong. My thoughts are that Ward will have a decent career in the Championship and it wouldn't even surprise me to see him hold his own in the Premiership if he gets promoted with a team.

Regarding your point about Poch and loans. I don't think you can judge that yet as the sample size is too small. It isn't just about giving a player any loan, it is about getting them the right loan. Your statement about Poch still not having loaned a player who is still here after the next window is also not true. Remember that Pochettino loaned Pritchard out to Brentford last season, but then had him in our first team squad at the start of this season. He also had Tom Carroll at Swansea last season and then brought him into our squad this season.

 

[glasgowspur]

In a word - cultured

Winks looks a beautiful and thoughtful passer of the ball. Like Carroll but with spunk. In contrast the Rotherham fan I play with says Ward is a good athletic high-energy player, but plays with his head down and lacks awareness. More a Jenas than an Alli.

In terms of the CBs again, Ball is apparently more of a traditional meat and 2 veg Caulker type, whereas everyone says 2CV has a touch of King about.

And also - Poch still hasn't yet loaned out a player who has still been here after the next window. He made a point of naming Winks, Onomah and McGee in the first team squad (and took 2CV on EL trips once Fazio had left), whereas Ball and Ward have always seemed at arm's length (considering they are a couple of years older too)

All second hand info, as Winks is the only one I've seen play in the flesh.

I've only seen ball once and it was in the old firm game. He looked nothing like caulker, more like Dier to my eye.
In a game played at a frantic pace and with loads of pressure he looked assured, confident and comfortable on the ball.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Personally, I like the idea of having a fairly streamlined squad to allow for youth development. Having around 20 senior players on the books would probably be optimal in that respect.

The examples would be having Vertonghen, Alderweireld and Wimmer backed up by CCV and Dier. Buying another CM to compete with Dembele and Dier with Ball and Winks being the backups after that (not to mention that Alli could also fall back into the CM if required). I'm not sure about the attacking quartet, as I think we are probably quite heavy there atm, though I like the idea of us signing another striker and another attacking midfielder (somone that could change games for us).

I am pretty much with you here.... Kirchoff (if Sunderland are relegated), Boufal and Batshuayi.

Kirchoff covers CM/CH, Boufal covers the attacking midfield positions and Batshuayi covers number 9.
Player ages are 25, 22 and 22. Kirchoff would allow us to keep Dembele in the box to box role if Dier is injured/suspended/rested and would also act as cover at CH. Boufal would allow us to drop Alli into the box to box role is Dembele is injured/suspended/rested. Batshuayi would allow us to give Kane a rest or even drop Kane into the number 10 role for certain games.

 

[Finney Is Back]

I've only seen ball once and it was in the old firm game. He looked nothing like caulker, more like Dier to my eye.
In a game played at a frantic pace and with loads of pressure he looked assured, confident and comfortable on the ball.

That's what I thought as well. Considering he has only just moved from the centre of defence to the holding midfield role I thought he did very well indeed, especially considering the fact that he was stepping up a level in terms of opposition.

 

[Rorschach]

I am pretty much with you here.... Kirchoff (if Sunderland are relegated), Boufal and Batshuayi.

Kirchoff covers CM/CH, Boufal covers the attacking midfield positions and Batshuayi covers number 9.
Player ages are 25, 22 and 22. Kirchoff would allow us to keep Dembele in the box to box role if Dier is injured/suspended/rested and would also act as cover at CH. Boufal would allow us to drop Alli into the box to box role is Dembele is injured/suspended/rested. Batshuayi would allow us to give Kane a rest or even drop Kane into the number 10 role for certain games.

Kirchoff was awful the few times I have seen him play. Desperately slow and a poor reader of the game was my overriding opinion of him. I think we can do better but then again it was only a few games.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Kirchoff was awful the few times I have seen him play. Desperately slow and a poor reader of the game was my overriding opinion of him. I think we can do better but then again it was only a few games.

I thought he was absolutely awful in the game against us (his first game in England) but I think he has been a pretty vital part in Sunderland's defensive improvement since.

 

[Rorschach]

I thought he was absolutely awful in the game against us (his first game in England) but I think he has been a pretty vital part in Sunderland's defensive improvement since.

In the first half of the Arsenal game there last week(?) he was very very bad, and I said as much in the PL thread actually. He did improve in the 2nd half some what. Though as I say, it's probably too small a sample size to base my opinion on really (but I will anyway ).

 

[Kandi1977]

IMO we don't have much depth in some roles, nor the ability to change things up. Against Dortmund I think we saw the result of not having a like for like swap for Dembele and Dier, whilst also seeing a lack of cover for Kane. Carroll and Mason are both capable of covering a couple of positions on the field, but aren't looking like they are going to push any of the first teamers out. It is also true that whilst we have been without N'jie we have had very little on the bench in the shape of an impact sub. Only Chadli with his ability to play as more of a winger off of the left has been able to give us something different.

Ousamane Dembele could be that player. He could also become an undroppable player, giving Poch a headache as to who gets dropped to fit him in.

Imagine if we had 3 Dembeles in the team