*** OMT Spurs v Fiorentina 1st leg ***

[Jordinho]

Probably best not to over-complicate things.

With the right players it gives us the opportunity to go either way on both sides.

 

[braineclipse]

We should go for it but first we must ensure progress in the EL, then we look toward Wembley, aim of the season was to finish in the CL, hence no one cried when Vorm got us knocked out of the FA Cup. So we shouldn't be prioritising CC now, that is just a bonus. Play whoever is fittest for it but the A team needs to play against Fiorentina.

Poch seems to realize that some rotation is in order.

Like I said. 10 games in 30 days if we go through. To just keep saying go for it is a bit naive.

The league cup is more than just a bonus. It's a final at Wembley and a chance for a trophy for the first time in what feels like much too long. A chance for Poch to get a trophy in his first season too.

A manager who neuter's himself by tactical inflexibility is a fudgeing retread.

Are you trying to say or imply or in any way indicate that this might be an apt description of Pochettino?

 

[braineclipse]

Somewhat agree with this. I'd actually throw out a weaker side for the Spam game, just to give us a chance in the other two competitions. We all agreed that the league was fairly unimportant this season anyway, didn't we?

We're in with a real shout for 4th in the league. Just throwing out a weaker side like it's nothing when the two cups could be over by this time next week seems like a less than optimal approach to me. Unless you're talking about relatively small number of rotations for the West Ham game as "throw out a weaker side"?

Rotate a bit for West Ham. Kane in, Eriksen out perhaps? Mason for Paulinho. Dier and Rose in. Or something like that. Then a handful of rotations again against Fiorentina and our best team against Chelsea. Very few players have to play 4 times in 10 days, or even 3 in 7, share the load a bit.

 

[DubaiSpur]

We're in with a real shout for 4th in the league. Just throwing out a weaker side like it's nothing when the two cups could be over by this time next week seems like a less than optimal approach to me. Unless you're talking about relatively small number of rotations for the West Ham game as "throw out a weaker side"?

Rotate a bit for West Ham. Kane in, Eriksen out perhaps? Mason for Paulinho. Dier and Rose in. Or something like that. Then a handful of rotations again against Fiorentina and our best team against Chelsea. Very few players have to play 4 times in 10 days, or even 3 in 7, share the load a bit.

--------------------------------------Lloris--------------------------------------

Walker------------------Dier--------------------------Verts-------------Davies

-------------------------Stambo (if he's fit)--------Paulinho---------------

Townsend------------------------Dembele----------------------------Chadli

--------------------------------------Soldado---------------------------------------



That's sort of what I meant. Saves Eriksen, Kane, Lamela, Bentaleb, Mason, the evidently still recovering Fazio, and Rose from having to play. I don't agree that the West Ham game is all that important in our race for the top four anyway: it seems to me that throwing out a weaker side is exactly the thing to do when we could be out of the cups in a week, given that it surely falls upon us to do everything possible to prevent that eventuality? We can make up the points heading into April and May: GHod knows the league is decidedly unpredictable this year, to say the least. But both our cup ties are one-offs, and logic dictates that the competitions in which we only get one shot are more deserving of a full side than competitions where lost ground can still be recovered with some ease after these deciders have been played.

 

[braineclipse]

--------------------------------------Lloris--------------------------------------

Walker------------------Dier--------------------------Verts-------------Davies

-------------------------Stambo (if he's fit)--------Paulinho---------------

Townsend------------------------Dembele----------------------------Chadli

--------------------------------------Soldado---------------------------------------



That's sort of what I meant. Saves Eriksen, Kane, Lamela, Bentaleb, Mason, the evidently still recovering Fazio, and Rose from having to play. I don't agree that the West Ham game is all that important in our race for the top four anyway: it seems to me that throwing out a weaker side is exactly the thing to do when we could be out of the cups in a week, given that it surely falls upon us to do everything possible to prevent that eventuality? We can make up the points heading into April and May: GHod knows the league is decidedly unpredictable this year, to say the least. But both our cup ties are one-offs, and logic dictates that the competitions in which we only get one shot are more deserving of a full side than competitions where lost ground can still be recovered with some ease after these deciders have been played.

The cup final is a one off. The EL is not a one off at this point in time. We're in the round of 32.

I think it will come down to the last day for 4th. Unless we fall further behind we should remain fairly focused on the league.

I quite like your rotation. I'm not sure resting Kane in the first two of those four games is called for, same with Lamela and Mason (assuming all are fit). Townsend and Soldado did alright against Fiorentina today, let them have another go next week imo.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Re: the EL, true. I meant more in the sense that, if we lose (or even gain a scoreless draw) next week, then we'll go out of the competition: in that sense, it seems like a one-off, in terms of progressing to the next round.

I also agree that it will come down to the last day for fourth - however, I don't think 3 points lost against Spam will necessarily make that much of a difference to that race. Our perceptions on this point differ, that's all. Liverpool, Arsenal, Soton and United will all drop quite a few points heading into the run-in, after all.

 

[alekaras]

Which we'll need several first team players to achieve. Three days before the cup final. What we needed today was a comfortable win, not a draw and an away goal for them.

Poch will have a serious headache before the return leg.

I don't think he will. I think he clearly signaled his intentions with the team he fielded: focus on PL and if our second team can get past this round, then great. If not, at least we've got LC final and a shot at 4th.

 

[alekaras]

True.
IMO it would have made more sense to focus on this leg as CL is difficult either route.
A good result today allows us to play the fringe players in the second leg, who with the carrot of the final would try hard. If things aren't going well then you bring on first choice players and they don't have to play the whole game.

I think too much is being made of our fitness, lack of injury list, getting a result is far more important. However, first half it looked like we we would walk it, poor finishing and running out steam pressing second half probably cost us.

That's the part that I was a bit puzzled with: the squad is super fit, we're fielding players that should be very well rested, their pressing is suffocating in the first 45, and then they run out of steam in the second half??? Something doesn't compute here.

 

[alekaras]

Winning the tournament also gets you into the CL and directly into the group stage I think. We should be able to beat any of the teams left over 2 legs.

Problem is that knock-out competitions are too unpredictable. The in-form team doesn't always go through. One bad game (or a lucky game by the opponent) and we're out. Remember Chelski in 2012? They were dominated in the quarters, semis, and final and still managed to win it.

In the PL one hiccup won't cost us that much and we have a relatively favorable fixture list.

 

[alekaras]

Somewhat agree with this. I'd actually throw out a weaker side for the Spam game, just to give us a chance in the other two competitions. We all agreed that the league was fairly unimportant this season anyway, didn't we?

Yes we did, up until we found ourselves 3 points off fourth with 15 games to go and a decent fixture list, and the team finally playing well and making every game winnable.

 

[scaramanga]

With the right players it gives us the opportunity to go either way on both sides.

I agree that switching it up is a good idea, playing the old style wingers/crossing style for any significant part of our players though simply goes against all available evidence and rational decision making.

 

[milo]

We should go for it but first we must ensure progress in the EL, then we look toward Wembley, aim of the season was to finish in the CL, hence no one cried when Vorm got us knocked out of the FA Cup. So we shouldn't be prioritising CC now, that is just a bonus. Play whoever is fittest for it but the A team needs to play against Fiorentina.

I didn't see many people having CL qualification down as the aim of the season back in August. It is a mark of how well Poch has done that we have travelled so far, so quickly.

 

[milo]

I agree that switching it up is a good idea, playing the old style wingers/crossing style for any significant part of our players though simply goes against all available evidence and rational decision making.

We don't have the players for it anyway, none of our inside forwards are suited to sticking wide and whipping in crosses.

 

[Jurgen the German]

--------------------------------------Lloris--------------------------------------

Walker------------------Dier--------------------------Verts-------------Davies

-------------------------Stambo (if he's fit)--------Paulinho---------------

Townsend------------------------Dembele----------------------------Chadli

--------------------------------------Soldado---------------------------------------



That's sort of what I meant. Saves Eriksen, Kane, Lamela, Bentaleb, Mason, the evidently still recovering Fazio, and Rose from having to play. I don't agree that the West Ham game is all that important in our race for the top four anyway: it seems to me that throwing out a weaker side is exactly the thing to do when we could be out of the cups in a week, given that it surely falls upon us to do everything possible to prevent that eventuality? We can make up the points heading into April and May: GHod knows the league is decidedly unpredictable this year, to say the least. But both our cup ties are one-offs, and logic dictates that the competitions in which we only get one shot are more deserving of a full side than competitions where lost ground can still be recovered with some ease after these deciders have been played.

So basically rest all of our best outfield players for a league game?

 

[braineclipse]

That's the part that I was a bit puzzled with: the squad is super fit, we're fielding players that should be very well rested, their pressing is suffocating in the first 45, and then they run out of steam in the second half??? Something doesn't compute here.

Just speculation, but I wouldn't be surprised if Poch put in some really tough training sessions during our little mini-break and almost used it as a kind of winter break with tons of hard fitness work to set us up for the rest of the season and hopefully see us get a small peak in form for the Chelsea game.

Could also just be that the pitch was probably quite heavy, we used a lot of energy in the first half and Fiorentina are a good side as soon as they got their shape sorted and that they have a lot of good ball players that were quite capable of playing through our pressure.

 

[diego_maradona]

Stambouli hasn't been in a few of the squads recently. I guess he is only really called upon in the absence of Bentaleb. He hasn't featured since Sheff United away.

 

[rxl]

Think we really missed Mason last night, it was very pedestrian in the middle, when he doesn't play you really notice the lack of immediate recycling...
I think Paulinho has to go, he can't play Poch's system.

 

[diego_maradona]

Think we really missed Mason last night, it was very pedestrian in the middle, when he doesn't play you really notice the lack of immediate recycling...
I think Paulinho has to go, he can't play Poch's system.

Thought Paulinho was pretty good in the first half.

 

[rxl]

I think therein lies the problem, his inconsistency hinders the team.

 

[r-u-s-x]

I dotn think little Paul is such a bad player - he is just heartless. Pulls out of at least one 50-50 a game, and plays it massively safe. I want him to do well but just cant see it - think he could do well in a slower league, where are all the goals we were promised as this would hide his poor displays ( just look how Arsenal love Ramsey when he i scoring but hate him otherwise, and to a lesser extent Chadli with us)