• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

glasgowspur said:
If you need a manager to motivate you to turn, never mind win, in the final of the biggest prize in club football then you shouldn't be there.
End of.
Click to expand...

In football things are won and lost on fine details. I don't think the players weren't motivated, though maybe they didn't have confidence in themselves after going a goal down so early vs a team that had for a while up to then been one of the best defences in Europe.

I don't think it's fair to say we lost because "we didn't turn up"...Liverpool, tactically, had our number and we gifted them that advantage very VERY early:(
 
glorygloryeze said:
In football things are won and lost on fine details. I don't think the players weren't motivated, though maybe they didn't have confidence in themselves after going a goal down so early vs a team that had for a while up to then been one of the best defences in Europe.

I don't think it's fair to say we lost because "we didn't turn up"...Liverpool, tactically, had our number and we gifted them that advantage very VERY early:(
Click to expand...

Very true with the fine margins, but much like on Saturday, after an early set back we give up.
 
thfcsteff said:
I see.
How do you explain his trying a new system and signing a more dynamic midfielder? That to me looks like he is trying something new. And the truth? The old guard - some of whom spent the last 24 months spouting off in the press (Rose, Alderweireld, Eriksen) have simply decided they don’t want to (Rose gets a pass as he runs his gonad*s off).

I’m sorry, any players that aren’t getting any “better” after 5 years need to step up their game or leave. If they didn’t like it, get out when they had numerous chances. Instead they stuck around. Not getting any better? Come on mate...only five months ago they had the chance to win the biggest game in club football and didn’t really show up! If they’d played for 30 mins that night like they did the first 30 against Bayern, they’d have won! When will they carry some responsibility for their displays and behaviour?
Click to expand...

Mate, we can agree to disagree, New dynamic midfielder is simply a Dembele replacement/upgrade

How about

- Persisting with a FB ideal without having the players that can execute it?
- After 3+ years not knowing what the best combination of front 2/3 is? (Kane +who?)
- How about still not knowing if Eriksen is a runner, creator, wide, center, forward, deep?
- How about believing that Winks can anchor this midfield at this level consistently

Dele, Eriksen, Lamela, Kane (are you going to accuse Kane of not being committed?) have not improved in 2+ years, neither has Foyth, KWP, Sanchez .. but I guess we just have a bunch of brick, lazy players

Starts to come of as everybody in the world is crazy but me type of defense.
 
glorygloryeze said:
I agree with a lot of this, re player responsibility, though the coach ultimately gets the credit for winning trophies (or not) in most cases. the line of responsibiloity and kudos can be very blurred.

I do take issue with one thing though: out of the 3 you listed only Rose was constantly spouting to the press. It's TOTALLY unfair imo to lump the other two with Rose: they might not have signed a contract or moved on, but they absolutely kept their mouths shut unlike Rose and your re-writing history here to make a point i feel
Click to expand...
Eriksen has hardly kept quiet has he.
 
glasgowspur said:
Eriksen has repeatedly said he's leaving, nothing wrong with that, even batted his eyelashes at certain clubs, but that's OK.
Poch says if I win the biggest trophy in Club (for our club, fudge me spurs winning the CL) I may think that's all I can do here and its forever thrown back at him.
Click to expand...

Mate, Eriksen is a player, Poch is the public representative of our club, there is a difference.
 
Raziel said:
Mate, Eriksen is a player, Poch is the public representative of our club, there is a difference.
Click to expand...
Yeah, exactly, our player, maybe if he concentrated on his current job and not his next possible job we would have some of these trophies poch has failed to win for us.
In fact maybe if he'd spent the summer practising his penalties and not touting himself around Spain we wouldn't have been humiliated against lower division side in the first trophy of the season.
 
thfcsteff said:
First of all, if it is as easy as you say to sort out the old guard, then why do you suppose the man hasn’t done it? You are -by proxy- essentially calling him stupid.
Click to expand...

Well that really is the million dollar question isnt it?

I know you are desperate to refute absolutely any critique of him, but lets get back to basics.

Does the manager, or does the manager not pick the team? (the answer is yes)
Does the manager, or does the manager not have viable alternatives to these players? (again, its yes)

So why indeed, is he still playing them?

Im not calling him stupid, but Id love to know the reasoning behind what appears to be a completely wrong decision.

thfcsteff said:
“Odd theme...free pass...fudge up what he likes...”
Yeah, he DOES have plenty of credit in the bank, and some of us still believe that as long as he wants it, he will get us rising again.
Click to expand...

Then why isnt he already? What is it he is waiting for before getting us to rise again? Because the view I have is things arent getting better, and Ill be damned if I can see the signs of work coming through to get us on the road to recovery as well.

Blind faith is a fools errand. Especially in elite sport.

thfcsteff said:
As for the last bit, run looking for a new bird just because your marriage has hit a sticky patch if that is your DNA (not mine I can assure you) but before you wax lyrical about how “simple” it all is, who could he have picked, and what formation mitigates, 44th minute concessions against the Goons, Olympiakos and Bayern?
Click to expand...

What are you going on about? The alternatives are obvious, if you cant see that then no wonder youre so keen to just sit idly and wait for Poch to work it out.

thfcsteff said:
I have wanted Toby out for over a year (to the sound of crickets until a couple of weeks ago) and Eriksen was another I’d have moved on without. Neither would fudging leave/Levy could not give them away as it would be a poor optic. I think every reasonable supporter expected more from both, especially Eriksen, who has previous for this “loss of form” (happened around his last contract)...
Click to expand...

I agree, I dont think anyone anticipated they would both be so poor. Nobody is arguing that, nice straw man.

The argument is more around - having recognised this poor form - why the hell are they still playing while Lamela/Moura/Alli/Sanchez get splinters?
 
fernadez said:
That wasn't the discussion though. It was whether another manager in exactly the same situation would have got us over the line. Pep, maybe, maybe not, but Mourinho in charge at semi-final/final stage and we'd have won.
Click to expand...
I agree. I think we probably would've won about half of our semi finals and half of our finals.

The problem is that you can't just bring a new manager in to manage you for those games and I'm not sure that Mourinho would've taken over what Pochettino inherited and got us into those positions on the budget that Pochettino had.

Had we brought Mourinho in about 2 years ago then I think it may have worked for that 2 to 3 year timespan that Mourinho seems to have before he completely alienates his players. However I really don't think we could've outsted Poch and installed Mourinho at that point. There would've been uproar.

I'm not sure whether or not Mourinho would do much or not with the current crop. How would he fill the huge void we have at the base of midfield for example?
 
glorygloryeze said:
I agree with a lot of this, re player responsibility, though the coach ultimately gets the credit for winning trophies (or not) in most cases. the line of responsibiloity and kudos can be very blurred.

I do take issue with one thing though: out of the 3 you listed only Rose was constantly spouting to the press. It's TOTALLY unfair imo to lump the other two with Rose: they might not have signed a contract or moved on, but they absolutely kept their mouths shut unlike Rose and your re-writing history here to make a point i feel
Click to expand...

I agree with you re: Toby, and hold my hand up there and say it was unfair of me. Eriksen? Arguably, his "comments" have been the most poisonous of all. I'll double down on that one mate.
 
Raziel said:
Mate, we can agree to disagree, New dynamic midfielder is simply a Dembele replacement/upgrade

How about

- Persisting with a FB ideal without having the players that can execute it?
- After 3+ years not knowing what the best combination of front 2/3 is? (Kane +who?)
- How about still not knowing if Eriksen is a runner, creator, wide, center, forward, deep?
- How about believing that Winks can anchor this midfield at this level consistently


Dele, Eriksen, Lamela, Kane (are you going to accuse Kane of not being committed?) have not improved in 2+ years, neither has Foyth, KWP, Sanchez .. but I guess we just have a bunch of brick, lazy players

Starts to come of as everybody in the world is crazy but me type of defense.
Click to expand...

Indeed, we agree to disagree. I don't see Ndombele as Dembele's replacement personally, only in terms of squad numbers.

To your bullet points.

*you'll have to explain. brick FBs you're saying?
*he absolutely knows that Kane with Alli off him is best, Sonny and Eriksen either side of Alli with all switching/being fluid in a front four.
*errr, I think he sees Eriksen as the playmaker from a couple of different areas?
*Winks in a diamond gets overrun, we agree on that. I would argue he has played there a half dozen games at most.

I said NOTHING about Dele or Lamela not being committed. If you show me where I did, an apology will be forthcoming. Kane? Don't know what you're on about. Foyth and Sanchez haven't improved? Errr, Foyth was a CHILD when he came to us and has absolutely improved, you're out of it there mate. Davo? Very unlucky IMO and deserves to be playing ahead of Alderweireld if only so as he can continue to progress. KWP? He would've been sold had we got another RB. He is not good enough for us.

You can spin it as whatever you want, the bottom line is, a few players are NOT doing what they're paid to do and NOT being professional IMO. Agree to disagree is probably the best course of action for us mate.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
I know you are desperate to refute absolutely any critique of him, but lets get back to basics.
Click to expand...


What a foolish comment that shows how little you pay attention to anything unless it fits your narrative.

I thought about replying to all, but frankly, I don't see the point (your "straw man" comment was the capper). You won't change, you're right!

Just ONE question for you. If it is so obvious, what formation mitigates three 44th minute concessions when in leading/strong positions? Go on. Indulge me. Unless you don't understand my point, which is that NO fudging "formation" can eradicate this sort of pressure-induced brainfart. Each concession was not down to a square peg in round hole or anything other than a highly-paid professional not doing the simple thing and clearing the ball. If you DO have the gold-plated alternative and answer, don't worry about telling me, tell Poch! He NEEDS you and your wisdom!!!!!
 
Last edited:
One obvious quick solution that no one is talking about is what Ferguson regularly used to do.
He'd change the coaching staff. They were the ones running training etc,
Ferguson had 7 different assistant manager over the years.

The players would have new training. Not the same things they've been doing for 5 years..
There would be new voices etc

It's not as if Poch does much himself coaching wise. He reportedly doesn't even go to training anymore (watching from cameras in his office)
 
Modric THFC said:
One obvious quick solution that no one is talking about is what Ferguson regularly used to do.
He'd change the coaching staff. They were the ones running training etc,
Ferguson had 7 different assistant manager over the years.

The players would have new training. Not the same things they've been doing for 5 years..
There would be new voices etc

It's not as if Poch does much himself coaching wise. He reportedly doesn't even go to training anymore (watching from cameras in his office)
Click to expand...

From what I understand he see the immediate coaching staff as family so it's a non starter. It has been discussed on here before with most agreeing it would be a good solution, but probably a non-starter.
 
Modric THFC said:
One obvious quick solution that no one is talking about is what Ferguson regularly used to do.
He'd change the coaching staff. They were the ones running training etc,
Ferguson had 7 different assistant manager over the years.

The players would have new training. Not the same things they've been doing for 5 years..
There would be new voices etc

It's not as if Poch does much himself coaching wise. He reportedly doesn't even go to training anymore (watching from cameras in his office)
Click to expand...

I’m not saying there is no value in it, but post hoc fallacy, Fergie had to replace assistants as they kept getting manager jobs.
 
thfcsteff said:
I agree with you re: Toby, and hold my hand up there and say it was unfair of me. Eriksen? Arguably, his "comments" have been the most poisonous of all. I'll double down on that one mate.
Click to expand...

Interesting. Why do you say that? Surely nowhere near as bad as Rose giving that interview, no??
 
Modric THFC said:
One obvious quick solution that no one is talking about is what Ferguson regularly used to do.
He'd change the coaching staff. They were the ones running training etc,
Ferguson had 7 different assistant manager over the years.

The players would have new training. Not the same things they've been doing for 5 years..
There would be new voices etc

It's not as if Poch does much himself coaching wise. He reportedly doesn't even go to training anymore (watching from cameras in his office)
Click to expand...

I agree. He should bring in new blood there.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back