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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

ricky2tricky4city said:
See above......La Celso was at the Copa....after tournament 2 weeks break ...equals the above.
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Incorrect.

Lo Celso being at the Copa would have meant he could have returned at the same time Foryth did.

Foryth was back in training and played for us in July 21st. Lo Celso did not join us until the August 8th. That is three additional weeks of fitness training and squad welcoming he could have had. Instead Levy plays silly buggers and he joins to late to have a pre season and now he's had an aborted start to our season.

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Bishop said:
Incorrect.

Lo Celso being at the Copa would have meant he could have returned at the same time Foryth did.

Foryth was back in training and played for us in July 21st. Lo Celso did not join us until the August 8th. That is three additional weeks of fitness training and squad welcoming he could have had. Instead Levy plays silly buggers and he joins to late to have a pre season and now he's had an aborted start to our season.

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Didn’t Foyth choose to cut short his holiday (in fact, his honeymoon) to get back to pre season earlier than he technically was obliged to?
 
Bishop said:
Incorrect.

Lo Celso being at the Copa would have meant he could have returned at the same time Foryth did.

Foryth was back in training and played for us in July 21st. Lo Celso did not join us until the August 8th. That is three additional weeks of fitness training and squad welcoming he could have had. Instead Levy plays silly buggers and he joins to late to have a pre season and now he's had an aborted start to our season.

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It’s hardly Levy’s fault he got injured on international duty is it? Lo Celso had an injury in the summer, came in, and was always going to take some time to ramp up. That he got injured was just bad luck.
 
Bishop said:
Incorrect.

Lo Celso being at the Copa would have meant he could have returned at the same time Foryth did.

Foryth was back in training and played for us in July 21st. Lo Celso did not join us until the August 8th. That is three additional weeks of fitness training and squad welcoming he could have had. Instead Levy plays silly buggers and he joins to late to have a pre season and now he's had an aborted start to our season.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Fapatalk
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Foyth cut his post copa-america break short, no reason to think Lo Celso would have done the same
 
Bishop said:
Incorrect.

Lo Celso being at the Copa would have meant he could have returned at the same time Foryth did.

Foryth was back in training and played for us in July 21st. Lo Celso did not join us until the August 8th. That is three additional weeks of fitness training and squad welcoming he could have had. Instead Levy plays silly buggers and he joins to late to have a pre season and now he's had an aborted start to our season.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Fapatalk
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What you also got to remember is Lo Celso’s summer schedule would have been based on Betis, even if we signed him earlier there is every chance he would have been sent back on holiday for a couple of weeks, the issue here really is he had hardly played for us, so should not have been on international duty to begin with.
 
Bishop said:
I don't see the confusion. We had another starting RB in Aurier in the squad along with a backup in KWP and potentially Foryth as well.

This is a stupid debate we haven't left ourselves short in this area at all, we were in fact over stocked. It's not even an issue of quality as Trippier was himself awful defensively.

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Aurier = unreliable (see yesterday and endless occasions last season) and wants to leave.

KWP = seems that he is not trusted by Poch and relatively inexperienced.

Foyth = a CB by trade (and one prone to errors) with no PL experience at RB.

Let’s face it; none of them are Walker - or even Trippier.

Jenas’s point still makes sense. We didn’t have a tried and tested RB and we failed to buy one.
 
Mikey10 said:
Aurier = unreliable (see yesterday and endless occasions last season) and wants to leave.

KWP = seems that he is not trusted by Poch and relatively inexperienced.

Foyth = a CB by trade (and one prone to errors) with no PL experience at RB.

Let’s face it; none of them are Walker - or even Trippier.

Jenas’s point still makes sense. We didn’t have a tried and tested RB and we failed to buy one.
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It appears Aurier was welcome to leave as well? It makes me wonder whether a new recruit was planned if he did leave or of we were ok to go with KWP and Foyth.....Dier/Sissoko at a push

I think Foyth was genuinely lined up to start the season at RB but of course that was all scuppered by his injury in the final friendly.
 
Mikey10 said:
Aurier = unreliable (see yesterday and endless occasions last season) and wants to leave.

KWP = seems that he is not trusted by Poch and relatively inexperienced.

Foyth = a CB by trade (and one prone to errors) with no PL experience at RB.

Let’s face it; none of them are Walker - or even Trippier.

Jenas’s point still makes sense. We didn’t have a tried and tested RB and we failed to buy one.
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Trippier was no more reliable than Aurier. My issue is if we didn't sell Trippier you can bet there wouldn't be any debate about replacing him with a quality player in the media.

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Mikey10 said:
Aurier = unreliable (see yesterday and endless occasions last season) and wants to leave.

KWP = seems that he is not trusted by Poch and relatively inexperienced.

Foyth = a CB by trade (and one prone to errors) with no PL experience at RB.

Let’s face it; none of them are Walker - or even Trippier.

Jenas’s point still makes sense. We didn’t have a tried and tested RB and we failed to buy one.
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Compared to Trippier at his best, sure I would have him over any of our current options.

Compared to Trippier last season, I don't think he was a clear improvement over any of those players.
 
braineclipse said:
Compared to Trippier at his best, sure I would have him over any of our current options.

Compared to Trippier last season, I don't think he was a clear improvement over any of those players.
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Trippier at his best was an awesome crosser of the ball, early whipped in balls with stunning accuracy.

He was however always a defensive liability. Anyone with a little pace or trickery had him bamboozled. So no I don't think this is a valid criticism.

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Bishop said:
Trippier at his best was an awesome crosser of the ball, early whipped in balls with stunning accuracy.

He was however always a defensive liability. Anyone with a little pace or trickery had him bamboozled. So no I don't think this is a valid criticism.

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Two issues, agree Trippier left to his own devices was a mess defensively. I watch a fair amount of AM and the system and orders cover for that issue.

The big issue for me with Poch and FB's is we went from a prime Rose/Walker to a lesser version of Rose +mediocre RB options and we haven't adapted, we haven't decided to change the roles of FB's or the midfield we are in some ways trying to do more with worse players and it doesn't work. IF you have great FB's, ok, do the overlap and overload, but if you don't then focus on the FB's doing a good job defensively and build your width/creativity from somewhere else.

Otherwise it looks like you fluked on to a model with two players in their prime, you were able to carry it a little bit longer because Trippier & Davies played the best season of their life and you still think you can stick any player in there and it will work.
 
Raziel said:
The big issue for me with Poch and FB's is we went from a prime Rose/Walker to a lesser version ...and we haven't adapted, we haven't decided to change the roles of FB's or the midfield ...IF you have great FB's, ok, do the overlap and overload, but if you don't then focus on the FB's doing a good job defensively and build your width/creativity from somewhere else.

Otherwise it looks like Poch fluked on to a model with two players in their prime... you still think you can stick any player in there and it will work.
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Amen. Preach. Word. This.
It always seemed like a silly expectation, to expect a player to be both a major attacking force, often the furthest forward, whilst being expected to defend soundly. Surely across 10 outfield players there is a system which better spreads the workload.
 
Raziel said:
Two issues, agree Trippier left to his own devices was a mess defensively. I watch a fair amount of AM and the system and orders cover for that issue.

The big issue for me with Poch and FB's is we went from a prime Rose/Walker to a lesser version of Rose +mediocre RB options and we haven't adapted, we haven't decided to change the roles of FB's or the midfield we are in some ways trying to do more with worse players and it doesn't work. IF you have great FB's, ok, do the overlap and overload, but if you don't then focus on the FB's doing a good job defensively and build your width/creativity from somewhere else.

Otherwise it looks like you fluked on to a model with two players in their prime, you were able to carry it a little bit longer because Trippier & Davies played the best season of their life and you still think you can stick any player in there and it will work.
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I think this coincides with losing Dier and Wanyama to injuries for the last 2 years. Dier particularly would be the one to drop in to the back line when Walker and Rose bombed on.
 
Gazza Dazzla said:
I think this coincides with losing Dier and Wanyama to injuries for the last 2 years. Dier particularly would be the one to drop in to the back line when Walker and Rose bombed on.
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Agreed. It allowed jan and Toby to push a little wider either to initiate attacks or deliver angled balls but also positioned to be well placed if we were countered.

The other factor is even if we had left ourselves a bit short Rose BUT especially Walker had amazing powers of recovery. I dont see that in Aurier Davies etc.

I'm a bit tinkled about the Leicester RB as we were heavily linked with him when he was at Nice.

I'm only guessing but my hunch is that most of the best teams have high class all round FB's?? ie its a position thats not given enough credit in how important it is.
 
Why are we persisting with this fudging diamond?!! Which player plays better due to us playing a diamond? Maybe Lamela. No one else looks like they have a fudging clue what's expected of them.
I never want to see Aurier in a spurs shirt again.
 
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