• Dear Guest, Please note that adult content is not permitted on this forum. We have had our Google ads disabled at times due to some posts that were found from some time ago. Please do not post adult content and if you see any already on the forum, please report the post so that we can deal with it. Adult content is allowed in the glory hole - you will have to request permission to access it. Thanks, scara

Bender

Status
Not open for further replies.
what was Tuchel expected to say though. Standard response but if Bender wants to go and doesnt want to extend his contract then Dortmund will sell. For the right price of course.
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
I agree that Bender is better defensively, but he is worse offensively. Comparing on Schneiderlin, Matic, Bentaleb, Bender and Mason on Squaka, Mason has higher forward passes, more total passes, more successful passes, higher pass completion, more key passes, more assists and more chances created on average per game. I haven't seen much of Bender and I know that stats do not tell the whole story. Where Mason is the worst out of this lot is in successful take ons and interceptions. Incidentally, both him and Bentaleb have similar stats on defensive errors and errors leading to goals, which in my mind is what we need to work on. Reducing these errors, lapses in concentration or whatever is causing them is what needs to be done. I think both are able to improve in this regard.

Getting someone like Bender would increase options, but I am not sure that it will definitively lead to better results. My pressing concern is someone to offer Kane competition as I just think this is the one position where clearly there is not any real competition for that place.
Click to expand...
In my humble opinion you are over simplifying a problem using stats and I disagree with your conclusion to a certain extent. We conceded a lot of goals last season, one of the worse records in the top half of the table . Posters having different opinions as to why that is. My opinion is because our midfield did not do enough to protect the back 4 and our fullbacks especially walker struggled to get back from offensive positions. On the other hand we scored a lot of goals. We need a defensive midfielder like bender, tough tackling, good interceptor to improve our goals against column. How he does offensively is neither here nor there imo. If he can get the ball and play it short to our more creative midfielders then that's what we want surely. It also appears from the video he can play the occasional, accurate long pass- even better. We must get our defence sorted if we are going to make progress this imo is an absolute priority. It is a big ask to simply rely on our 2 defensive midfielders to cut out the errors especially as one is only 20 and they play in an area where mistakes can be unforgiving -see mason against Soton.

Now going back to the striker , I agree we also need more options up front to complement Kane and to give us something different where Kane is not having a good game. But that is not about providing competition for him.
 
I originally wanted us to get Kramer, but having read up and watched a small amount on both players I'm actually more keen on us signing Bender. His level of experience plus what he does for a team is something we have been crying out for and whilst Kramer is a good player I just think that the defensive qualities of Bender are what we need. I wouldn't be against us signing Kramer though, just saying that I would prefer Bender.
 
I'm a big advocate of only signing players who improve the first 11, hence why I've been anti McCarthy as he isn't better than we have

However the Germans are a different breed of player with ability and a mentality to match. Both Kramer and Bender have that something about them that we need and would've a solid upgrade
 
Cochise said:
I originally wanted us to get Kramer, but having read up and watched a small amount on both players I'm actually more keen on us signing Bender. His level of experience plus what he does for a team is something we have been crying out for and whilst Kramer is a good player I just think that the defensive qualities of Bender are what we need. I wouldn't be against us signing Kramer though, just saying that I would prefer Bender.
Click to expand...

Can we have both... plllleeeeaaaaasssssseeeee??
 
Robspur12 said:
In my humble opinion you are over simplifying a problem using stats and I disagree with your conclusion to a certain extent. We conceded a lot of goals last season, one of the worse records in the top half of the table . Posters having different opinions as to why that is. My opinion is because our midfield did not do enough to protect the back 4 and our fullbacks especially walker struggled to get back from offensive positions. On the other hand we scored a lot of goals. We need a defensive midfielder like bender, tough tackling, good interceptor to improve our goals against column. How he does offensively is neither here nor there imo. If he can get the ball and play it short to our more creative midfielders then that's what we want surely. It also appears from the video he can play the occasional, accurate long pass- even better. We must get our defence sorted if we are going to make progress this imo is an absolute priority. It is a big ask to simply rely on our 2 defensive midfielders to cut out the errors especially as one is only 20 and they play in an area where mistakes can be unforgiving -see mason against Soton.

Now going back to the striker , I agree we also need more options up front to complement Kane and to give us something different where Kane is not having a good game. But that is not about providing competition for him.
Click to expand...

Granted, I'm using stats to suit my agenda, but that was only because stats were brought up before showing how much better Bender was. The only point I am making really is that I am in the school of thought that says Mason is not the weak link. He provides an offensive spark (not the only one) that if we take him out of the team with someone with more of a defensive mindset, we may lost out a bit offensively as well making us slower in our build up or counter attack.
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
Granted, I'm using stats to suit my agenda, but that was only because stats were brought up before showing how much better Bender was. The only point I am making really is that I am in the school of thought that says Mason is not the weak link. He provides an offensive spark (not the only one) that if we take him out of the team with someone with more of a defensive mindset, we may lost out a bit offensively as well making us slower in our build up or counter attack.
Click to expand...

Simple solution: play him at #10, his best position and one that I think he'll absolutely shine in, if given a chance. Rotate him with Eriksen, or perhaps shift Eriksen out left and put Mason in the middle (when the need for a left-sided forward isn't as great, that is).

We could then have Mason and the big, tough DM in the same side. No toughie. :)
 
DubaiSpur said:
Simple solution: play him at #10, his best position and one that I think he'll absolutely shine in, if given a chance. Rotate him with Eriksen, or perhaps shift Eriksen out left and put Mason in the middle (when the need for a left-sided forward isn't as great, that is).

We could then have Mason and the big, tough DM in the same side. No toughie. :)
Click to expand...

Ha! Simples.......
 
Apparently Tuchel prefers Weigl to Bender. But that's from one article I read, so take it with a grain of salt.
 
IIRC he used the term "very important to the squad". Is he now deemed a squad player and not first XI?? If he's been relegated to the bench this could either be where he walks or fights for his spot.
 
Robspur12 said:
In my humble opinion you are over simplifying a problem using stats and I disagree with your conclusion to a certain extent. We conceded a lot of goals last season, one of the worse records in the top half of the table . Posters having different opinions as to why that is. My opinion is because our midfield did not do enough to protect the back 4 and our fullbacks especially walker struggled to get back from offensive positions. On the other hand we scored a lot of goals. We need a defensive midfielder like bender, tough tackling, good interceptor to improve our goals against column. How he does offensively is neither here nor there imo. If he can get the ball and play it short to our more creative midfielders then that's what we want surely. It also appears from the video he can play the occasional, accurate long pass- even better. We must get our defence sorted if we are going to make progress this imo is an absolute priority. It is a big ask to simply rely on our 2 defensive midfielders to cut out the errors especially as one is only 20 and they play in an area where mistakes can be unforgiving -see mason against Soton.

Now going back to the striker , I agree we also need more options up front to complement Kane and to give us something different where Kane is not having a good game. But that is not about providing competition for him.
Click to expand...

Spot on Rob. If he's good enough for a team that won the German double just a few years ago and got to the CL final two years and is actually available and would like to play for us then surely we have to go for him? I also agree that our centre mid fielders did not do enough to protect the back four, we'd be playing a dangerous game to go into this season with the same two and just expect our brick hot striker, plus Eriksen and Chadli to outscore everyone for us. We need an upgrade on Mason. Bentaleb has more ability and you can cut him some slack for his defensive shortcomings, provided he improves of course.
 
Nigeyman said:
Just for the record I detest debating with you Milo anyway....

My idea of us being inflexible is clearly not having a variety of options in our central midfield..in my ideal world we would have options depending on the opposition... now in cm I would like us to have a box to box player...Mason, Dembele & Alli....check. A passer, tempo setter, conductor if you will....Bentaleb & Carrol....check, A no 10 Eriksen, Dembele...check, But when it comes to snuffing out an opponents more technically gifted midfield we have no enforcer/ anchor type player...we badly need one, not having an acomplished DM in your squad is asking for trouble.

Its one of the reasons that will also keep stopping the woolwich lot winning major titles...anyway dont want to talk about them.

Poch dealt with the hand he was given last season but now is the time for him to build HIS squad to show us HIS vision...by and large we have cleared the decks so I await with baited breath this midfield signing.

If we rigidly stick to the same style all season we will not achieve anyone of note. I would say the next cm signing is absoluteness essential we get it right.
Click to expand...

Completely agree. We have to be flexible and have multiple options. Our midfield at the moment is not strong enough compared to the top 4.
 
Jurgen the German said:
He'd be better than Mason in just about every aspect of the game IMO and most importantly, make us more secure defensively.
Click to expand...

I think that is harsh and . He will be better defensively but will not be better in an attacking sense. Just because someone is in a team that was part of the double winning team and in the CL final is also not the be all and end all. Kagawa proves that! Indeed he was not really an integral figure for the team playing 24 times in the league and not starting in the final.
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
I think that is harsh and . He will be better defensively but will not be better in an attacking sense. Just because someone is in a team that was part of the double winning team and in the CL final is also not the be all and end all. Kagawa proves that! Indeed he was not really an integral figure for the team playing 24 times in the league and not starting in the final.
Click to expand...

To be honest I am not too bothered if he is better in a attacking sense then Mason, what I do think is that Mason is a weak link in our side especially in the defensive part of his game. We have to upgrade that weakness and from what I have seen/read about Bender his seems to fit the bill.

Lets keep Mason by all means but as a squad player at the moment.
 
parklane1 said:
To be honest I am not too bothered if he is better in a attacking sense then Mason, what I do think is that Mason is a weak link in our side especially in the defensive part of his game. We have to upgrade that weakness and from what I have seen/read about Bender his seems to fit the bill.

Lets keep Mason by all means but as a squad player at the moment.
Click to expand...

We will have to agree to disagree as I don't think Mason is the weak link! ;) IMO, Mason recycles the ball better than most and is one of the reasons why we have scored as many as we have, but I'm sure you won't agree with me on that either! We're talking about a player that has managed to get himself an England call up in his first full season in the EPL. Not only that, but he has also managed to impress one of the best english midfielders of our generation.
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
We will have to agree to disagree as I don't think Mason is the weak link! ;) IMO, Mason recycles the ball better than most and is one of the reasons why we have scored as many as we have, but I'm sure you won't agree with me on that either! We're talking about a player that has managed to get himself an England call up in his first full season in the EPL. Not only that, but he has also managed to impress one of the best english midfielders of our generation.
Click to expand...

Stop! Hammer time and I have nothing against Mason except that he has no defensive awareness, we are wide open in CM and we need to upgrade one of the two in there. Now I believe the one with the most potential is Bentaleb so he has to remain, Mason may turn out to be a very good player but at the moment we need something different alongside Bentaleb.

As for getting a England call up I am chuffed for the kid but lets not get carried away that getting picked to play for a average England team is that much.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back